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Car breakdown, wwyd?

50 replies

Ukrainebaby23 · 28/05/2023 21:10

Broke down yesterday, 2 adults in car with 10m baby in car seat. Car unfixable at roadside needs tow. Bank Holiday Saturday BTW.

Recovery vehicle unable to take car seat as no isofix. (Large well known Recovery group). Could wait at roadside for 10 hours for full recovery truck, not feasible with 10m old imo.

100miles from our destination, 200 miles from home. No relatives/friends nearby.

What do we do?

WWD was get a taxi to nearest railway station fortunately only about 5miles, then train for about an hour with baby/carrying car seat, pushing buggy, essential bags and baby.
Final leg collected at station by family but car seat wouldn't engage so they drove car seat to destination and we pushed baby in buggy last 2 miles to the in laws house.

I still cant see we had any other option, WWYD?

I need to invent a reasonably priced folding car seat to be used in taxis/recovery vehicles etc. Carting the car seat was not fun.

OP posts:
FlounderingFruitcake · 29/05/2023 11:05

It would have been perfectly legal not to use the car seat.
https://www.gov.uk/child-car-seats-the-rules/when-a-child-can-travel-without-a-car-seat
If this doesn’t meet the definition of an unexpected journey then I don’t know what does. Plus taxis also fine. Would I ever plan to do it? No. But in this situation I would done it. And you will be looking to move to the next stage seat soon and when you do make sure it has a belt install option because shit happens and it makes life easier.

Child car seats: the law

The rules for child car seats and booster seats - height, weight, age, type of vehicle, car, minibus, licensed taxi

https://www.gov.uk/child-car-seats-the-rules/when-a-child-can-travel-without-a-car-seat

savoycabbage · 29/05/2023 11:13

highlandspooce · 29/05/2023 11:01

I'm a bit baffled that the recovery driver refused to take you tbh. They travel unrestrained children from breakdowns regularly. Whilst not ideal it is allowed. I would complain about that because his suggestion you wait 10 hours I was ridiculous.

Me too. Surely a couple with a baby is hardly and unusual situation. How can it have fazed him so much? I'd speak to the recovery company about that.

Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 04:58

helpfulperson · 29/05/2023 06:39

Rules about car seats only apply to cars, not buses coaches and other vehicles so im fairly sure it wouldn't be illegal in a tow truck. There is also an emergency clause which would have made it legal for a taxi or even non taxi car to collect you. Or if the recovery was a van to be in that without a car seat.

I thought that too, obvioisoy googled it, this id what i found on Rospa.

Exceptions Unexpected Necessity Over a Short DistanceIf an appropriate child restraint is not available, children over 3 years old may travel in the rear using an adult seat belt. This exception is for emergencies and unplanned situations. For example, when someone has to carry a child due to an "unexpected necessity" over a short distance, and where not carrying the child (because a child restraint is not available) might leave him or her at risk. It does not apply to trips that could have reasonably been planned (e.g., a school run), nor to 'long' journeys or to children under 3 years old. You cannot take children under 3 years in a vehicle without a seat belt or the correct child car seat.

Goes on to say
Child Seat and Seat Belt Laws
Children in cars, vans and other goods vehicles must be carried in an appropriate child restraint from birth until either they are 135cm (4'5") tall or 12 years old, whichever comes first. There are very few exceptions. They must then use a seat belt (although it would be preferable to use a booster seat until they are 150cm (5') tall).
Children under 3 yearsMust use an appropriate child restraint in the front or rear of a vehicle. They cannot be carried in a car that does not have seat belts because it is not possible to fit a child restraint in such a vehicle.
It is illegal to carry a child in a rearward-facing child seat in the front if there is an active front passenger airbag. The airbag must be deactivated or the rearward-facing child seat must be placed in the rear.
Children aged 3 years to 135cm tall (approx 4'5") who are under 12 yearsMust use an appropriate child restraint when travelling in the front seat of a car, van or other goods vehicle. They must use an appropriate child restraint when travelling in the rear, if seat belts are fitted.

Children aged 12 years and over (or younger children over 135cm tall)Must wear a seat belt if fitted in the front or rear of a car, van or other goods vehicle.
It is the driver's responsibility to ensure that children under 14 years old use an appropriate child restraint or wear their seat belt.
ExceptionsUnexpected Necessity Over a Short DistanceIf an appropriate child restraint is not available, children over 3 years old may travel in the rear using an adult seat belt. This exception is for emergencies and unplanned situations. For example, when someone has to carry a child due to an "unexpected necessity" over a short distance, and where not carrying the child (because a child restraint is not available) might leave him or her at risk. It does not apply to trips that could have reasonably been planned (e.g., a school run), nor to 'long' journeys or to children under 3 years old. You cannot take children under 3 years in a vehicle without a seat belt or the correct child car seat.

When three child restraints cannot be fitted in the rearIf it is not possible to fit three child restraints in the rear of a car, then two children up to 135 cm in height must travel in child seats and the third child may use an adult seat belt on its own. This exemption does not apply to children under 3 years old.
It may be better for the third child to sit in a child restraint in the front rather than use the adult seat belt in the rear. If there is an active passenger airbag, check with the vehicle manufacturer or the handbook about using a child restraint in the front. If you do, move the front seat as far back as possible on its runners.
A rearward facing baby seat must not be used in the front if there is an active front airbag.
Licensed Taxis (including private hire vehicles and minicabs)If a child restraint is not available, children under 3 years must travel in the rear, but may be unrestrained. Children 3 years and over, up to 135cm tall must sit in the rear and use an adult seat belt. Children aged 12 years or more, or over 135cm tall, may travel the front, but must wear the seat belt. (See the Other Vehicles section).
Emergency VehiclesChildren may be carried in vehicles being used by the police or other emergency services without using child restraints, if appropriate restraints are not available.

Which would suggest, imo, we could have used the taxi without the car seat, but not the tow truck. At the time it was quite stressful and I missed the bit about the taxi. Good to know .

Over aged 3 slightly different rules apply, here's the link if anyone wants a read.
https://www.childcarseats.org.uk/carrying-other-peoples-children/child-seat-and-seat-belt-laws/#:~:text=Children%20under%203%20years,restraint%20in%20such%20a%20vehicle.

Other Vehicles | Child Car Seats

Information about carrying other people's children in taxis, minibues and coaches.

https://www.childcarseats.org.uk/carrying-other-peoples-children/other-vehicles/

OP posts:
Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:09

Scrambledegghead · 29/05/2023 04:44

Are you 100% sure the car seat couldn’t be fixed in via the seatbelts and you just didn’t realise at the time? I’ve never heard of one that couldn’t do so before. Which car seat is it?

Graco turn2me combination. When wr bought it, I read this on the argos website.

Car breakdown, wwyd?
OP posts:
Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:10

But I don't have the manual here to verify that.

OP posts:
Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:14

FlounderingFruitcake · 29/05/2023 11:05

It would have been perfectly legal not to use the car seat.
https://www.gov.uk/child-car-seats-the-rules/when-a-child-can-travel-without-a-car-seat
If this doesn’t meet the definition of an unexpected journey then I don’t know what does. Plus taxis also fine. Would I ever plan to do it? No. But in this situation I would done it. And you will be looking to move to the next stage seat soon and when you do make sure it has a belt install option because shit happens and it makes life easier.

From the .gov link posted

can’t take children under 3 on an unexpected journey in a vehicle without the correct child car seat, unless both of the following apply:

  • it’s a licensed taxi or minicab
  • the child travels on a rear seat without a seat belt

So as I say, I missed that in the kerfuffle but doesn't change that recovery couldn't take us.

OP posts:
UndercoverCop · 30/05/2023 05:15

We've got a travel bag for DS' car seat (for when we take it on holiday), it has backpack style straps. It lives in the under compartment of the boot. Ours does also attach by belt but if it didn't that would at last be an easier way to carry it. It was about £20 on Amazon

Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:37

Aargh I just realised I think our 'taxi' was actually a private hire which differs in law.

OP posts:
Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:41

And for anyone saying 'ridiculous situation' absolutely agree, but there we were right in the ridiculous situation.

Especially ridiculous as the reason car couldn't be fixed was a £15 alternator belt which is in short supply in UK apparently. Again googled it myself and could only source one to be delivered Wednesday. Wouldn't have fixed the problem completely but would have been able to take a steady drive to safety, possibly the station etc.

OP posts:
Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:43

UndercoverCop · 30/05/2023 05:15

We've got a travel bag for DS' car seat (for when we take it on holiday), it has backpack style straps. It lives in the under compartment of the boot. Ours does also attach by belt but if it didn't that would at last be an easier way to carry it. It was about £20 on Amazon

Thank you, didn't know about these, will take a look.

OP posts:
Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:46

KateyCuckoo · 29/05/2023 04:51

Why didn't you leave the car seat in the car since you couldn't use it instead of carting it around?

Because we couldn't get to the station without a car seat in the private hire vehicle.

OP posts:
Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:49

cansu · 29/05/2023 09:40

I would have sent dp in taxi or in recovery vehicle to argos to get a simple car seat that could be attached with a seat belt.

Good solution, not sure recovery driver would have been up to waiting that long but like the idea thank you.

OP posts:
Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:52

Hidingawaytoday · 29/05/2023 07:35

Ours came with the isofix base attached, so it can't be used with a seatbelt. That wasn't uncommon when I was looking to upgrade from the baby carrier.

I'm not sure what what we'd have done OP - probably taxi/train the same as you (although would have risked it in the truck if the driver let us!).

Yes, that was our situation, we've literally only just put it in this category as DSs feet hanging out of the baby bucket seat. Glad someone else has heard of non seatbelt car seats, thought I was going mad.

OP posts:
WonderingWanda · 30/05/2023 06:07

It doesn't sound like there was much else you could have done other than insist on a breakdown truck that could manage your car seat. It must have been very stressful to be on the side of the road with a baby.

IhateJan22 · 30/05/2023 06:14

I had an isofix seat that couldn’t be strapped in by seatbelts. This isn’t a situation you could ever foresee it being an issue.

Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 06:19

highlandspooce · 29/05/2023 11:01

I'm a bit baffled that the recovery driver refused to take you tbh. They travel unrestrained children from breakdowns regularly. Whilst not ideal it is allowed. I would complain about that because his suggestion you wait 10 hours I was ridiculous.

Confused by this, allowed where, by whom? I'm sure it does happen but most probably illegally, see .gov links. As I've said on another post, our recovery driver says its not an unheard of situation, but does occur from time to time.

Maybe I was expected to offer him a tip/bribe for him to take us illegally. I would have if I'd thought of it.

OP posts:
GoodChat · 30/05/2023 06:27

Where would the recovery truck have taken you to? Your end destination or the nearest garage?

Id have just strapped the car seat in anyway - there'd have been a way to do it even if wasn't 'proper'

KateyCuckoo · 30/05/2023 06:31

Ukrainebaby23 · 30/05/2023 05:46

Because we couldn't get to the station without a car seat in the private hire vehicle.

You can though, baby on lap in taxi either end of the train journey.

Dazedandbemused0 · 30/05/2023 06:31

I’m pretty sure it’s perfectly legal to not use a car seat in a vehicle like this, and in this situation. You don’t even legally need one in a cab.

Dazedandbemused0 · 30/05/2023 06:31

Hate to be a dick though but I’m another poster who didn’t even know there were carseats that couldn’t be strapped in with seatbelts!

Ollybob · 30/05/2023 06:45

I would have tried the seat belt with the car seat to see how it goes, Argos answers can be flippin useless and wrong!
Manual may possibly be online too.
Failing that I would have done as you had if the relative I was visiting couldn't pick me up. I know my dad would but nobody else and unfair to do such a long journey.

BaronessEllarawrosaurus · 30/05/2023 07:04

A quick Google search has found instructions for fitting the turn2me with a seat belt. You are right it was illegal to take the baby in the breakdown truck without the carseat, its surprising how many people think it was legal.

highlandspooce · 30/05/2023 07:59

OP are you usually such an over thinker?

You got home safely. You don't need to analyse it so much. There are things you could have done but you chose your method and it worked fine to get you home.

Breakdowns happen all the time. Infants do travel in breakdown trucks unrestrained if there is no car seat option. Private hire vehicles are usually subject to the same licensing conditions as taxis. None of this actually matter though because you are home.

birdsongismyfave · 30/05/2023 08:34

This happened to me and my baby was in a maxi cosy seat which could be belted. The driver explained that in his truck there were only lap belts so I wouldn't be able to secure my seat. In any case, he was delivering my car to the garage not my house so it wouldn't have got us home.
Thankfully as it happened we were in a supermarket car park so waited there with the car seat for a friend to pick us up and drop us home. That's when I realised in the stress and confusion I'd given the truck driver my house keys along with my car keys and had to sit outside my house with the baby until my husband got home from work...

birdsongismyfave · 30/05/2023 08:37

And my car seats now are a britax and axkid mini - the britax doesn't take a belt and the axkid is belted but wouldn't go in a cab as it has other fixings to attach to the seat in front. My kids are over four so I might get some of those bubble bum boosters to chuck in the boot in case I have this type of emergency, there's been a few other situations where it would have been useful.

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