DS11 - constant detentions for low level stuff at school

[Bookendedbylife]

My son started secondary last Sept, local state school that’s well regarded and fairly focused on academic performance. It’s a ‘hard to get into’ school as the catchment is tiny.

My son seems happy there, but there have been issues in his teaching group with 3 or 4 pretty disruptive kids, 2 of which have been moved. Things settled down for a bit but the head of year admitted to me it was a challenging group.

The problem is my son is constantly getting pulled up for - what seems to me - fairly minor things. Not wearing his blazer immediately after a class resulted in a detention. He got another detention for ‘not having the right equipment’ for class - turned out he didn’t have a red pen.
He’s been getting 2 or 3 detentions a week for the past month or so now and most of them seem to me to be for chatting, and not focusing properly in class. Seems pretty minor stuff tbh. At first, he was scared of getting a detention but now he’s completely not bothered, and the whole thing seems to be backfiring (in my view) ie it’s no deterrent at all.

Any advice on how I handle it at home? I’m getting pretty worried about it as it is demoralising for him, and not having any real impact as far as I can see, and if things don’t improve I’m worried they’ll try and force him out or something.

Why the name change?

I think you should not focus on what other children do or don't do. For some reason, your boy is aligning with the badly behaved children, possibly in an attempt to fit in. You could ask for him to move class although at this stage in the session, it's not advisable. Is he with these other children all the time? That's a bit unusual as even at that stage classes are broad banded. He does need to know that there are consequences to his behaviour. The school have put him on a behaviour contract which is not a first stage intervention. It needs to be taken seriously by you and your son. What consequences does he have at home? He is in danger, regardless of how bright you think he is, of not fulfilling his potential. And then it'll be a downward spiral.

I know something needs to change. Something isn't working. My son hasn't been assessed for adhd but nothing came up at primary school and I don't think it's that. In some ways, the lack of focus fits, but in other ways, it doesn't - he is pretty organised on the whole (despite what it may sound like here) and is able to defer appreciation, look to the long-term, has impulse control, etc.

I am just not sure how to tackle it. I can talk to him until I'm blue in the face but until he 'gets' it, what is the answer? Some of it is just down to immaturity I think, and wanting to be liked.

Namechange as I couldn't log in for some reason. Nothing suspicious 😕

Talking to him isn't really identifying immediate consequences though. Do you remove privileges? Take away his phone? One parent I knew sat in class and observed her son. I'm not suggesting that but he didn't like it one little bit! What do the school suggest when you tell them how you have tried to support them? Have you asked for ideas?

You need to come down hard on him, to sort these things. You seem very passive. If you were a teacher those things are very disruptive.

Just because nothing was flagged at primary level does not rule it out. Changes of routine , environment and expectations can expose issues with coping and self organisation. Could his behaviour be masking a lack of confidence and understanding.

He’s been getting 2 or 3 detentions a week for the past month or so now and most of them seem to me to be for chatting, and not focusing properly in class. Seems pretty minor stuff tbh.

That is not minor, and I can't believe you think it's not a big deal. 2/3 times a week, and you haven't given him any consequences? It's not just affecting your dc's learning, it's affecting other children too.

I think I am probably being passive. I had hoped it would sort itself out if I'm honest, once he had settled in properly and got used to the new routine. But it seems not. I do put consequences into place but I probably need to do this more consistently, and really drum home the necessity of not talking in class, and taking things more seriously.

Perhaps not relevant here but as background, my mother is seriously ill with lung cancer and the end is probably not far off. My son is struggling as they are very close. It is not an easy time and my mind is sometimes distracted. Single parent, and working full time, trying to keep on top of it all. It is not easy.

I know I need to do something.

Sometimes a particular combination of pupils results in a lot of nusance and disruption to the reat of the class. Your son was a member of such a group and the school must deal with it asap, especialy at the start of secondary; because if they let it go it will escalate and have an adverse effect not just on the rest of the class, but on the little gang.

Two kids have been moved and yours seems to be the remaining disrupter.
If he remains a persistent detriment to the class, this will pretty soon cause social problems for him. Other kids will get fed up of him disrupting classes, resent the amount of teacher time and attention he gets for being a pest, at cost to other pupils who want to learn; or need more help. So for your son's own sake his behaviour in class needs to change before he becomes the jerk nobody wants to sit beside or be friends with.

I doubt he got detention for "not wearing his blazer". More likely he'd been reminded to put it on and got detention for ignoring, disobedience or smartarse cheek. It won't be the first time he's been told to what equipment he should have in class. "Chattering and lack of focus" in class, means not paying attention (to the teacher) AND distracting other children. That kind of constant disruption and diversion impedes the entire lesson. It's damaging the experience of an entire class, in a school that places high value on study and good behaviour.

If you keep downplaying his misbehaviour as "minor", you're misreading the situation, to his detriment.

"he was scared of getting a detention but now he’s completely not bothered "

typical bravado of the not-so-macho.

it is demoralising for him, and not having any real impact as far as I can see

I'd say "demoralising" is a powerful impact.

Your son is still quite young so might need plenty of help for eg equipment.

Some time around dinner the previous evening you'll need to be checking with him that he's ready for the next day at school. I've always disliked 'have you done your homework' but prefer 'have you packed your school bag?' It'll help focus on the next day and if he needs PE kit/ protractor/ colouring pencils or if there's still homework to finish or vocab to learn.

As for the 'low level' disruption- time for you to get really tough in him.

I get that actively disrupting lessons is not 'minor'. What I am concerned about is that things are not improving and I am looking for strategies to try and improve things. The detentions seem pointless to me in that they are not effecting any change, or introducing a new perspective, it's 'same old' and the novelty / fear factor has worn off. I am not a teacher. I am looking for ideas and advice from others who may have some experience either with their own children or in an education setting.

Ok - talk to the school - do they know about your mum? They need to know he might need extra support.

not having pens etc, this weekend (if you get chance with everything else going on), go through his pencil case and equipment and check he’s got everything he needs, order anything missing plus spares. Each evening he needs help packing his bag.

for the chatting, ask if he can be moved in class to a different seat. Explain to him he needs to not just stop chatting a bit, but be silent unless a teacher has given him explicit permission to talk.

He has been put on a behaviour contract in the middle of December
I'm not minimising but my son did well at primary school and he is intelligent and on the whole well-behaved.

2/3 detentions a week for behaviour and put on a behaviour contract? I hate to tell you this OP but your son is not, “on the whole well-behaved”. Quite the opposite tbh. And the moment you accept that, the easier it will be fix before he ends up in yr11, completely far behind his potential

the teachers are not picking on him as he’s an easy win, they are punishing him for HIS behaviour. He is not being punished for what others are doing wrong, but what he is doing wrong. Do not concern yourself with the others in the class, they will be dealt with individually. Stop blaming them for your son being punished.

He's getting detentions because he is being a PITA.

What are you doing to punish at home? Remove phone? Xbox? Pc? Grounding him? No football practice? Clearly an extra 20minutes in school doesn’t phase him, but schools only have a limit of what they can do. So find something he would hate at home and use that as a double-punishment that will deter him. Then if you see that making an impact, start adding in rewards - like no detentions this week - I’ll buy you a bottle of prime. And don’t ever minimise what the school are saying in front of him, when you speak to your son - make it sound like the school should be punishing him more and show you are on their side when it comes to his behaviour. Non of this “well that’s a silly reason to give a detention” nonsense

It does sound very difficult. Do you have any strategies in addition to detentions OP could ask school to try or you would want parents to try at home to nip it in the bud? I can only think of running through school equipment each morning and addding some reward for good reports home and somevadditional penalty. But you might have a bit more expertise.

It does sound as though he's one of the kids who take advantage of more serious disruption from others with SEND/SEMH to be a complete pain and make the entire lesson a write off. Especially if there's a 'BUT SHE GOT UP!' argument every single bloody time.

Thing is, when those kids have support or manage to access more appropriate provision, he's left with being the pita since the moment he arrived, not them.

I worked as a secondary school teacher for 18 years. I agree with a lot of the suggestions being made, eg help and encouragement to get organised, reminders that you expect your son to follow the school rules, make sure your son knows he is supposed to be learning and studying in lessons and doing his work, and listening to the teacher/following instructions. Why are you fed up with the detentions? Your son is the one who should be fed up. What other sanctions do you expect the school to use? They are limited in what they are allowed to do. The behaviour report is probably being used to try and track carefully when/where/why your son is not behaving well. It probably has specific targets for him to meet? Does it have comments on by teachers? Are you paying attention to it?
The fact you have a family member who is very ill here is relevant and is bound to upset both you and your child. I suggest you let the head of year know this discreetly, obviously sanctions must be given consistently regardless of the family circumstances but nevertheless good schools do care about children’s home circumstances. Could you reward at home any periods of time with good behaviour ? Are there any male role models amongst friends and family who can emphasise how important/helpful educational qualifications can be in life, and encourage homework/reading/healthy hobbies/making an effort/doing one’s best, in addition to yourself, to back you up?

Agree this is normal at secondary schools these days. I used to work in a secondary and couldn't believe how frequently they dished out detentions and not just to the disruptive kids. When I was at school, detentions were for when you'd done something pretty bad, but they're more common now.

Please don’t tell yourself or your son the detentions or other school sanctions are pointless. This is avoiding the point. School is trying to tell your son and you that he needs to change some of the things he does/doesn’t do at school.

Yep, this is spot on.

School have a limited range of tools to use. Detentions and behaviour contracts are two of these.

You also have a range of tools to use. Start using them.

1 detention= 1 day without WiFi. Every time.

1 week clear on his behaviour contract = he gets his choice of tea on Sat night, or he gets to choose a film, or whatever else might be a bit of a treat.

And back the school - every single time. Even if you don't really think a forgotten red pen is worth detention, you need to pretend like you do.

In my experience (12 years as a teacher) most yr7 boys with the pattern of behaviour you are describing don't improve. The behaviour escalates as they get older. The few who do, do so because their parents took it seriously, worked with the school, and made it clear that they weren't going to stand for it.

Thanks for everyone’s helpful replies.

I have requested a meeting next week with the head of year 7, and I’ve suggested my son is there too. I’d like to find out more about what’s actually happening in the lessons and go from there.

I think that's a really sensible idea. Having your son present means he can't downplay any misbehaviour. It might help him see the severity of it instead. It's hard bringing up kids on your own. I know, I've been there. Good luck

@Bookendedbylife a meeting is a good idea and I hope it is productive. I have been through this with my 2 older DCs, Y7 is a rollercoaster, they both settled down by October/ December of Y8 but we worked with the school and tried to be consistent. I have a pot of pens by the front door! Low level disruption is a nightmare in a classroom.

I think you're part of the problem here tbf.

The school has rules. You need to tell your son to follow them.