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Original poster

My child got hurt at school today…

33 replies

Userno36373647346373 · 19/05/2023 20:48

By a child that was dysregulated and having a meltdown. Primary age, junior.

I won’t go into too much detail, to prevent giving myself away. There’s a child in dc’s class who is struggling massively in school and has done for a while, they are are very violent, thrashes stuff around and has attacked teachers and injured them. The kids have had to go outside whilst teacher tried to calm him. They’ve been excluded temporarily before. I’m not sure if said child has Sen or just extreme anger issues or both, who knows.

I can sympathise to an extent. Both mine are autistic with learning needs. Dd who got hurt has a mild physical disability. I know it is not easy and the mother is probably at her wits end. I’m fortunate mine don’t have have any behavioural issues and not violent , even though my oldest can at times explode at home.

anyway dd got hurt today in the crossfire of the child exploding at school. I’m angry at the school, the rest of the class were in class, said child was out of class and exploding in the corridor, dd for whatever reason was in the corridor on her own, I think she was asked to run an errand for the teacher (they like to give dd little jobs ending she likes doing) and ended up getting hurt, not badly but she was shocked and upset.

what do I say? Anything? Nothing? Leave it? Ask to speak to the school again - they did ring me to let me know at the time. I guess there’s nothing I can do 😥

OP posts:
Blort · 19/05/2023 21:02

Of course you can speak to the school, they have a duty of care to keep your child (and the other) safe. Ask them how they plan on doing that and how the error occurred.

N0tfinished · 19/05/2023 22:10

I'm on my sons school board of management. A similar but probably more extreme situation happened to our school recently. It was taken extremely seriously & after consultation the child was expelled.

I would expect a meeting with the principal & I would want to hear how the school plan to manage this incident. At the very least I would want to hear that the other child be given 1/1 support and a plan to deal with outbursts.

Sorry your poor DD was hurt. It must have been so frightening for her

Original poster
Userno36373647346373 · 19/05/2023 22:10

Blort · 19/05/2023 21:02

Of course you can speak to the school, they have a duty of care to keep your child (and the other) safe. Ask them how they plan on doing that and how the error occurred.

thank you, I do believe the school have downplayed it a bit, dc’s version of events is very different and she’s autistic and very honest/doesn’t lie so I am believing her side more. The school couldn’t wait to get me off the phone. I have been thinking about this all evening and I’m just mad, I knew things had been a struggle, I get the boy is probably struggling massively but other children need to be protected! I just don’t get why dd was put in that position, I know things can escalate at the flip of a switch…

OP posts:
Original poster
Userno36373647346373 · 19/05/2023 22:19

N0tfinished · 19/05/2023 22:10

I'm on my sons school board of management. A similar but probably more extreme situation happened to our school recently. It was taken extremely seriously & after consultation the child was expelled.

I would expect a meeting with the principal & I would want to hear how the school plan to manage this incident. At the very least I would want to hear that the other child be given 1/1 support and a plan to deal with outbursts.

Sorry your poor DD was hurt. It must have been so frightening for her

Thank you. A shortage of staff is a massive problem. Dd herself should be getting more support than she is but sadly not getting it.

although I knew there was some significant issues, it just seems to be getting worse and worse!

dd is often in her own world and oblivious to it but today it was just very unfortunate that she was caught up in it.

he was immediately sent to the head but not sure what happened after that other than the staff calming dd down. She’s okay, just shocked and she’s such a kind soul she said its okay she’ll still be his friend 😥 I think because she has an older brother who can occasionally be explosive (although not violent towards her) she is accepting of it but she shouldn’t have to be 😥

due to her own needs she often doesn’t see the wrong in people even if it’s right in front of her!

I am just so sad at the whole situation.

I have been frustrated that dd isn’t getting enough academic support because the staff are often supporting the dysregulated children (more than one). She has an EHC plan which isn’t really being followed but then it’s obvious the explosive kids need the support too and there’s not enough to go doing. I’ve had dd’s speech therapist go in and raise concerns that dd is going under the radar as she’s so compliant at school but her academic progress is slow! I feel like it’s a massive mess right now!

OP posts:
SmurfHaribos · 19/05/2023 22:22

Don’t be angry at the school - be sympathetic! There are so many children with special needs in school nowadays that teachers can’t cope. They are probably being injured regularly themselves. No wonder there is such a shortage of staff. I’m afraid it’s impossible to prevent these things happening. Even if a child has a 1:1 they can still lash out whilst stood right at the teacher’s side.

usererror99 · 19/05/2023 22:33

There are so many children with special needs in school nowadays that teachers can’t cope.

Why is that do we think? Is that the parents pushing for it? Why insist on your child going to a mainstream school where they are going to disrupt everyone else's learning not to mention the effect on staff and the cost to the school and put both staff and children at risk of harm. Why does no one say enough is enough or is that too unpopular to voice?

Pinkflipflop85 · 19/05/2023 22:57

usererror99 · 19/05/2023 22:33

There are so many children with special needs in school nowadays that teachers can’t cope.

Why is that do we think? Is that the parents pushing for it? Why insist on your child going to a mainstream school where they are going to disrupt everyone else's learning not to mention the effect on staff and the cost to the school and put both staff and children at risk of harm. Why does no one say enough is enough or is that too unpopular to voice?

It's not about parents insisting that their children are in mainstream. There are literally not enough places in specialist provision.

PingPongPiddlyPong · 19/05/2023 23:04

Pinkflipflop85 · 19/05/2023 22:57

It's not about parents insisting that their children are in mainstream. There are literally not enough places in specialist provision.

Show quote history

I think it’s both. Not enough special school places and some parents in denial about their children’s needs.
We have a number of children with SEN in a small school and some of them are just about coping but there isn’t enough staff to go round when more than one is having a meltdown at once.
With one pupil we’ve offered numerous suggestions to the parents including chewy jewellery (child will bite himself to get sensory ‘fix’) and all suggestions have been shot down as “he’s fine there’s nothing wrong with him.”

Original poster
Userno36373647346373 · 20/05/2023 06:25

SmurfHaribos · 19/05/2023 22:22

Don’t be angry at the school - be sympathetic! There are so many children with special needs in school nowadays that teachers can’t cope. They are probably being injured regularly themselves. No wonder there is such a shortage of staff. I’m afraid it’s impossible to prevent these things happening. Even if a child has a 1:1 they can still lash out whilst stood right at the teacher’s side.

Totally. But I’m annoyed that the rest of the class were in the class safe and he was locked out (not sure if that’s the right answer or not) and dd for whatever reason not in that classroom with the rest of her class!

OP posts:
Original poster
Userno36373647346373 · 20/05/2023 06:29

Generally there is not enough Sen provision around, I’ve been fighting the system trying to get my own ds into a Sen school as he’s 4-5 years behind academically and now accessing the curriculum at school, this was manageable at primary but not so much at secondary, but because he’s not ‘struggling enough behavioural wise’ he’s not seen as a priority, he has an EHC plan but there’s just enough SEN school places where I live! It’s such a crappy situation all around! My son got 1:1 in primary but cannot get it in secondary as they don’t have enough support staff and those they have are dealing with children who are dysregulating - my son holds it in at school and explodes at home. So I feel like my children are missing out on the right support over lack of staff too.

I don’t know if child in question has SEN, or just anger issues - or a mix of both!

OP posts:
90yomakeuproom · 20/05/2023 06:35

Doesn't DD know why she was out of class? Surely she can tell you that.

BrutusMcDogface · 20/05/2023 06:40

SmurfHaribos · 19/05/2023 22:22

Don’t be angry at the school - be sympathetic! There are so many children with special needs in school nowadays that teachers can’t cope. They are probably being injured regularly themselves. No wonder there is such a shortage of staff. I’m afraid it’s impossible to prevent these things happening. Even if a child has a 1:1 they can still lash out whilst stood right at the teacher’s side.

Yes, this.

roundtable · 20/05/2023 06:40

There's such a massive problem with specialist places for children with send.

I agree with the previous poster who said that there are parents that also insist on mainstream even though it's not suitable. Seems to be particularly prevalent in small villages but the majority are just struggling through mainstream due to the lack of places.

I have a child, possibly children with send but because they is well behaved at school they are down the bottom of the list for any outside involvement. For one dc, the frustration and his own difficulty to learn and retain information is increased by the high level of disruption that goes on around him in the classroom. Staff are doing their best to manage it. Plus trying to teach a crammed and difficult curriculum. They're losing tas too because of their budgets.

The system is broken and the people(government) who should be fixing it simply don't care.

All the children are being failed.

roundtable · 20/05/2023 06:42

I hope your dd okay op.

BrutusMcDogface · 20/05/2023 06:42

usererror99 · 19/05/2023 22:33

There are so many children with special needs in school nowadays that teachers can’t cope.

Why is that do we think? Is that the parents pushing for it? Why insist on your child going to a mainstream school where they are going to disrupt everyone else's learning not to mention the effect on staff and the cost to the school and put both staff and children at risk of harm. Why does no one say enough is enough or is that too unpopular to voice?

There just isn’t enough specialist provision. Believe me, nobody wants these children to be in mainstream schools where their needs cannot be met, least of all the parents or the children themselves.

Random789 · 20/05/2023 06:46

"Don’t be angry at the school - be sympathetic!"
I think it is completely evident from userno's posts how sympathetic and understanding she is towards the school and the difficulties faced by the disruptive child. That's one of the reasons why I think a meeting with the school would hopefully be productive.

OP, I'm sorry that your daughter went through something so distressing. Yes, do ask for a meeting, partly to help you to process and understand the events for your own sake and in order to support your daughter through it. But mostly of course to advocate for a more sustainable response to this difficult situation, nd more attention to your daughter's needs. It is clear that you would be a very constructive presence that might help them to work out a better management of the situation (not that you should need to do this of course,but it does seem that they aren't managing as well as they should)

Your daughter sounds absolutely lovely, by the way. Flowers

AnnWithoutAnnie · 20/05/2023 06:53

@Userno36373647346373

Poor DD. She sounds lovely.

Dd is often in her own world and oblivious to it but today it was just very unfortunate that she was caught up in it

but I think this is the bottom line really. It was an unfortunate 'wrong time, wrong place' situation. DD obviously enjoys the little jobs she gets to do, it's really good for their confidence & self esteem etc. Her return to the classroom was just bad timing. Perhaps the teacher didn't expect her bac so quickly, or had been looking out for her and briefly looked away?

i think your issue is with the lack of help DD is getting & this has just erupted your thoughts/feelings around that. which you need to address separately to this incident.

maybe ask the school what you can do to aid them get the help DD needs.

Don't put her off being the compassionate, loving, caring wee thing she is or stop them asking her to do the little jobs (so good for her confidence)

Lemursandions · 20/05/2023 06:58

Personally I spent way way too long being sympathetic with the school when it came to my DC with SEN needs. Whilst obviously you should always be polite, standing up for your child’s needs is perfectly OK!

OP I think as long as you are polite I would raise this with the school to understand how your daughter was put in that position and what can be done to avoid it in future. Your daughter sounds a lovely, kind girl. Hopefully this little boy can also get the support he needs ( and very sadly it often means he will need to be excluded to stand a chance of getting a place in specialist provision of that is needed)

SEN provision is indeed a complete mess and I agree it is very difficult for schools in many ways ( I was also a governor). However it is also not Ok for schools not to follow EHCPs ( happened with my son) - many schools also do not ensure they are getting the correct funding for EHCPs - not pleasant but schools can challenge the LA as it is the LAs responsibility to fund section F ( again I’m not naive and know this isn’t easy/often takes time/ many section Fs are too lightly drafted).

I also saw with my son once he started medication and his more disruptive behaviour stopped school saw it as ‘job done’. Very little attempt to provide his EHCP requirements which allow him to access the curriculum. 1:1 instead used to support other children etc.

As a SEN parent you are often made to feel as if you should be grateful of any support your child gets! But these children have just the same rights to education as every other child.

YouJustDoYou · 20/05/2023 07:00

The school have a duty to protect children. The children are not being protected.

switswoo81 · 20/05/2023 07:07

I am the teacher in your situation. The other day I removed a child that I could see was being triggered from the situation before a meltdown and to prevent another child from being hurt and the parent of the child went straight to the head to say I was taking away her childs right to play with other children .
You and your daughter have my sympathy. It's really not nice for her at all.

Original poster
Userno36373647346373 · 20/05/2023 08:56

Thanks all, dd is a lovely girl, despite having her own needs mainly around speech & language & her academic ability she’s confident, popular and generally loves school and is very settled. I have been frustrated with the school in general with lack of support over the last year or so.

there is a serious lack of Sen provision. The LA here will do everything possible me to avoid moving a child unless they really have to. I know of a few children they have not been in school for months as there are no suitable schools. A crappy situation all around.

OP posts:
Original poster
Userno36373647346373 · 20/05/2023 08:59

It was definitely the unfortunate case of wrong time, wrong place!

OP posts:
CwmYoy · 20/05/2023 09:06

Take your complaint as far as you can.

There is no room in mainstream schools for violent children and I'm guessing then staff would be relieved if the child was excluded. No one should be attacked in school - the head needs to deal with it.

HauntedPencil · 20/05/2023 09:06

It's been our experience having a v similar situation in a DCs class that the parents were desperate for better or more suitable provision but there didn't seem to be any until the child was excluded and even before then the children are moved around a few schools to be excluded. It's horrible for everyone concerned isn't it.

raincamepouringdown · 20/05/2023 09:22

usererror99 · 19/05/2023 22:33

There are so many children with special needs in school nowadays that teachers can’t cope.

Why is that do we think? Is that the parents pushing for it? Why insist on your child going to a mainstream school where they are going to disrupt everyone else's learning not to mention the effect on staff and the cost to the school and put both staff and children at risk of harm. Why does no one say enough is enough or is that too unpopular to voice?

Do you know how hard it is to get a space in a special needs school, even if you want your child to go to one? We have a shocking number of children in our primary school that desperately need 1:1s or 1:2s, and we can't get them approved, or when we do have them approved, get anyone to fill the roles. Not enough support staff as it stands. And a significant number already on waiting lists for special school places ... that just don't exist. The special schools are full and have their own issues with a revolving door of staff who don't stick around due to too many demands and too little pay.

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