UK benefits system - what would you change?

[Galactico]

Just a bit of curiosity, really.

Many people agree that the benefits system isn’t fit for purpose now. Whether that be because they feel it’s too easy to get them and so there’s a lack of incentive to work for some people, or because people are subject to degrading assessments and the constant threat of being sanctioned/removed.

Any opinions?

I'd get rid of tax credits and child benefit and put all that into free school meals for all and free childcare year round. Make it easy for parents to work without worry about childcare especially the school holidays and make sure each child got fed properly mon- Fri every week.

I've not costed that up so I'm not sure how the numbers would work though!

I think the added soft benefits make it expensive to step from part time work to full time. Help with childcare, free school meals, prescriptions, help with uniform, dentists etc all add up and it's not just the money but these added extras the come with benefits you lose when you work full time and start progressing at work. It's a difficult step and puts people off.

“I'd get rid of tax credits and child benefit and put all that into free school meals for all and free childcare year round.”

@cupofdecaf So in my village primary, that would lead to lots of parents with early retired / never really worked mothers carrying on providing grandma childcare and household incomes of £100K saying, “oooooh - that’s nice, no thinking about dinner money account top up, and who doesn’t love a freebie?”
Whilst a small minority were pleased their kids were fed, but upset that they couldn’t put the benefit towards heating.

I appreciate it's not without issues. Some primary aged kids already get term time free meals anyway.

Decent free childcare / education including food 5 days a week throughout the year would allow so many more parents to work and actually make a profit.

It would take away the step up that hinders so many from making that risky leap (to some degree there's so many other hidden benefits).

I know so many mums (all mums that I know) who stick with low paid part time work because with the top ups and extra hidden benefits they are much better off than they would be working. Plus the stress of childcare in the holidays it's just not worth it for them. The years later when the kids are more independent they are stuck (either lack of opportunity or motivation) in their low paid part time work. Resulting in low pensions savings and likely a job that's manual labour that they can't keep doing in their 50s / 60s. Also they get hit with a much reduced income later on as all the benefits associated with the children drop off.
It really encourages mums to scree themselves over and when you're living month to month you're not thinking what is this doing to my private pension contributions are you.

If people were paid fair salaries then quite a fair amount of benefits could just disappear for working people. Then those who genuinely can't work should have enough for a decent life.
Others who have fallen on hard times, should get the help and support they need to get back into work and while they're not working.

Testina- I think my point is the current system really screws mums over by enticing them into a patten that isn't in their best interests long term.

Also just because some middle class people benefit doesn't mean we shouldn't help others. Sometimes it's actually cheaper to make something a universal benefit.

We're a 100k plus household (before tax). We actually find school meals add up and we notice the cost. I'm looking forward to the few years we'll qualify for free meals. The 30 free hours though really makes a difference to child care costs. Such a pity we can't use it all due to how the nursery ours it at works, we actually have to pay for hours that should be free 🤷🏻‍♀️. May point being those 100k households you refer to might be not be quiet as comfortable as you assume. They pay a lot of tax and get no benefits for a start. Commuting and other such costs add up.

Those saying that CB should be household-based are forgetting that a working couple earning just under the qualifying amount between them are probably paying out FT childcare and 2 lots of commuting/other work expenses, whereas a couple with one earner (or one earning enough to allow the other to work just a few hours a week) will save a fortune on those things.

I think that CB should be a universal benefit, but if there has to be a means test payments should be higher for those with two earners to take account of the cost of working.

It's the dichotomy of CB being based on the highest earner but UC being based on household income that is weird. It should be both of neither.

Why ?

It's also that the change to means test CB came in 10 years ago and the threshold has never been updated. 60k then is more equivalent to 80k now.

Because that all sounds awful.

So when we had our children we both worked and were not entitled to tax credits ,fair enough ,ds2_was born with a rare chromosomes disorder and it became increasingly apparent ,just how much this affected him he was diagnosed with autism and learning disabilities at three ,he's 12 now totally non verbal,very limited understanding, at a special school for children with severe and profound learning disabilities I have up.work to be a carer for him because of his needs ,it's and we now rely on tax credits p!us his DLA,it's not that simple .

So how would a UBI work, someone mentioned £1500 a week, so questions:
Universal means everyone, so would everyone get it?
if it it replaced benefits would it also replace the state pension?
So taxed or tax free
If taxed then 1500 would not be enough to replace benefits a non working single parent in London is benefit capped at 1666 a month so 1500 is below the benefits they can get already taking tax off will plunge them further into poverty. Also if UBI is their only income how will tax be collected, currently HMRC cannot deduct tax from monies paid by the state, the state pension is taxed tax can only be collected through PAYE if the pensioner still works, through a pensioners private pension provider or in the case of a pensioner whose state pension is their only income but is over the tax threshold (perfectly feasible with SERPS added) the tax office sends a letter telling how much they owe, many peoples lives are chaotic many would spend all their money and then have nothing left to pay tax.

So tax free then, universal means universal rules as well, as a working pensioner my state pension is deducted from my tax free allowance so if UBI was tax free and my pension became a UBI then I would be able to keep my tax free allowance for my wages and my pension (now UBI) would become tax free - I could live with that.

There is no way in hell UBI would be set at £1500 a month. Certainly not at individual level (and I can’t see how it could possibly fair to set a single UBI at household level).

UBI would require a complete rethink of the entire tax and benefits system in the UK. Not just a bit of tinkering: a sea change.

And still, it wouldn’t be set at £1500 a month.

I don’t think this is true.

I just calculated if I were to leave DH tomorrow decided to work PT earning £700p/m, I would be able to claim 1k a month (using Entitled to).

I currently earn 1600, working full time.

This is with no childcare bills.

"I'd get rid of tax credits and child benefit and put all that into free school meals for all and free childcare year round."

Childcare isn't going to be available for some children. Lack of suitable childcare is a major reason why some parents of disabled children cannot work.

For UC due to the taper, it is true. On £1600pm you would still receive some UC if you left DH. If my maths is right an extra £900 in earnings would reduce UC by £495.

Benefits paid in vouchers. Rent and bills covered, food shop, clothing, maybe a bit extra. No one can then complain they can’t feed their children as they have blown their monthly entitlement in a week. Before anyone asks I’ve worked handing out benefits so I get to be cynical.

By clamping down on the non resident or absent parent.

@Florenz it’s crazy to me how many people going on about UBI. Terrifying. The tax burden, good Lord. The inflation. No one fancy working for a living, no?

What a miserable existence.

Paying benefits in vouchers doesn't help anyone. People just set up black market trades in vouchers for less cash than face value, and kids still lose out.
If people can't manage money across a whole month, it's more helpful to pay benefits weekly than to give vouchers monthly.
That's assuming the govt could actually administer a voucher scheme, which is definitely not a given.

Why is it miserable? Have you ever been to a third world country? All of that, with free schooling and NHS care as well as reliable emergency services, would be a fantastic situation for your average global citizen to be in. Life isn’t free, somebody is always working for what you have unless you got it yourself

Well, I am sure the vouchers would not allow me to get a flight to a third world country.

Youre not on vouchers.

And I also don't think anyone should live a shit existence because people in other countries have it harder. I spent years in therapy trying to undo the thinking that I had to put up with shit because other people had it worse.

Existing on vouchers would be miserable. I am on benefits. How would I pay for household repairs? A new fridge? Vet bills? What if I want to go to the cinema, or out for a meal?