Anyone work for a Housing Association ? Is this a reasonable number of staff?

[MedievalMadness]

I live in a flat run by a small housing assoc (500 properties , mainly flats). It is absolutely chaotic with no department having any idea what other depts are doing/have done/need to do. To me there seems a ridiculous amount of staff. I'm wondering if this is because so many of them are ineffective, so they need more and more people to try run things . I've never come across a more ineffectively run organisation in my life. Nothing gets done without an almighty battle, there seem to be perpetual meetings, staff wandering around , appointments cancelled, forgotten , random people calling to do repairs at all times etc. There are the following staff:
CEO, director of operations, director of finance & resources, HR & resources manager, Administrator, finance manager, finance officer, housing manager, housing officer, community engagement officer, property services manager, compliance officer, 2 x compliance technicians , property surveyor/clerk of works, 2 x facilities coordinators,repairs operative , sheltered housing manager, deputy sheltered housing manager, 10 x housing support workers .

If anyone works for a HA or knows about them, does this seem normal for the size of the HA?

I’m trying to find if the HA has had reviews or inspections . Any idea what I search for ? I can’t seem to find anything .

Looking at the website there is no mention of them being ARLA registered.

Or do you mean 25 blocks/developments rather than individual flats?

For reviews etc just Google their name and reviews. There should be plenty on them. You can Google their name and ARLA accredited too if you can't see it on the website.

I also live in a flat managed by a housing association. Its equally shambolic and also with a huge number of staff, none of whom seem to have any idea what they or each other are doing. I wonder if it's the same, mine begins with O?

It was 13 weeks for the roof renewal from start to finish

Emergency procedure would be to advise tenant to isolate the fuse to that light circuit and switch it off and use something to catch the water until the roofer can come back and make a temp repair.
a. and have the contractors who do the electric checks blame the tenant if they get it wrong
b. sorry i dont agree The roof renewal was forced on us as tenants We didnt ask for it and whether we had or hadnt it is up to the contractor and HA to take responsibility for their own actions and attend. If the tenant damaged the flat they would soon charge us.

Yes, absolutely everything. Not just frontline (letting, repairs etc) but also Exec, finance, HR, IT, Development (building new houses) - the whole lot.

We are registered under the Industrial and Provident Societies Act, 1965 and are regulated by the Regulator of Social Housing. We are members of the National Housing Federation

I found the above on our website but no mention on Google about ARLA.

I looked for reviews or inspections on Google and couldn’t find anything but came across a major complaint on SHACtion (who put a flyer through our doors about 6 months ago now I remember) covering all the things I’m suspicious/pissed off about and it makes for VERY interesting reading at first glance. I’m off to read the whole thing.

a)Anyone can flick a fuse switch. You don't need to touch any of the electrics at all and it won't cause any damage.
b) As long as there is no risk to life or risk of serious damage to property, its not an emergency. You just put a bucket under it and flick the fuse switch till the morning. Unless of course its mains pressure water pouring through.
Of course the tenants won't have a say in large maintenance works - you don't own the property. 13 weeks seems excessive if that's purely the time taken to re-roof but there are mitigating factors which could cause delays. Of course, sometimes contractors are just really crap, and that's very frustrating for tenants who have to deal with the consequences.

That makes more sense! Lol

. Of course, sometimes contractors are just really crap, and that's very frustrating for tenants who have to deal with the consequences.

THIS DOCUMENT. Myatts Field North refurb.

//www.geog.leeds.ac.uk/fileadmin/documents/research/pfisocialhousing/MFN_PFI_Refurb_Experiences_Report.pdf
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HelenaDove Fri 14-Jul-17 22:10:33

Residents were told to remove their pets, but no compensation was offered to cover the
costs involved.
 No consideration was given to residents who worked night shifts.
 Workers used electricity paid for by of residents, without offering compensation.
 Doors were left open and residents were able to wander in unchallenged by workers
who did not know them.
 Quality alterations that residents had already made to their homes were ripped out to
make way for inferior alternatives.
 Supposedly completed electrical rewiring was found to be substandard and occasionally
dangerous.
 Supposedly completed pipe works and its housing were found to be substandard.
 In some homes, odd sized radiators and kitchen unit doors had been fitted.
 Flooding in one home had been caused by an unsupervised apprentice.
 Households were left overnight without running water or a toilet.
 At least one resident was left without electricity for a whole weekend.
 Some workers were found to be abusive, bullying and inconsiderate, especially towards
elderly or otherwise vulnerable residents.
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HelenaDove Tue 12-Jun-18 18:10:02

HelenaDove Fri 21-Jul-17 16:39:36

peoplevspfi.org.uk/2017/07/21/myatts-field-north-regeneration-a-pfi-horror-show/
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HelenaDove Fri 21-Jul-17 19:50:21

//www.theguardian.com/society/2017/jul/21/the-real-cost-of-regeneration-social-housing-private-developers-pfi?CMP=share_btn_fb
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HelenaDove Fri 21-Jul-17 19:52:14

"Hodkinson carried out a qualitative survey of 14 homes refurbished by Rydon that had been the subject of a huge number of complaints. Showers were fitted next to electric fans. A toilet was installed so close to a wall that you could only sit on it sideways. Some households went for days without electricity and weeks without cooking facilities. Cupboards were fitted with wrongly size doors. Tenants who complained reported that they were treated dismissively. One remembered the site supervisor saying to him, “It ain’t Chelsea, mate.” Regenter’s out-of-hours emergency line linked to the wrong database, so callout engineers weren’t available. The striking thing was how long problems could drag out: one family’s flat was flooded in January 2014, and repairs weren’t even scheduled till September. Two years later, their flat still hadn’t been fully repaired and redecorated. Even at the most straightforward level, the work wasn’t done to a decent standard.

When approached for comment, Rydon said that since the complaints were made, three years ago, attempts have been made to remedy the problems. They said the comments were not reflective of most of the residents, and that there was a good level of satisfaction among the residents now.

For tenants with more complicated requirements, the situation was worse. The Cifuentes family, one of whom used a wheelchair, was left without ramps, hoists or any means of escape in a fire, and without a lock on the front door. Repairs were so slow and haphazard that, at one point, the family had to move out for over a month, and the disabled member could only have his needs met by going into a respite unit – whereupon they were threatened with losing their carer’s allowance, their disability allowance and their car."

NBLarsen Not an O. Sorry yours seems equally crap

I’m a HO for a huge company (60,000+ properties) and I have 800 properties/families that I look after. I think your HA seems massively top heavy!

ARLA membership isn't compulsory. If they deal with entire developments they may be RICS or IRPM instead, again, not compulsory. Arla tends to be for letting agents as it covers all the legislation and best practice for renting out properties. It may be a different qualification or regulatory body again for purpose built social housing.

You would be surprised though how many people working in property have very little knowledge of the legislation, and how many companies disregard it whenever they can get away with it. Its depressing.

I think in the above article 2 points leapt out at me.
1, of course they can't give consideration to shift workers. It sucks for them, but the majority of the country work days, and if the work needs to be done that's when it happens. Not a lot they can do about that.
2, ripping out "quality fittings" to replace with inferior versions is quite situation dependent. If the whole development is down to get bathroom upgrades for example, and Mrs Jones in 32b has paid for a scalloped corner bath with expensive peach marble tiling, they may decide to take it out and fit the (probably much cheaper but more universally expected) plain white suite. I can see why they would do that, and it's probably in the tenancy agreement.
The rest is awful, although the behaviour of the contractors is sadly unsurprising. Those poor people.

TheTempest. That is utterly gobsmacking. There’s no way the number of staff in ours can even begin to be justified in comparison. You’d think with all these staff it would run seamlessly. But then if there were staff capable of running anything seamlessly, it wouldn’t need all the extra staff employed in a fruitless attempt to do anything at all competently! It’s an absolute disgrace and the complaints that some tenants have brought to the attention of SHACtion makes for damning reading. But what will/can be done about it is another question as their superpower is deflection, trying to wear everyone down by not providing documentation requested, and magically making records and invoices disappear.

When are housing associations going to do something about how hot flats get. We have had cavity wall insulation fitted.....twice and windows with restrictors that dont open properly. The consequences of this are my late night cold baths.

Jennifer ours have been very lucky in that the regulations around overheating for domestic housing were updated last year. Our flats were finished and occupied last year. Never would have got this design and specifications passed under new regs. This evening it was 28.7 in my living room. It was 20 degrees outside . I sleep with high powered fan on my bedside table.

https://eandt.theiet.org/content/articles/2022/07/heat-related-deaths-could-triple-without-action-on-uk-homes-scientists-warn/

A lot of housing associations have unnecessary overpaid incompetent staff. That’s why they are often not that cheap in providing housing.

Mine are terrible (begins with a C!). 3 years to get my leaking roof fixed! 18 months of battling with them, then another 18 months from getting a solicitor involved who eventually had to threaten them with Court action.

6 months over a snowy winter with a broken boiler. Had to get environmental health involved on that one.

Now they're trying to land me with service charges which clearly aren't for this property. They've made an error. How long is it taking them to realise that? 3 months and counting! Meanwhile they're threatening me with action over the unpaid charges! Spoke to one deptartment to be informed "we don't speak to other depts"!!

Any repair I'm capable of doing or paying for, I just do it myself. I need to redo a large part of my kitchen. Work surfaces and sink are knackered. But cupboards are nice (last tenant paid extra to get an upgraded kitchen). I was due a new kitchen but they told me "what we give you won't be as nice as this". But they won't replace work surfaces and sink as its "all or nothing".

As you can see, I could go on all day! They're the worst landlord I've ever had. But I love the house (despite all its faults!) So I make do.

Contractors not turning up to pre booked appointments and then turning up with no notice expecting you to drop everything

Jennifer. Contractors just turn up knocking at the door on the off chance you’re in. They then go away if your about to go out or it’s not convenient, and go no contact . It’s exhausting. Even if you have an appointment they’ll turn up late, not turn up at all because it’s not been booked in or come a day early/late (see random knocking at door above ). I’ve lost count of the time we have complaint about this but nothing ever improves. We get letters about recharging repairs if they’re nit willing to take responsibility for something. But what about the contractors getting charged for all their chaos and non attendance.

@MedievalMadness Housing associations make a lot of noise about wanting to house people who work but are then unwilling to work around them to the point that they then expect the tenant to risk their job to the point of getting the sack by keep waiting in for contractors that dont turn up. This actually happened to a tenant of our HA She lost her job due to this and then they set about trying to evict her for non payment of rent!!!

Quite frankly one of the reasons they seem to prefer the druggies and the weed smokers is they are more laid back so more willing to take their crap and are more likely to be at home when the HA sends someone round on a whim.

This is the tenant i just mentioned.
From an OPEN blog

I’m posting my complaint to sanctuary in the hope someone can tell me where to go…they cost me my job in jan 2015 as i was in a new job on probation and had to take 6 days off work in a month as they left me and my daughter with no hot water for a month because they kept not turning up or sending out wrong people to fix it, then took me to court for eviction in feb as i couldnt pay rent

This complaint now as u will see has been going on a yr, iv complained to 3 manager whole have all never got back to me. I emailed them 3 weeks ago as a manager told me in September she was dealingwith.mycomplaint but has not contacted me since, emailed again yesterday to be told someone will contact u! Im at the end of my tether.

On November 3rd 2015 I reported a leak where water was coming in to my living room from underneath the coving. The man I spoke to said he would get a plumber out and I told him there were no pipes there but he still sent a plumber.

Following this between November 2015– July 2016 I have had 12 appointments with sanctuary maintenance staff because you sent out the wrong people, parts had not been ordered or people were sent who didn’t even know what they were supposed to be doing, I have attached a list of appointments and what was done each time.

In April I made a complaint to a manager Craig as it had been going on 5 months, every time it rained i had water coming in my living room. I have chronic asthma and this was causing mould and since February I had been seriously ill and admitted to hospital 3 times and was due to have surgery on 6th April and I was concerned I would have open wounds and having dirty water coming in.

Craig advised I could claim compensation for lost time/earnings/damages and promised to chase. On 7th may following another 3 appointments and nothing being done I went to environmental health as I had now had infections in my wounds from my surgery, in a lot of pain and still having to mop dirty water.

On 8th June i called sanctuary again as environmental health have also been chasing he is getting no response either, i am told you cannot bring the appointment forward and i literally broke down on the phone as i have now had water coming in my house 7 months, im in pain from major surgery and nothing is any closer to being resolved.

I complain to a manager Joe who tells me the job was cancelled!
Now the job was finally completed on 15th July by simply painting sealant on the balcony which Joe advised David bizzells manager knew of this problem as other houses had the same problem.

I am amazed i have been left this long for a simple problem sanctuary were already aware of, It’s disgusting you left me a whole winter with asthma with rain coming in and following surgery when i should have been resting i was mopping dirty water.

Now the problem should be resolved but i have been left with damage and mould to the wall, coving and curtain rail/baton due to 8 months of water, pictures attached. i am told this will need painting with a special sealant first to stop the water marks keep showing through. So are sanctuary going to come and do that and repaint or do i have to do this? I would also like to claim compensation for the time you wasted which cost me money off work for every appointment, the stress of what you put me through and cost of sorting the damaged caused by the water as you can see from the pictures I have a damp patch at the bottom of the coving and across the top of the whole wall and damp and flaking paint.

This is standard appauling service from Sanctuary repairs, in january 2015 you cost me my job leaving me with no hot water for a month and me having 6 days off work because you kept sending wrong people out and i had to go to the mp to resolve and clearly nothing has changed."