UK benefits system - what would you change?

[Galactico]

Just a bit of curiosity, really.

Many people agree that the benefits system isn’t fit for purpose now. Whether that be because they feel it’s too easy to get them and so there’s a lack of incentive to work for some people, or because people are subject to degrading assessments and the constant threat of being sanctioned/removed.

Any opinions?

Supposedly you can work full time and claim PIP but the assessors don't seem to believe this.

If you're disabled, you have additional costs regardless of whether you work or not.

i.e I've spent around £2K on therapy in over a year, had to pay for private psychiatry when my NHS one was unavailable for months.

Scored zero points when I applied explicitly because I work full time. I have a medical driving licence but the insurance would be too much due to the condition. Also have needed up to four months off work at points without sick pay.

As it stands, as a disabled person, you're effectively in a risky position if you work.

I don't think a UBI would work without rent controls at the very least, but more importantly a huge increase in house building for social housing. Otherwise the UBI for an awful lot of people would be swallowed up in rent.

I'd bring in a land value tax (not property value) to replace Council tax. This is set by area and is based on the size of plot so wouldn't need revaluations. There would be exemptions for farmland, particularly wheee this also contributes to improving the quality of the soil. It would also be paid by the freehold owner of the land rather than a tenant.

This is linked with UBI, I once had a wacky idea about basing child benefit on the age of the youngest child so it increases as your youngest child gets older. Each child would get a basic rate similar to how it is now, but once the youngest starts school you would get an extra £200 or whatever a month to help with childcare/training/new business expenses/nails. It might even persuade these families who apparently churn out child after child for the benefits to not do this if they lose a significant increase if they have another baby.

We just had numbers on more receiving benefits than paying tax and that seems a difficult place to be to me

UBI would be 100% benefits but what about behaviour change? If people think oh I don’t need that much work I have money anyway then the tax part of the equation goes down

I can’t see that 100% benefits and say 30 to 40% of population paying tax is desirable in any way, or doable even

For a start I'd pay carers the NLW. Its an absolute disgrace the pittance they're paid for the extremely hard work they do and they're saving the Government a lot of money. How on earth is it even possible to even exist let alone live on such a pitiful insulting sum of money. Its not even £100 PW. My parents have passed so it doesn't apply to me, but its not that I wouldn't do it, I could afford to.

I'd ban Benefit Sanctions. I don't care how many meetings someone has missed no one deserves punishment by starvation. Let's not forget people have died due to these cruel regimes. Google David Clapson.

The biggest single change to the existing system would be to make it immediately responsive to changes in circumstances.

In real time.

So if you lose your job Monday, you start getting benefits Tuesday. If you get a job Wednesday, you claim stops Wednesday.

Those of us who are nasty enough to remember shit will remember this was the promise of Universal Credit.

The best systemic change would be to a system of universal income. Which a rich country (remember how the government is always banging on anout our place in the Gx) could afford without blinking. But that requires moving away from the bullshit of muscular Christianity that has conned most of society since the age of Kings.

Oh, hang on, in the UK we still live in the age of Kings. Forget that last bit.

Happy Saturday all !

You do know that people can't teleport right? It's 18 hours because it then gives parents time to actually drop off and pick up their kids from school without incurring the charges of before and after school clubs.

PIP is broken, as is carers allowance. I would like all PIP and DLA assessments to be recorded and any assessor found lying to be sacked with immediate effect. If the assessor decides not to record, instant dismissal.

Carers allowance is far far too low, my lovely mum is a fulltime carer for her adult son, if she was unable to care for him he would require residential care, I hate to think just how much that would cost. While she is being paid an absolute pittance for the vital care she provides. The only reason she can care for him is because her youngest was able to pay off her mortgage so she could retire, otherwise his care would be costing thousands every week.

UBI is something I have personally always found quite interesting, I would like to know how much it costs per year to process non PIP/DLA claims, as that saving could also go into the UBI pot.

Subsidise childcare much much more.

It’s bonkers to me that either of them would!
Get rid of CB altogether.
Increase SMP and heavily subsidise childcare via tax relief. “Free hours” for non working parents (unless PIP or CA) set at a number beneficial for the child and no more.
But get rid of the CB itself.
At one point when they were all under 18, my cousin with 5 kids was getting £4K a year tax free. Tbf, she’s always worked incredibly hard, returning to work after 2 weeks after one of them. Always NMW. Their father? Spent large periods of time not working - and not claiming, so he wouldn’t be hassled to work. Why would he, when there's £4K a year coming in just for having more children than you can afford, without the state?

I know that large households aren’t always a choice - chaotic lives, abuse, accidents, multiples… I want to be sensible about that, and liberal… but then I look at the one example in my own family and think, “FFS, why are they getting £4K a year?”

They have criminals do this as part of their punishment community service.
Chain gangs next?

It would be better to offer proper, heavily subsidised childcare around school though.

This shit keeps women and children in poverty.

The gov needs to stop tinkering and start again from scratch, using the data it already possesses regarding needs etc. The tax system should be treated similarly as the two go hand in hand.

However, given the government's (and by this we're really talking government departments / civil service) track record on IT projects (whether in-house or contracted out), the reality would likely be a disaster.

The gov needs to stop tinkering and start again from scratch,

What do you think Universal Credit was ?

And they did scrap it and start again from scratch. Remember how IDS flushed away billions of our money on that when it became the predicted UK government IT disaster it is ?

PIP is broken, as is carers allowance.

They are working pretty much as intended. Remember the intention is not to pay out whenever possible.

What you want is a system intended to help people with disabilities fulfil a satisfying life using what talents they have to enrich society. And if you wanted that you'd have to move to a country with a political party that believed in it.

I would make those able to work (so not severely disabled or sick) attend the job Centre daily (fares paid) to look for work and sent on work placements... theres work for anyone who wants it, not taking a job beneath you or refusing to look outside a small geographical location is not a reason to claim benefits.

Those made unemployed should have a 6 month period where these conditions do not apply for them to job search, half way through brought in to discuss progress and offered help.

Further education courses basic, gcse and a level equivalent should be available free to claimants and count towards the conditions in my first paragraph.

So lots more support education, work coaches, free travel but no sitting at home watching Netflix. And yes I have real world experience of the long term unemployed and trying to rehabilitate them into work

"I would make those able to work (so not severely disabled or sick) attend the job Centre daily (fares paid)"

Jobs aren't advertised at the job centre any more, so what would be the point of this? Except increasing the number of job centre staff?

"theres work for anyone who wants it"

Please show me your figures for this.

"Further education courses basic, gcse and a level equivalent should be available free to claimants and count towards the conditions in my first paragraph."

There are courses and discounts already I think, but then you also get the problem that people who work and are on low incomes have to pay full price and those on benefits don't so if someone wants to study it's an incentive to leave their job.

"They have criminals do this as part of their punishment community service.
Chain gangs next?"

Yes, it's awful.
It also takes jobs away from people who are currently working. If a street can be swept by a person on 'workfare' the council can make their street cleaner redundant so he can then do the same thing for peanuts.

Universal basic income is exactly what the Tory's are trying to bring in, if you do not comply they stop your income.

We need a new Government not a WEF party with their little mouthpieces making sure he does as he is told.

"I know that large households aren’t always a choice - chaotic lives, abuse, accidents, multiples… I want to be sensible about that, and liberal… but then I look at the one example in my own family and think, “FFS, why are they getting £4K a year?”"

Depends whether the state wants to incentivise having children. The ageing population means they may want to.
On the continent it's pretty common for people at all income levels to pay less income tax if they have dependents at home and it's not considered a special benefit. It probably still isn't enough in itself to incentivise someone who wants two children to have four.

"The biggest single change to the existing system would be to make it immediately responsive to changes in circumstances.
In real time.
So if you lose your job Monday, you start getting benefits Tuesday. If you get a job Wednesday, you claim stops Wednesday."

Last time I was on the dole I 'worked' two hours a week as part of a training course. The job centre couldn't calculate my JSA without my pay slips from this 'job'. They took about 3 months to arrive during which time I was not paid any benefits at all.
It was lucky I had some savings (though also unlucky of course because you're penalised for that).

@Simonjt I totally agree with you. I am in the same position, caring for my family member full time who would be have to live in a mental health facility if I didn't look after him. His brother has the same illness and has been resident in a mental health hospital for many years at great cost to the government. To keep him at home, I had to downsize to pay off my mortgage and give up my job. Yes, we receive pip and carers allowance and we could not survive without them. Yet every so often our lives are turned upside down when we receive an assessment envelope through the door and have to pray that we get granted it again. The stress we go through is unbelievable. Sometimes I feel like saying stuff it, he can go into government funded residential care, which he'd hate, and I'll get my life back. If the government prefer to save on my measly amount of care allowance, it would cost a hell of a lot more to keep him full time in a mental health facility. I'm sure there are many carers out there who are also saving the government money, yet are made to jump through hoops and put through enormous stress by having to constantly reapply for pip.

Child Maintenance needs to be taken in to account when calculating a resident parent’s entitlement to benefits. A mother can be getting more than £1000 extra a month in to her bank account by direct transfer from the dad(s) but doesn’t have to declare it because it’s not recorded on any system. Parents who are still together don’t get to not declare portions of their income when they are applying for benefits.

Single people and ‘average’ / borderline earners are worse off than those who are entitled to benefits, because of all the other support (cost of living payments, rent subsidised social housing, council tax relief etc) that unlocks. That can’t be right.

I would move child benefit back to being universal so that every child is entitled to a little government support no matter their parents income level, then remove all other child related benefits as far as possible. I’d replace it with free childcare and parents would be expected to use it in order to provide for their children.

I’d have a better safety net for people who genuinely need it following things like redundancy, bereavement, illness where people would receive money based on their previous income.

Disabled people would receive a living wage.

Child Maintenance needs to be taken in to account when calculating a resident parent’s entitlement to benefits. A mother can be getting more than £1000 extra a month in to her bank account by direct transfer from the dad(s) but doesn’t have to declare it because it’s not recorded on any system. Parents who are still together don’t get to not declare portions of their income when they are applying for benefits.

that can’t happen while CMS is so shit.

Its what used to happen and it meant kids like me lived in absolute poverty. My father was meant to pay my grandparents £88 a week. That was factored into their claims (they’d just had 4 kids landed on them unexpectedly when we were removed) despite the fact CSA never collected a single penny from him.

After that they changed the system to parents on benefits only got to keep £20 a week and the rest was owed to the Sec of State to go toward the benefit bill. Again they collected so little that the debt owed was so high something had to be done… rather than any decent changes or suggestions that their powers be used they said people could keep it.

The number of people on benefits getting a grand in maintenance is fucking tiny. But getting people frothy about it allows successive governments to cover up his little political will there is to actually make NRP’s pay.