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Ed Sec looking to reduce teacher workload to avert strikes (England)

281 replies

noblegiraffe · 16/02/2023 17:55

The Telegraph is reporting that Gillian Keegan has instructed the DfE to look into ways to reduce teacher workload to avoid strike action, because the government is still refusing to look at pay either this year or next.

Apparently teachers spend 22 hours a week teaching and 29 hours a week on non-teaching tasks according to research by Ofsted in 2019.

Suggestions to reduce this include 'websites that mark answers for you in maths' (Are there any maths departments without a subscription to one of these already?), and stopping trying to quantify progress for Ofsted.

Better suggestions would be:
Scrapping Ofsted graded inspections and replacing with safeguarding checks
Increasing the number of qualified teachers (improving pay would help here) to reduce workload for experienced teachers who have to plan/support/pick up after supply or unqualified teachers
Guaranteed minimum one PPA per day (this would need more teachers, see above)
Funding CAMHS and stopping expecting teachers to do this job
Funding SEN provision properly

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/02/15/teachers-workloads-could-cut-bid-halt-strikes-schools/ (paywalled)

OP posts:
MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:06

We need AP for several students urgently. There are theoretical places but not until y11 leave. That's months away.

DrHousecuredme · 18/02/2023 17:07

I'd bring in:
1.Huge changes to OFSTED so a school is paired with one inspector who supports them rather than a team making judgements.

  1. No expectation of weekly meetings, they happen only as and when strictly needed and online from home where possible.
  2. Heads required to publish calendars in advance so if we have to work until 6pm we know several weeks in advance and can plan childcare properly.
  3. Increased PPA and or subject management time out of class.
  4. 3 flexi paid days per year that teachers can request for personal events.
  5. Better staffing in school EG mid-day mealtime staff so I don't lose my lunchtimes covering.
Postapocalypticcowgirl · 18/02/2023 17:11

Just to talk about inclusion a bit further, this year I teach a BTEC Applied Science group of 14 students. Now, it's a level 3 course, so they do all have some grade 4s at GCSE. But within the group I have a few students with SEN such as dyslexia or slow processing, a couple with ASD, a few with MH needs or health needs.

Because it's a small group, I can support them effectively. Because they've all chosen to be there, behaviour is not an issue, so I can spend time supporting one or two students, knowing the others will be broadly on task. We can work (up to a point) at a pace that suits the students, and if they ask if we can do xyz to help them, usually I can accomdate this!

It's actually one of my favourite classes to teach this year!

But I can imagine supporting some of these students in a GCSE class of 30+ would be a nightmare- some of them are definitely capable of higher GCSE grades than they achieved, had they been in a smaller group.

But increasingly, even students who are really struggling to access the curriculum don't get small group teaching. Our bottom set in Y11 this year is over 20 students.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:13

We don't even have "bottom sets" in English. All if our current y11 classes are 28+

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 18/02/2023 17:14

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:06

We need AP for several students urgently. There are theoretical places but not until y11 leave. That's months away.

We are lucky in that there's a good range of AP locally and it seems to have capacity to take students when referred BUT the aim of the AP is always to return to mainstream. And it seems like once they've been sent back to mainstream, they can't go back to the same AP- it's a bit odd.

In a previous school we had a student who was making good progress in AP returned in Y10, and it caused a really serious incident. He then seemed to fall between services- he wasn't safe for us to have in school, and so ended up I think with just a few hours a week of home tutoring, which really isn't right for him.

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:16

I have a group with targets from 2-8. Luckily (!) the student with the 2 target got an AP place after being repeatedly excluded for his violent behaviour - the last time for launching a chair at the head in his readmission meeting.

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:18

We are very limited for AP. One child travels 100 miles a day by taxi to AP. That might well fall through soon though - his behaviour there is becoming a problem. So he'll be back with us and we'll have to try to stop him attacking people until we can find something else.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 18/02/2023 17:18

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:13

We don't even have "bottom sets" in English. All if our current y11 classes are 28+

TBF, current Y10 to reduce staffing need, there's essentially triple and top/middle/bottom on each "side" of the year- so those bottom sets are even larger.

But Y11 are a legacy system where they were set across the whole year for science, and the bottom set includes some really high needs kids. There's one teacher and one TA, to support 20 students, I think at least 80% of them must have some SEN, whether diagnosed or not.

I'm not sure if mixed ability would be better, as then at least those with high needs are spread across multiple groups, but I don't know how you match the needs of a student who is likely to get 9-9 with one who will get 2-3 on a good day, especially in terms of the amount of content they need to know in detail.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 18/02/2023 17:21

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:16

I have a group with targets from 2-8. Luckily (!) the student with the 2 target got an AP place after being repeatedly excluded for his violent behaviour - the last time for launching a chair at the head in his readmission meeting.

I know a lot of the evidence says mixed ability is best, but I genuinely don't understand how teachers can give everyone the best education across such a wide range? Either the kids at the top get let down on the basis they can teach themselves (they can't, always) or the kids at the bottom get left behind because the pace is too high.

I do think it's mad that a student who is probably the size of an adult and is violent is seen as suitable to be in mainstream education.

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:25

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 18/02/2023 17:21

I know a lot of the evidence says mixed ability is best, but I genuinely don't understand how teachers can give everyone the best education across such a wide range? Either the kids at the top get let down on the basis they can teach themselves (they can't, always) or the kids at the bottom get left behind because the pace is too high.

I do think it's mad that a student who is probably the size of an adult and is violent is seen as suitable to be in mainstream education.

In English we're completely untiered and I do think that there's some evidence to suggest that you can get students from 4-5 by teaching them the skills for the top band.
But Bob who can't read can't access any of it, and he's failed by mixed ability. Of course, putting Bob in what becomes a behaviour group also fails him.
We have a similarly violent, in need of AP, year 9. He violently assaulted a TA in primary and it took us years to get him an ECHP. He's also a runner and an excellent climber of fences.

user1471427614 · 18/02/2023 17:32

FrippEnos · 18/02/2023 16:41

I still don't have one in my classroom. Unless its been fitted over half term

Me neither. Dont think we have any in school or at least not the 30 or so classrooms I've been in

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 18/02/2023 18:34

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 17:25

In English we're completely untiered and I do think that there's some evidence to suggest that you can get students from 4-5 by teaching them the skills for the top band.
But Bob who can't read can't access any of it, and he's failed by mixed ability. Of course, putting Bob in what becomes a behaviour group also fails him.
We have a similarly violent, in need of AP, year 9. He violently assaulted a TA in primary and it took us years to get him an ECHP. He's also a runner and an excellent climber of fences.

Bob probably needs specialist teaching though, right- I mean, if he can't read, he's unlikely to access the GCSE? What he really needs is a qualification and teaching suited to him, which often doesn't happen in Y9.

Locally to me, a student was really seriously injured climbing a fence last year. I don't think they were even a runner- just had stayed after school late for a club and decided to climb the fence rather than walk the long way around. Anyway, it really scares me!

I think I've been lucky in that at all the schools I've worked in, violence to staff has pretty much led to an automatic exclusion (as has serious violence to students, except in two cases- one the school got the paperwork wrong, one the LA fucked up in a way that I don't fully understand).

RockyOfTheRovers · 18/02/2023 19:40

DrHousecuredme · 18/02/2023 17:07

I'd bring in:
1.Huge changes to OFSTED so a school is paired with one inspector who supports them rather than a team making judgements.

  1. No expectation of weekly meetings, they happen only as and when strictly needed and online from home where possible.
  2. Heads required to publish calendars in advance so if we have to work until 6pm we know several weeks in advance and can plan childcare properly.
  3. Increased PPA and or subject management time out of class.
  4. 3 flexi paid days per year that teachers can request for personal events.
  5. Better staffing in school EG mid-day mealtime staff so I don't lose my lunchtimes covering.

I like these suggestions, but it’s hard to see how 6 would work in the current climate. Mid day meals staff are increasingly difficult to recruit because the only people who can afford to do the job are those who don’t need to work. It’s not enough hours to qualify as being employed for Universal Credit purposes (so they’re pushed into applying for other positions) and the pay is below the threshold to count as qualifying towards a state pension.

doubleshift · 18/02/2023 21:20

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 21:25

Of course inclusion is part of a civilised society. But our society does not adequately fund inclusion.
It's "writing children off" to say that.

doubleshift · 18/02/2023 21:27

Thanks for deleting me but allowing ableist comments about ending inclusion to stand.

Sherrystrull · 18/02/2023 21:29

Posters have been talking about how inclusion only works with correct funding.

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 21:30

It's not writing children off to say that

doubleshift · 18/02/2023 21:30

When I think about where my autistic child could have ended up if it wasn't for the fantastic mainstream small independent school that's she's in, I despair. A world away from the state school she was in before. All paid for by the local authority who recognised that the teachers in their local maintained schools wouldn't allow her to wear her top button undone as it broke "uniform policy".

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 21:33

doubleshift · 18/02/2023 21:30

When I think about where my autistic child could have ended up if it wasn't for the fantastic mainstream small independent school that's she's in, I despair. A world away from the state school she was in before. All paid for by the local authority who recognised that the teachers in their local maintained schools wouldn't allow her to wear her top button undone as it broke "uniform policy".

I'm glad that was possible. Not all LAs would be so accommodating. And that is exactly the problem we're talking about.

doubleshift · 18/02/2023 21:33

@Sherrystrull not all posters have said that. Some were just wanted an easy life with no extra work caused by children who need some adjustments.

My deleted point about it being unacceptable not to change a restaurant menu for allergies still stands. This is the basis of inclusion. For ALL needs.

Find me a PRU where 3 A Levels and a UCAS application can be done?

doubleshift · 18/02/2023 21:36

@MrsHamlet almost all the children in this school are funded by the LA. It's a mainstream private school with caring staff, small classes, forest school, wrap around care etc.
Local authorities are being forced to spend millions of pounds on private school places because maintained schools just respond "can't meet need" to consultations.
Their staff can't be arsed with the hassle.

Sherrystrull · 18/02/2023 21:37

doubleshift · 18/02/2023 21:33

@Sherrystrull not all posters have said that. Some were just wanted an easy life with no extra work caused by children who need some adjustments.

My deleted point about it being unacceptable not to change a restaurant menu for allergies still stands. This is the basis of inclusion. For ALL needs.

Find me a PRU where 3 A Levels and a UCAS application can be done?

I haven't read any threads that say that.

It's great that your daughter received support. However there are many many children who aren't receiving the correct funding or support.

Sherrystrull · 18/02/2023 21:38

It's hugely insulting to say they can't be arsed to meet need. I spend all day every day trying to meet the needs of all 30 children in my class. Without funding and support it's increasingly impossible.

MrsHamlet · 18/02/2023 21:39

doubleshift · 18/02/2023 21:36

@MrsHamlet almost all the children in this school are funded by the LA. It's a mainstream private school with caring staff, small classes, forest school, wrap around care etc.
Local authorities are being forced to spend millions of pounds on private school places because maintained schools just respond "can't meet need" to consultations.
Their staff can't be arsed with the hassle.

It's not about "not being arsed with the hassle". It's about not having the money or the staff to provide small classes. That's why we can't meet the need.