DH and I have completely different approaches to parenting. I don't know how we live like this.

[Florencenotflo]

Disclaimer to say that this is probably going to be a load of word vomit. I'm just so unhappy and confused I really don't know what to do.

But the problem is, we are on completely different wavelengths when it comes to parenting. I was brought up with lovely but bordering on neglectful parenting. I always thought they made us independent but looking back, too much responsibility was put on me as a child because of different things. They were very loving and genuinely did the best they could. I knew I didn't want to replicate their parenting with my own kids, but ultimately me and my brother turned out ok.

DH on the other hand I think had a very heavy handed upbringing. His dad worked away a lot but when he came back he was the ultimate authoritarian parent. DH remembers having a games console smashed in front of him as a 12/13 year old for not keeping his room tidy enough. FIL has children from a previous marriage that don't speak to him. FIL had a lot of counselling years ago because of mental health problems and has apologised profusely for the way he was. He has also tried to build bridges with his other children. But DH idolises his dad, ironically FIL is the best grandad to our kids and is the softest/calmest person I know.

So, the crux of the matter. We have a 7 year old and a nearly 4 year old. DH (I think) has completely unrealistic expectations of them, in terms of behaviour, tidiness, attitude etc. he says I'm too soft, I think he's too harsh and completely out of touch with normal kid behaviour. He's never tolerated the whinging or moaning that kids do, any expression of an opinion is often labelled as 'ungratefulness'. I've realised that any kind of day out that involves things like waiting or queuing (Legoland for example) usually end badly with DH moaning about how ungrateful they are. I think they are normal, tired, hot, worn out etc. and a degree of moaning is to be expected, it's for us to manage and accommodate that surely?

We've plodded along this long without many issues, but now our 7 year old is full of attitude (which I think is normal) she's having problems with friends and is nervous about moving up to junior school. I'm trying to teach her better ways of communicating how she's feeling and encouraging her to tell us what she needs. Where as DH won't stand for the attitude and thinks threatening to 'smash up' toys or tablets will resolve the issue. Actually, all it's doing is making dd dislike her dad. But apparently I'm wrong.

I've told DH tonight that I won't have them raised living in fear of him or on egg shells about upsetting him. I've tried talking to him about this but he gets straight on the defensive about it, plays the victim, tells me I'm a control freak and that he's not allowed to parent them. For info he does miss a lot of the day to day stuff because he works long hours, he also worked shifts for a long time that we did get used to it being just me at home with the kids.

And don't get me wrong, I'm far from perfect. I get overwhelmed and frustrated sometimes but I'm really trying to do better than my own parents. I hate seeing DH's relationship with his kids deteriorate but I think it's been happening for a long time, I just hadn't noticed/realised.

I've told him tonight that this is a non-negotiable, I think he needs some kind of counselling/support and we possibly need some kind of parenting support maybe to get us on the same page. But I just got a flippant comment again that basically I'm wrong. I'm already making plans to leave. I don't think I realised how much I've been accommodating his moods/approach to parenting. When he's in 'fun dad' mode he's wonderful, but that fact there are noticeable 'sides' to him worries me. And it worries me what sort of example this is setting for our girls of what a partner looks like.

He sounds awful. Unfortunately I don't think this is going to improve and you and your kids deserve better.

Not great but then neither is attitude normal 7 year old behaviour.

He's become his father. How does he reconcile remembering having his console smashed with threatening to do the same to his kids?

Authoritarian, fear-based parenting is the fucking worst. Kids are people, not brainless automatons. If he isn't prepared to have a little humility and make changes, I too would be seriously considering the environment for the children. Does he think it's going to get easier in their teens?

This issue gets worse as the kids get older in my experience. For the sake of your kids crack on with those plans to leave.

This

I agree - it might give him more of a wake up call coming from his father.

He is unconsciously imitating the parenting style he experienced. This isn't uncommon but he needs to realise it's not healthy and to change.

However, you can't make him change. If he refuses to make any effort, he needs to leave.

Your husband has to agree that there’s an issue to solve - does he at least agree that you have 2 different parenting styles and would benefit from a neutral third party to help sort that out?

I am very much an authoritative parent (not authoritarian) and I have never and would never threaten to smash things up, etc, nor did my own parents who ran a very tight household. That’s not being a strong parental figure, it’s being nasty.

Are there books or studies you can give him that show that this style doesn't usually work well?

I'm sorry I don't have any links or recommendations but this is the route I'd go down

@helpfulperson maybe attitude wasn't the right word, I'm talking the odd eye roll when asked to clean up her room a bit, moaning about brushing her teeth. She's a polite well liked 7 year old, I think a bit of push back is normal. Maybe attitude was the wrong word.

Ask him which he thinks is most important - a happy house or perfect kids.

Bringing up kids is a process
... they learn considerate and acceptable behaviour bit by bit, not all at once. They'll get there with or without his shouting and aggression, but he risks damaging his relationship with his children if he continues with it.

@Mummy08m I've sent him loads of stuff over the years. Thinking back when our youngest was a terrible sleeper, he would suggest just leaving her to it (we're talking 2.5 not 8 weeks old) because apparently that worked with him. I could send him all sorts about other methods to try or research about harsh versions of crying it out being too hard on kids. But he never read them.

Oh dear that changes my view a bit then... that tells me that it's not that he's misguided, it's that he genuinely doesn't care about trying hard to be a good parent.

This x 2

Oh dear, I got as far as the bit where he is talking about smashing their toys to punish them. So basically he has become his father. Have you reminded him of the apologetic regret his father later displayed? I also expect you are "softer" than you might be otherwise to balance out his harshness. I don't say ltb flippantly but if he isn't prepared to address this, that might be where you end up. My dad was like that. He could be nice and happy/ funny but only when everything was going his way and we were perfectly behaved. If it wasn't he had a one second fuse. We used to dread him coming home from work as everything was OK with just us and our mum. It was very damaging.

Keep trying to talk to him, when he's calm and emotions aren't heightened. Explain his you've heard his stories about his childhood and his he felt and you don't want that for your kids. Remind him of his dad's regrets. It's not too late for him to change, his dad did and kids forgive but he is definitely getting this wrong.

As a child of divorce I just want to say when my dad finally left my mum was heartbroken- for a while. Then she blossomed, the household blossomed and the atmosphere and mood at home was completely different. I think divorce is sometimes the best option and I had a wonderful childhood with a happier mum x

We split up, neither me or the children could carry on. His heavy handed approach resulted in us all feeling ill. I remember my GP saying he was suffocating us. All three of my children had asthma, which improved when he left.

@honeylulu I am probably softer to balance it out, you're right. The problem is, we've now created a him and me situation. He's always the bad guy, I'm always the good guy. Weirdly though, they call him the fun one. I'm the one doing homework and teeth brushing and the nit combing. He's the one taking them swimming after school and suggesting late nights to watch Britain's got talent etc.

My worry is, if we can't work this out and we split, I wouldn't be there any of the time they were with him. At least together I can be the buffer.

There are happy times as well, which is why I find this so confusing. Times he will rough and tumble with the kids (they use him as a trampoline basically). Him and dd1 love the cinema so he'll take her off on her own sometimes to see a film. He'll spend hours pushing dd2 on the swings or swimming because that's what she loves. When it's good, it's great. But when it's not, I just want to leave.

My worry is, if we can't work this out and we split, I wouldn't be there any of the time they were with him. At least together I can be the buffer.

This is a fallacy I see a lot on here. I say this as someone with a terrible dad. Kids would much rather be happy with their happy mum some of the time, than unhappy with both parents who are both unhappy all of the time. They would only have to tiptoe around their dad, being on their best behaviour, looking out for signs he's about to flip, some of the week/month.

Such men are not made to be part of the 21 c parenting. This is unpleasant man's attitude and is authoritarian, just like his father was. You don't smash tablets that you bought and they do cost fair amount because a small child does not know a better way to behave, but no one showed them how. May be you should leave, when the teenage years come he will go totally mad , then what

I think if your DD is showing attitude she can't be too subdued by him?

Does it actually affect the DC?

Smashing toys up sets a terrible example and must lose him a lot of respect.

It sounds like he could do with more time wit the Dc on his own. He will then discover his parenting approach is bad and makes them unhappy. Would he then be motivated to change?

All your attempts to change this will be futile . From experience it’s ingrained so deeply and gets worse when the kids are teens and really start to rebel. He will turn on you and start questioning your upbringing , as a way to blame you for their perceived flaws.
make your plans .