What is really going on in our schools? Well, Laura....

[noblegiraffe]

Laura Kuenssberg appears to have just discovered that schools exist. New to the concept she has written an essay discussing what might be going on in them, from the perspective of someone who doesn't know what they are talking about. Basic errors include "standards haven't crashed because GCSE and A-level results in 2022 were up on 2019".

She mentions the lack of funding, but doesn't mention the lack of teachers. She mentions increased pupil absence but doesn't mention the implosion of support services for children like CAMHS, or the huge waiting lists for SEN diagnosis and the cutting of TAs in schools due to lack of money. She suggests covid might have had an impact, but not that the government have done basically nothing to address this and that their covid catch-up adviser resigned in disgust.

She says a minister says that 'teachers have had a bashing since covid'. Since covid! She doesn't mention this is led by the government and has been going on for years.

So, what's really going on in our schools? Anyone want to help Laura out?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-65360168

Eventually, yes, the only education available from the state will be online. It will be a disaster (as it was during the pandemic). Jaron Lanier predicted a good 10 years ago now, that being taught in person, writing on paper and reading physical books, will become the type of education available only to elites in private schools.

With regards to the 'bad behaviour is caused by microplastics' theory, how about teaching kids how to follow instructions whilst that research is being conducted? You know, just in case it isn't down to external factors conveniently beyond a parent's control. It sounds like a cop out to me -'Oh, darling Artemis will climb up the curtains. We believe it's caused by microplastics' - rather than, 'Microplastics or not, in this house no-one swings from the soft furnishings. Get down and go outside to run about.'

It's interesting that a number of posters have gone straight to the Finnish system when Finland no longer tops the international league tables. Countries like China and Japan are on top, where teachers are very well respected, school days are very long, the onus is on the student to succeed, education in general is held in high esteem, and students in China especially will also have tuition and perhaps even classes on a weekend. Even Estonia scores far higher than Finland, but there is high amounts of pressure from parents for their child to succeed and parents take education very seriously, even though technically they don't have much homework.

I couldn't agree more.

That is my approach, @Alighttouchonthetiller .
However, I can't tell you the number of whinges I get from parents for having "picked on" their child and "punished them" when, according to the parent who wasn't there at the time to see what I as the teacher was witnessing, "it wasn't their fault."

I had a parent complain about me recently because I'd infringed her 18 year old son's human rights.
I'd asked him to get off his phone in a part of the school that he knows he's not allowed to use it in. In order to do this, I had rudely interrupted his phone call, and when he'd said "I'm on the phone. Wait" to me, I'd pointed out that that was unacceptable.
When I'd then caught him again on the same day, I reported him to his head of year.
Apparently, telling a student to follow the rules that they've agreed to is against their human rights.

Appalling and unworkable for schools and nurseries.

funnily enough, all the top countries on the league tables are all those that value education and have a much more hierarchical society - a “respect your elders” society. Respect is not “earnt”, it is automatically given to parents/grandparents/teachers and other authority figures.
those countries have access to screens just as much as our kids do, so screens and technology are not the full issue. The erosion of parenting and boundaries, and the word “no”, have a much more significant impact on behaviour

Interesting - can't imagine China uses less plastics than us

There are 2 different strands here though. Those non verbal / not toliet trained children in year 2, don't need firmer discipline and to respect their elders surely ? They need a diagnosis, an EHCP and to have their needs met. That is entirely different to a mouthy 18 yo.

I hear you. I get this, too.

@MrsHamlet - that situation rings many bells with me.

Time was, if a student was being reprimanded, that was the end of the discussion. Many of my students now seem to take an instruction or reprimand as the opening to an extended negotiation whereby they mistakenly believe that their 'right' to do as they please somehow trumps the rights of others to be educated. And the parents back them up. It's astonishing.

No I think all children, sen or no SEN should be taught to respect adults and do as they are asked.
and although some lack of toilet training is down to SEN, a lot is down to having two full time working parents who simply do not have the time and knowledge/resources/support of how to toilet train. That’s why it’s suddenly so common as opposed to a rarity.

Absolutely. But if parents would parent, then the chances of those children in real need being helped is increased, as less time would be spent trying to teach darling Artemis to follow basic societal norms.

20% of our classes taught by long term supply teachers. We can't recruit, despite being a really lovely school.

Are you a teacher? Some DCs with really high needs really can't be taught to follow verbal instructions.

Yes, but it's a circle. If parents backed the teachers in regards to behaviour and homework, then behaviour would be less of an issue in schools. If parents valued education and pushed at their end, instead of coming with "you don't need to try in X subject, it's not important", then teachers wouldn't be putting in so much time and effort in contacting home, speaking with HoY, running intervention sessions to cover their own backs when it came round to performance management reviews. If the support was there and the behaviour issues were gone, teachers would have more time to support with SEND children, and maybe our TAs would stay despite the crappy pay. Instead, they are issues, so our TAs don't stay, and our teachers feel demoralised and it fuels the decision to leave. We have to increase class sizes, the teacher has less time to support SEND students, more kids in a class means more behaviour issues, and more students to get through the exam with less time for each of them.

Bob, in y10, has shocking attendance.
This means he's got very little idea what's going on in class.
He doesn't do homework.
If he's put in lunchtime detention for not doing homework, he doesn't come.
If he's put in afterschool detention, he doesn't come.
He lacks focus, is rude, and has never been told "no" or "stop".
He is not neurodiverse. There are no SEN. He's simply a badly behaved, pandered to young man.
I spend a significant proportion of lesson time trying to get him to where he needs to be at the expense of everyone else. I am not allowed to send him elsewhere, do everyone else on the class has to suffer him. This is happening every lesson every day he's in.
And then his parents have the brass neck to complain that I've given him low predictions and bad marks for effort.

I am but in a mainstream secondary so most students with such severe need that you describe would have elected to go to special school before they reach my classroom. I imagine those children are the minority though, and as I’ve stated further up the thread, my most difficult classes are actually the average intelligence non SEN students, who simply cannot listen and follow instructions.

I could have written this post, @MrsHamlet

It's so time-consuming, energy-sapping and demoralising.

@Alighttouchonthetiller yes. 32 other people have to put up with his attention grabbing, attention sapping bullshit every lesson. It's not okay at all.
Last assessment, he was fuming that Fred (who he considers inferior in every way) got a better mark.
Well, Bob, Fred turns up, pays attention, does homework and acts on feedback. So maybe there's a correlation.
"Nah. You favourite him, innit"
Sigh.

Bob in year 10. His mum takes him on spontaneous bonding weekends abroad meaning he regularly misses my Friday and Monday lessons and doesn't bother to catch up, despite me putting the work on teams. Bob is now well behind his peers so demands more of my time in class needing more reassurance or unable to do work thats built on this missed knowledge. Bob randomly talks at inappropriate times, not to be malicious but because he has no filter or self control, such as asking another student where he got his football boots from whilst I'm giving instructions on a task, or telling a friend across the room about the drama at breaktime when he should be focused on a task. If I give warnings to Bob, Bob complains that I am being too strict and he can't do the work because it's too hard. If I sit with Bob, he can do the work. Bob's mum thinks I should therefore be sat with Bob giving him that attention that he needs, which means I am neglecting the other 33 year 10s in that class. Bob has no SEN.

@TheNefariousOrange My Bob and your Bob are clearly related.

I’m a parent, not a teacher. I think the teachers at my kids’ schools (two different state secondaries, I have a year 7 and year 11) are doing a great job. They both have teachers they like and who seem to like them and they are both doing well.

My impression is, though, that schools do make kids’ lives a bit more difficult in lots of small ways that add up. They can’t go to the toilet in break times (why?)The lunch queues are enormous so they spend all lunch time queuing. I hear of kids getting detentions for not tucking in their shirts (why? - it seems such an overreaction). And other small injustices that kids really dislike. At the same time I hear of vaping in the toilets that seems to go unchallenged.

Clearly I’m getting the child’s eye view of it. As a parent, some of this seems to be about funding - shortages of kitchen staff and supervisory staff? But what is the uniform thing about? Are we going too far in treating kids like potential troublemakers?

Someone mentioned the Stolen Focus book upthread, which I also found very interesting. One of the points it makes very well is about stress - and how kids find it hard to concentrate when their family lives are stressed. They’re constantly distracted by worries. You can’t underplay the role of parents having more stressful lives - expensive housing and uncertainty about employment both feed into this. I imagine that’s true for their teachers too.

They need to tuck their shirts in because society has certain expectations and they need to get used to those.

They aren't allowed to the toilet because Bob (see above) and his twatty mates wrecked the toilets one lesson, and Chanel, Skyelar and the bitchy girl groups vape in them. There's nobody to watch the loos during lessons because the teachers are.....teaching

So yes, they're shut. The teachers have to develop bladder control and deal with periods (hello, peri-menopausal flooding). I once had a yr10 whine like a little baby he needed a wee during lesson. I was 36 weeks pregnant and bursting myself but had to just you know, carry on regardless.

Half the kids these are are massive, massive whiny babies. They want everything their way, now and nobody else gets consideration.

The queue has always been an issue; I remember queuing and having to scoff food at school. If they don't like it, send him in with a packed lunch. That's not an example of the school making his life harder, that's him having to learn he doesn't get what he wants immediately and he had to wait his turn.

Students can't go to the toilet because they vandalise them, vape and meet up for sex in the toilets, so it's now a safeguarding concern. In the working world, if you have a meeting, you know to pee beforehand because you wouldn't just get up in the middle of it and leave your client.