Question for drummers and percussionists.

[WildRosie]

Are these two musical skills separate disciplines or are they regarded as interchangeable? By percussion, I mean instruments like congas and cowbells rather than marimbas, vibes and so on. Whilst I imagine they are taught as distinct subjects in music schools, in the real world I'd venture the distinction can be blurred somewhat. Ray Cooper is a good example; he is often seen with a set of congas, tambourine and gong but I've also seen him play a full drum kit.

Thankyou.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-63175278.amp

So in the classical music world they certainly start off doing the lot. An orchestral percussionist is expected to play the whole kitchen of instruments you see lurking at the back.

Great clips here:

You might end up specialising in a genre really - not so much an instrument?

I’d say partially. To be good at any of these you need a reasonably decent sense of rhythm/timing but there are techniques that are unique to say drums that aren’t needed in congas. You don’t use your feet in congas.

As a fairly good kit drummer, I can have a bash at bongos or congas and make it sound alright-ish, but compared to a proper percussionist, I don’t know the correct way to voice certain sounds or phrases as I’ve never learnt properly. Likewise a conga player wouldn’t necessarily be able to jump on a kit and play fluidly, using the rudiments a good drummer will have learnt. Tambourine is actually surprisingly difficult to play evenly and consistently, at least in my experience, lots of practice required.

But cowbell, all you need to know is you need more of it!

Thankyou wilko. I've seen film of a Prom concert and there were a few percussionists, one for cymbals, one for timpani and so on. BTW, Tristan Fry is known as a timpanist, as well as being competent behind the glockenspiel family and being a real powerhouse drummer in the band Sky, the latter was a few years ago now.

From having been in both orchestras and punk bands (I know, slight difference ) I'd say the main difference is that a percussionist needs to be able to read music and most drummers can't. Obviously some can do both, Sheila E is a good example.

In a classical orchestra there's usually a timpanist, playing kettle drums, and separate percussionists playing any and all other percussion instruments.

In other genres, where there's a drumkit, it depends if the drummer had any classical training earlier and can still remember how to play, and has access to other instruments. Percussion covers a huge range of instruments, all with their own techniques. Some are 'tuned' (eg xylophone) others are not (eg tambourine).

I specifically chose to play drums because I had no interest in reading music!

But cowbell, all you need to know is you need more of it! 😂

Oh the hilarity when my son's band turned up to a venue to find that the house kit had a cowbell. The drummer inserted it everywhere!!!! (We then bought him one for Christmas!)

Some kit players will also learn congas etc especially as some of the music colleges are fond of providing workshops. But they are a specialism in their own right.

I bought our drummer cowbells for Christmas one year, I've never seen him so happy! Of course we then had to restrict him to three cowbell songs per gig

I did let my son take the credit for coming up with the cowbell christmas present idea for his friend

Drummers may need to be able to read drum patterns or drum music - whatever the proper name is - but they don't need to know about sharps and flats and things. Obviously, timing and rhythm is everything for drums and non-tuned percussion.

I'd forgotten all about Sheila E. Wasn't she in Prince's band post-Revolution ?

I think it's just called drum notation, whereas for guitar you have standard notation or tab

A reading drummer is a very useful person.

DS is a drummer. He has lessons on kit (with cow bell😉) and hand drums (djembe/congas / bongos). He reads music but primarily because he has played other instruments not becsuse of his drumming, and very quickly picked up the whole range of orchestral percussion on a summer school (He also got very frustrated with players who were "grade 8" but couldn't hold the beat). Every new percussion instrument has some technique atached but there is a lot if skills transfer. He is (very vocally) of the opinion that drummers should not be allowed near sheet music until they can hold the beat 🤣

Fair point about holding the beat, sheet music etc. If looking at music while you play creates a distraction that leads to sloppy rhythm or wrong notes then it's best avoided.

On The Dark Side Of The Moon album, Pink Floyd drummer Nick Mason's credit is given as 'Percussion'. Similarly, I seem to remember either Carl Palmer or Bill Bruford having a 'Percussives' credit. Must be a progressive rock thing. I can't picture Nick Mason with a pair of maracas.

its good for drummers to practice to a metronome.

My sons favourite band Toto credit percussion.

I was mesmerised watching the percussionist at the Elton John farewell tour concert that was filmed. Totally amazing.

I'd say it's rare for a percussionist not to be a drummer, but eminently possible for a drummer not to be a percussionist.

Money has a lot to do with it. The kit drummers I know tended to start lessons through school or via a rock school type place and did not have access to a range of other percussion instruments.

Classical conservatoires tend to offer kit lessons to percussionists who have not had experience of kit, but often not hte other way around.

I have a relative who is a percussionist. He can play the drums (brilliantly I will say) but his real love is tuned percussion. He is absolutely amazing on them!

I once heard the great flamenco guitarist Paco de Lucía advise a young dancer in his ensemble (that's perscussion with your feet for you!) to practice with a metronome. The dancer said it made a huge difference to his keeping in time with the instruments.

Yes, I never even took my grade 4 in drums, but my first-class degree in music friend drags me over to her orchestra friends, saying, "she reads DRUM NOTATION don't you know"!

"I'd forgotten all about Sheila E. Wasn't she in Prince's band post-Revolution ?"

She was on the Purple Rain tour with the Revolution, and performed with Prince on and off until 2011. The best thing to watch her in is the Sign of the Times film though, amazing drummer!