What to do about ongoing problems with groups of Duke Of Edinburgh students?

[GunkyAndGungey]

We live on a large farm, and a well known footpath crosses past the end of our garden and then through two of our fields. Its a popular route with DofE expedition groups and a lot of them pass through. I've lived here nearly 10 years and whilst occasionally they get lost and end up in the garden (which is fine, we just show them the right path) and sometimes they're quite noisy as they pass (which I don't mind, it's quite nice to hear teenagers enjoying being outside tbh) we've never been bothered by them. Until this summer...

I don't know why, but this summer they all seem to be complete fools. In the last month alone:

• we have found one group climbing on farm machinery whilst taking photos of each other

• we have found two groups that have wandered off the path, through a closed gate, and into one of our fields, where they've gone into the little living willow shelter we have built with table/chairs/firepit and settled down for a picnic (leaving food strewn around and litter behind).

• my dad caught another group poking round inside a derelict and dangerous barn (again for photo opportunities 🙄)

• we have spotted several chucking litter over the hedge into our garden - each and every time we have caught them we have made them pick it up but obviously we don't catch them all and there is definitely much more litter than in previous years

• and to top it all, today I found yet another group off the path messing around trying to open the manhole cover that forms the lid to an old (unused) cess pit. This is not only off the path but it's invisible from the path, you can only see it once you are about 100 yards along our drive (which is very clearly marked PRIVATE) and they had to climb over barbed wire to get to it. Their excuse was that they "thought it was an old bomb shelter and they learned about them last week".

We always ask what school they're from and about half the time they do tell us, in which case we complain to the school. But I feel like we should start complaining to the DofE scheme itself now? Because clearly the students aren't being taught the basics before they're let loose in the countryside! Would there be any point though?

*Just to make clear these are all definitely DofE groups - we have also noticed an overall uptick in other walkers doing stupid shit (trying to put up a tent in a cow field without permission or letting their children into our garden to use the garden toys like it's a park, anyone?), but there's nobody to complain to about them!!

I think this type of behaviour is a symptom of how the countryside and farming is viewed by those in government and our city dwellers. Land being for entertainment not production of crops etc to feed our population. Farmers having to diversify so more people visit who don't know anything about farm safety and that the countryside is an open place of work not a theme park. Sounds dramatic maybe but worries me

I imagine you are talking about those doing the Bronze DoE?

I shrudder when I remember ds doing that. Out if his group of 4, he was the only one who had a bit of common sense in the countryside. Not because he was ‘better’ than the others but because he has spend a lot of time in the countryside with us/grandparents (who have a farm) so had some first hand experience. The others were completely and utterly clueless about everything.

How to deal with it…
Apart from what has been already proposed, you could use the ‘French’ way of dealing with those situations. Gates are locked. Signage and someone rushing out having a right go at them each and every single time. (Dogs barking optional)
Id also contact DoE to let them know AND contact them again with photos of the offenders if someone trespass on your land. Maybe missing out on getting their bronze DoE for not following the rules might entice them to be more careful 😒😒

Yes

People are used to being infantilised and everything laid on for their entertainment. Noone says no to them.

I agree with you.

I put a padlock on my gate and blocked the footpath off and I don't even care. There's another one nearby people.use instead. I've had no complaints and nothing from the council. I'll open it again if I'm told to.

Quite frankly if some students are this bloody stupid and irresponsible then they shouldn’t be allowed out alone!
We had similar problems when farming, no public footpaths across our land yet local groups seemed to think that they could do whatever they liked.
Eventually it stopped after one idiot fell off the barn roof ‘looking at the view’. He wasn’t badly hurt but the ensuing publicity seemed to get through to the organisers whose attitude was pretty much ‘We can’t stop them’

I don’t blame you @Terryer

I laughed but this is actually true.

I agree with taking photos of them. If they don’t tell you which school they’re from explain the photos, date, time & place will be sent to DofE head office for identification purposes and repercussions from school will be worse. Signage for dummies is essential at every potential point they might miss the path. Our footpath is mercifully short (& thankfully only used by a handful of locals). Also agree these must be bronze groups in which case they will be camping nearby and staff shouldn’t usually be too far away.

Tell the schools to show them the 1977 public safety film 'Apaches'. I remember seeing it aged 7, and it made me extremely wary and careful around farms!! OK, it's meant for KS2, and it's 45 years old now almost, but still terrifying...

https://player.bfi.org.uk/free/film/watch-apaches-1977-online

Schools couldn't show them that! Can you imagine how many parents would complain that it upset their little darlings

Dh & I watched that again last year - it had put the fear of god into us back in the day and it stayed with us all these years! Both brought up on farms, and both survived!

People do stupid things though - a few kids rocked up to prom on tractors last week, and adults stood right in front of them where the driver can't see them. Idiots.

I agree with this.

There's plenty of posts on Facebook about people (adults as well as teenagers) walking all over the crops in the local fields.

As for DofE, my two had very little instruction on anything for it. I was shocked at the lack of information given about the countryside and navigating, etc. Luckily my two know a lot from walking with me but very few others had any idea.

@PositiveLife Was that through school or a youth group? It shouldn't be like that, so it's disappointing that was your family's experience.

Through 2 different schools. I had put one down to the change of teacher midway through and assumed it was a bad handover/covid slightly adapting the rules. But the other was just as bad - for example they had training on using a Trangia but it only covered putting it together, they didn't light them or anything until the expedition.

Back when I did DofE, we had a trial camp on the school field with teachers there showing how to do everything, etc. before our actual expedition

I know! And to think back in the day it was shown to Year 3 and up - we were at a village school and there were farms in the area, so it was decided we should all see it. It certainly stuck in my brain for 45 years!!

If these teens had been shown that in the juniors, they'd not be messing with cess pits and farm machinery now, and definitely staying away from unknown liquids in sheds. In fact the whole idea of the children in the film playing at being imaginary characters, and the teens today taking photos for tik-tok etc, kind of fits together. Maybe they should bring it back, and make the parents watch it too!

Agree. Respect and 'how to play nice' has almost entirely disappeared in quite a significant percentage of our cohort since covid ... and they are primary school aged! Can only imagine how awful it is in secondaries now.

And holding a toddler age child on my horses back and taking a photo

This happened to someone at my yard - while she was riding the horse

1. Get the name of the school and their DofE supervisor & assessors names.

They should know this and have contact information for them.

1. Take photographic evidence if you can.

3. Call the supervisor & assessor and tell them the situation straight away.

1. Report them all to the DofE.

These kids are being failed by poor preparation and their supervisor is not performing their role.

To be honest this sounds like normal teenager behaviour. They have always done daft and risky things. The issue is that middle class urban teenagers have basically no unsupervised time outside and therefore the D of E expedition is when they get chance to do these things. Therefore you're getting it concentrated on your land as that's where a lot of groups go.

As a middle class and generally law abiding rural child/teenager in the 90s I remember climbing on dry stone walls and accidentally making them fall down, trespassing in a working quarry, going into derelict buildings and stealing things, generally going wherever I liked as long as no one saw. I would not have dropped litter or deliberately damaged property . But did plenty of other things. I'd grown out of all that by 14 or so by the time of D of E expeditions. Modern children are no different to all the others - it's just that they are not getting chance to go through these normal developmental stages.

But something has definitely changed. In the decade I've been here, I have never ever felt the need to complain about any of them until this year!

You may have mucked about like a dangerous twat and I'm sure adults got fucked off with it back in the day, or maybe noone cared.

I would never ever have been entitled enough to think I could destroy property even as a teenager. Maybe that's the difference between urban + rural kids ie as a rural child we knew how much work went into building a dry stone wall so would never have dared climb all over them, especially to the point of collapse. Yes we did some daft stuff but never to that extent, we were taught to respect livestock, property + farmers' livelihoods as they were our neighbours.

The problem is that they are stupid and irresponsible because they are never allowed out alone. Farmers should not be the ones dealing with this but it's a problem caused by modern life, too many cars, too many screens, lack of freedom and responsibility for children and young teenagers generally.

Probably COVID if it's that recent a change...as noted by teachers, it's caused huge problems with behaviour of all ages of children.