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Original poster

Crooked uncle. Should I put this money aside in case its wrong

32 replies

Youhoo867711 · 14/06/2023 09:40

My DGM died a few weeks ago. She had a bond in place to be split between her 7 grandchildren.
6 of these had a close relationship with DGM but the 7th was estranged because of family upset. No idea where they live and we only met this child when they were a baby. Only know the first name. Their mum was an affair partner of this crooked uncle. He stayed with my aunt. I don't know if uncle ever had contact with the baby.
My DM passed away when I was a teenager. She had me and my 2 brothers.
Uncle also has 3 children. He is the executor of the estate.
He has told the 6 of us that he can't find the 7th so that share has been divided to rest of the grandchildren.
It's £25k extra per child.
I'm worried about the consequences. Spoken to my brothers and we will keep this extra in another account. But the 3 cousins want to spend it.
Uncle is saying it's legal.
Who will get in trouble if it's against the law.

OP posts:
CalamityCara · 14/06/2023 09:51

Can’t find, or doesn’t want to look very hard and open a can of worms?

Is any one on one of these ancestry sites?

pontipinemum · 14/06/2023 09:56

I really don't know. Would the 7th GC have a claim to make if they ever found out? I would think so. But also chances of them finding out are slim.

Sounds absolutely shitty of your uncle though not to look for them. I am correct in thinking that GCs share would be 150k? That is a lot of money. Could citizens advice help?

Could you try find them?

SisyphusDad · 14/06/2023 09:56

Not a lawyer, but I'm fairly sure that he can't safely do that unless he can clearly prove that the steps he's taken to trace the 'missing' beneficiary meet the relevant legal standards (and I very much doubt he could do that in a few weeks).

Don't know who would be liable if Beneficiary 7 turns up though.

Plumpciousness · 14/06/2023 09:59

Sorry for the loss of your grandmother.

If she died only a few weeks ago:

(i) your uncle hasn't spent long trying to find the grandchild;
(ii) it's highly unlikely probate would have been granted so quickly, so he can't distribute the Estate yet anyway.

I don't know the legal situation but I think the Executor has a legal duty to distribute the Estate correctly. If there's any legal comeback it's likely to be against him, not you. But I think you and your brothers are wise to keep the extra money aside.

There was a BBC programme "Heir Hunters" about companies who track down relatives of people who die intestate. They go to considerable lengths: searching public records, constructing family trees, contacting people to see if they are the right family, following up further leads. Do you know if your uncle employed professionals to try to trace the grandchild? Or perhaps in the past he's tried himself to find the child and failed? Or he could just be lying because he doesn't want to re-open the can of worms about his illegitimate child.

Original poster
Youhoo867711 · 14/06/2023 10:00

Me and my brothers don't know her surname we were only 11, 12 and 13 at the time.
As our mum has died we have no more information.
My older brother has looked under my uncles name but this lady might not have registered the child under uncles name.
She could have moved areas. We live on the outskirts of a small city.

OP posts:
TakeMe2Insanity · 14/06/2023 10:02

The liability of the decision would lie with the executor of the estate.

I totally think you are morally right to keep the money set aside for longer until you’ve done more investigations.

Plumpciousness · 14/06/2023 10:05

Sounds like your uncle would be personally liable if the beneficiary comes forward in future:

https://www.thegazette.co.uk/all-notices/content/103920

What happens if you don’t make reasonable efforts to look for missing beneficiaries?
PRs are responsible for the correct distribution of the estate. If they fail to make reasonable efforts to locate missing beneficiaries, and those beneficiaries come forward later, the PRs could be personally liable.
^^
PRs must take all reasonable steps to ensure that either they locate the beneficiaries, or they protect themselves if searches for the beneficiaries are inconclusive. If they do not, they could find themselves having to pay the beneficiary for their share of the estate.

VDisappointing · 14/06/2023 10:10

I would do an ancestry DNA test and see who comes up linked to me.

pontipinemum · 14/06/2023 10:11

@Plumpciousness that's an interesting show. I wonder who pays for their services? Does it come out of the found heirs inheritance, probably.

Pemba · 14/06/2023 10:12

Sounds like your uncle hasn't been involved with his illegitimate son/daughter at all. So firstly they have been deprived of having a father in their lives, now he wants to cheat them out of this inheritance.! They are still a blood grandchild of your late grandma, and this is going against her wishes. The money might transform their life.

Your uncle's behaviour is shabby, shame on him. He needs to try harder to trace them. He could get into legal trouble too.

MandyMotherOfBrian · 14/06/2023 10:13

He’d probably be liable as executor and he’d also probably have to have proof that he’d tried all avenues to locate the beneficiary. Some good info in this link:
www.co-oplegalservices.co.uk/media-centre/articles-jan-apr-2017/what-happens-if-a-beneficiary-cant-be-found/

Plumpciousness · 14/06/2023 10:16

If you Google "tracing missing beneficiary" loads of heir-hunting companies come up.

This is one of the companies featured in the BBC programme (for info, in no way an endorsement of them):

MissAmbrosia · 14/06/2023 10:22

I was tracked down abroad by heir hunters looking for heirs to a great aunt's estate. I didn't even know she existed. Surely your uncle knows the woman's name? He needs to try harder.

Plumpciousness · 14/06/2023 10:23

@pontipinemum: I think for intestacy cases their charges are a percentage of the value of the Estate. Although if I remember correctly, the companies on the programme weren't actually contracted to work on a specific case, they would choose which ones to work on (after details released by whichever government department deals with such things) in the hope of finding beneficiaries and therefore being able to claim a fee. So there could be more than one company trying to trace beneficiaries of the same Estate. I don't know how the fees apply if two or more companies find different beneficiaries - perhaps it's a percentage of the legacy due to the beneficiaries they find, rather than on the whole Estate.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 14/06/2023 10:26

Has he taken out insurance?

MIL has a sister who disappeared off abroad about 50 years ago. She occasionally sent cards when she moved from one country to another, but they tailed off about 30 years ago. When her mother died they couldn’t find her. They took out an insurance policy that meant if she ever gets in touch she can claim her share but the others won’t have to pay it back.

YetMoreNewBeginnings · 14/06/2023 10:28

Plumpciousness · 14/06/2023 10:23

@pontipinemum: I think for intestacy cases their charges are a percentage of the value of the Estate. Although if I remember correctly, the companies on the programme weren't actually contracted to work on a specific case, they would choose which ones to work on (after details released by whichever government department deals with such things) in the hope of finding beneficiaries and therefore being able to claim a fee. So there could be more than one company trying to trace beneficiaries of the same Estate. I don't know how the fees apply if two or more companies find different beneficiaries - perhaps it's a percentage of the legacy due to the beneficiaries they find, rather than on the whole Estate.

The fee is a percentage of the amount that the individual beneficiary they sign up gets.

They don’t get anything from the wider estate or the other beneficiaries amounts. Just the people they actually sign up to their company.

Valour · 14/06/2023 10:30

I'd take an ancestry DNA test too.

WheresSpring · 14/06/2023 10:31

If your uncle is the executor it’s on him, not you. Probably wise however to stick the extra in an account for a while, just in case, for your own peace of mind.

Catspyjamas17 · 14/06/2023 10:31

Put it in an interest-bearing savings account, then if they are not found you keep it plus the interest, and if they are found they can have the interest also.

WheresSpring · 14/06/2023 10:33

Don’t do the DNA - you’ll probably find loads of extra grandkids😬🙈😆…. I also worry about putting that sort of info in the public domain.

EliflurtleTripanInfinite · 14/06/2023 10:35

I'd tell crooked uncle he could be found personally liable, might stop him doing this. I don't see how in a couple of weeks he can say he's made a good enough effort to find the 7th potential benefices and it's safe to share out the money.

2bazookas · 14/06/2023 10:51

Your uncle surely knows the name and rough age, of his affair partner, mother of his child; and the location where theuy had the affair. Her name is traceable through NI, DWP, registers of BDM . The birth of her child is also traceable via BDM.

Uncle knows the town she lived in; he should have advertised in local press Registry office for her marriage, death, birth of his child etc.

If he's unable to conduct such searches, as Executor he should pay a private investigator (charged to the estate).

123sunshine · 14/06/2023 11:02

Alll liaility falls to the executor. They have the legal responsibilsity to ensure that the proceeds are distributed according to the Will. Just as an aside, the bond may have been held in Trust and therefore it would be the Trustees of the bond (which may also be you uncle too) if it was in Trust it wouldn't be part of the estate. If in Trust it depends on what type of Trust, if for example a discretionary Trust there would be no comeback as at the descretion of the Trustees how the Bond distributed.

Original poster
Youhoo867711 · 14/06/2023 11:18

Thanks for everyone's response.
Uncle is a difficult character.
Don't know what sort of bond it was.
I presume its a trust but who knows.
He just asked for our bank details and sent the money over. Probate has only just been applied for. We are not included in the rest of the will. Then a copy of weeks later sent the rest as he said couldn't find this child.

OP posts:
BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 14/06/2023 11:28

I inherited a few years ago on the death of my dgm but the money wasn't hers as such it was a trust that she had a life interest in that then reverted to the grandchildren so it was outside my dgm estate and not subject to probate, is this a similar situation?

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