Bullies - do you think they ever feel bad?

[Wondrouswonder]

Was just wondering; do you think bullies ever know what they did was fundamentally wrong, or do you think they don’t care? Do you think they ever feel bad? I don’t just mean childhood bullies, I mean those that do it in adulthood too.

so as not to drip feed, I was never bullied as a child but experienced awful work place bullying about a year ago by a new colleague the same age (early 20’s). She managed to totally ostracise me from the team, refused to talk or acknowledge my prescence in the end, and would whisper (about me I’m assuming) then go deadly silent when I would walk past. She also spread malicious lies about me in a professional capacity, and would do silly things like ‘accidentally’ knock the papers off my desk and refuse to pick them up, or accidentally push past me and brush my shoulder. At the time it was really upsetting and I didn’t understand what I had done, and I felt ridiculous feeling like that as an adult- but now she has (thankfully) moved team, the more I’ve thought about it the more I realise it was likely due to her own insecurities of herself and maybe her own lack of self worth. The more I think about it now I feel sorry for her more than anything else because I realise she must have been a very unhappy individual. I always wonder if she ever felt bad for what happened or even registered that what she was doing was wrong.

I don't think adults do, they should already know better, its a power trip for them but i do think some children grow and mature and some will regret their actions, often they have terrible home lives themselves.

I do.

I was a bully as a teenager. I am not sure I really realised it at the time, but I do now and really wish I could go back and change it.

Really interesting responses, thank you. Have you ever tried to reach out to those that you bullied or ever come into contact with them if you don’t mind me asking?

I don't think they realise sometimes, I have said to someone I think a lot of, that they are a bully at times, and to some people in particular and they were horrified, truly so, because they never saw themselves that way, more being assertive or standing their ground, or doing what they thought was best in the circumstances (I'm talking in work here) and that the person/people needed to hear the feedback because it was detrimental to others.
For some though, I don't think they set out to be bullies, but there's a rush from it, from the power that it gives you over someone else and that can be a heady feeling and hard to stop seeking.

We have a couple of people at work I'd describe as bullies. They're all for giving out little gifts to everyone or bringing in cakes. Yet treat people really badly. They've no self awareness at all. I would never work in their area if I could help it. At the base of it, I'd say they didn't come from normal, loving families. They've got a chip on their shoulder.

I was bullied at work from 18 to about 25 by the same person. It's embarrassing because as an adult you think you should be able to deal with these things. But looking back I can see that it was her issue and that some people in life are just horrible and that's all there is to it. I wish I had spoken up at the time. I doubt she has regrets. Child bullies may grow up and see the error of their ways, but adult bullies have probably been bullies their whole lives and won't change.

Wow, I experienced this in my late forties at work, like you, I wasn't bullied at school. This woman at work just decided that I was not going to be included and she only ever spoke to me if it was to insinuate that I'd said something risky/rude/inappropriate or obvious. The rest of the time I was like a ghost. She had the butter wouldn't melt kind of demeanour though. It was such a strange experience which upset me at the time.

It's so hard to know how to handle it because when somebody ices you, there's nothing to query with them. They have plausible deniability and they know it. If you say anything, you seem needy.

All I can recommend is to practice self -compassion (like literally, you deserve it right now, get the work book of mindful self=compassion from kirsten neff phd and christopher germer phd) and do the exercises. I also listened to an audible of a book I'd read by Edith Hall, it's called Aristotle's Way and it's about values but it's an entertaining listen. It made me feel relief that I was a self - aware decent human being and although at the time I felt unpopular, I kind of knew that nobody disliked me.

If it happened to me again I think I'd use the shine a light on it technique to nip it in the bud. Say with GOOD HUMOUR, ''I feel like you're ignoring me Regina! Is that your intention?!'' (*say this with two witnesses so it can't be misquoted that you were needy/accusatory). The chances are the bully will say 'oh no no no'' especially with witnesses, in which case you say with insouciance ''I'm glad I was wrong'' and you have to give them the benefit of the doubt. Don't say another word. Act like they've told the truth.

If they say something along the lines of defending their right to ignore you, or defending their right to never speak to you when there are other people around, say ''absolutely, I get it, but we're not 15 so can you do me a favour and just well hide your dislike of me? cheers''.

ps, and the reason the 'shine a light' technique works apparently is because it shows them that you have a bit more backbone than they'd thought. It shows them that you're not as terrified of confrontation as they'd assumed.

I’m really sorry that you were bullied and I agree that the people must just be very unhappy. People who are hugely judgemental and unforgiving of others/punish others are usually 100x more so to themselves. People who ostracise others usually do so because they live in a kill or be killed reality where they only way to be included is to exclude others. It is sad. Maybe with self growth they will look back and feel bad. But they deserve our pity if they never even get to that stage.

I was bullied in my first year at secondary school. Later on I ended up becoming friends with one of the girls who had said horrible things to me. I asked her about it and she had no recollection of any of it and was horrified. Assume at the time she just saw it as throwaway comments and didn't think of the impact.

Wow @xJoy sounds really similar to my experience. I felt really silly at the time for being so bothered by it, but I feel even now a year later i still think about it and just can’t understand what would motivate someone to try and make someone feel so bad. I’ve thought of lots of things I should have said / done at the time but very much in a hindsight way, she was a pathological liar and I was worried she would get me sacked or something 🤦‍♀️

I agree with others on the thread that In reality I don’t think adult bullies can really regret their actions and it’s likely to be a pattern of behaviour that’s carried on from school I guess. I am curious to know what motivates it though, is it wanting power over someone / trying to punish someone else or give someone the same experience they had etc.

@Blueberrywitch i think this is it in a nutshell. The more I’ve thought about it over the last year (and I don’t know why It bothers me so much) the more I think she must have been really unhappy, but then I get cross st myself for feeling sorry for her!

I did a child development and mental health course recently and one of the things they said in the is that the act of bullying someone actually negatively impacts the person bullying and bullies tend to have much worse mental health outcomes in the longer term than those they bully.

"Children and adolescents who are bullies are at increased risk for substance use, academic problems and depression later in life.

That cheered me up loads. It shouldn't but I was bullied a lot as a child, so screw them.

Apparently those who were bullied and then bully others "are at greater risk for mental and behavioral problems than those who are only bullied or who are only bullies."

I think childhood bullies may reflect later on life but adult bullies, no.

I was bullied so badly in a job until I was almost at the brink of ending it all. Then the company was sold by the parent company, almost all staff made redundant including the two bullies, while I kept my job and went to work in the parent company.

One of the two bullies got a job in a well-known luxury fashion company in London and boasted endlessly about it, however I already knew that my friend who worked there had always said it was a toxic environment, lots of competitiveness and judgemental bullying going on particularly with the clothes you wear to work. Being a luxury fashion company it wasn’t ‘done’ to turn up in bog standard High St clothing if you didn’t want to be targeted. Said bully only ever shopped in Primark & H&M and would come back from Oxford St each and every lunchtime with bags from both retailers. I always did wonder how she got on wearing these brands in such a luxury brand environment and if she was ever on the receiving end of feeling even just a little like she treated me.

I think if you've reached adulthood and are still bullying, it's less likely that you think you're doing anything wrong. I imagine lots of former child bullies do feel bad though.

Yes. Two people.

One didn’t seem to see it as a problem, was seemingly genuinely delighted to see me etc. Minimised my apology and said it hadn’t been a big deal (although I am pretty sure it was at the time). I would often bump into him and there were big smiles and hugs each time.

Other kept me at a polite distance. Thanked me for my apology but politely shut down any further conversation. Which I obviously respected.

I saw my bully recently. She used to call me fugly, midget and fatty at school. She attacked me once after school. These days she would get arrested.

Anyway, I saw her in a shop. She wasn't very attractive. And I had just lost 3 stone and had my hair done (still average though haha!). My gorgeous husband was holding my hand. And she sheepishly said smiled at me.

And I said "I'm sorry, do I know you?"

She was SO embarrassed. And confused. And off I strutted with my lovely husband.

I finally won.

That made me smile. Well done you.

I have no idea what my bullies are up to. I'd not recognise them if I ran over them... repeatedly.

I think cognitive dissonance will make them justify what they’re doing, they probably still feel uncomfortable, but will suppress the bad feeling by convincing themselves they are justified in some way - Sarah is too soft and should speak up, Sarah is too perfect, Sarah is too whatever that is a threat to them, or makes Sarah a suitable target (people pleasing, non confrontational individual ) they can use to rally folk around them to to make them feel powerful.
I think adult bullies were likely childhood bullies, it’s a strategy that will have worked for them since childhood, so they’ve no reason to stop behaving that way.

@NomadicSpirit thank you! I keep replaying it in my head. That memory is now stronger than the memory of her kicking my head. Thankfully.

The other bully from my year is now a deputy headteacher at the local secondary school. I don't like this AT ALL.
She used to push over poorer kids, take their shoes and put them in the wheelie bins. I can't believe she now works with children!!