Hypothetical - DH hitting child

[Sleeepdeprived]

Before I begin - DH has never hit either of our children but one of our conversations earlier has made me wonder if he ever would (although I really don’t think he would)…

We were chatting today about our childhoods and both our dads used to hit us. DH was saying how he understood why his dad hit him because he was being naughty so it was fair enough. I said that because my dad hit me I lost all respect for him and would play up and be naughty in response to the lack of respect I was receiving through being hit. I asked him if he lost respect for his dad for hitting him and he said no, not at all.

I then said that I would never allow anyone to ever hit our children, including him, and if he was to ever hit our children I would call the police and social services and leave. He said he wouldn’t hit them unless they were really naughty and then it turned into a heated debate that I wanted to stop because we were in a public space.

I can’t ever imagine him hitting our children (they’re still really young at the moment), and even though he said ‘unless they were really naughty’ I’m 95% confident he never would. We both parent our children very respectfully and it would be so out of character, but it’s just got me thinking. What would be the best thing to do if he ever was violent? Of course I wouldn’t stand for it and I would protect my children with everything I have but what does that actually look like?

I always assumed I’d leave with the children, but I’ve realised through reading other MN posts that he’d be entitled to 50:50 custody so that would actually leave the children alone with him 50% of the time. I’m assuming that the police / SS wouldn’t be interested if there was no proof so I wouldn’t be able to win full custody. This is just a hypothetical situation but I just want to know how to best protect my children if it ever came to that.

I think you're right. It's something to consider.

You're likely to get some sensationalist answers here.

There are do many variables it's almost impossible to answer. Unless it was something significantly violent, I wouldn't knee-jerk any outcome as a rest if aone-off, with anyone. That includes, for example, an older teenage adult child's reactions to others in the family, as well as parents.

Much depends on reflection afterwards. Is the aggressor remorseful, mortified at their behaviour, sorry, committed to changes so it never happens again.

A one-off incident in a family with no other red flags or concerns would be investigated by social care - and if marks leftmay be investigated by police - but is unlikely to lead to any further action. Often just the investigation is enough of a wake up call to see changes in the behaviour of (otherwise decent) people so it doesn't happen again.

That’s a very balanced view @Polik thank you. I suppose it’s not entirely black and white.

I guess the thought of not being able to fully protect your children from violence terrifies me. Say if a dad wanted to regularly discipline his children through smacking or something that doesn’t leave a mark, the police and SS wouldn’t be bothered and then there’s nothing that the mum can do. The thought of being trapped in a situation like that and not being able to do anything to help your children is such an awful thought

If done regularly, social care would take action. If done regularly, one assumes you would not stay in the relationship.

My mum occasionally smacked me as a child, and I didn't lose any respect for her at all. It was accepted as normal then.

"Normal" changes. I don't smack my dd. My accepting being occasionally smacked as a child has no bearing on my thoughts about smacking my dd. It's just not part of my parenting. I don't think you need to worry unless your DH shows actual signs that he thinks smacking is acceptable for HIM to do to your dc.

@Polik that’s what I always assumed, but isn’t smacking legal in the UK so SS won’t do anything and if you leave the relationship the father could get 50:50 custody, leaving the children with a lot more alone time.

Thanks @Azandme. I’m pretty confident I don’t need to worry with my DH thankfully but it just got me thinking of a hypothetical situation that many women probably face and wondered what could be done (if anything)

What’s hitting someone?

A smack vs a closed fist punch?

Dont forget to include the level of intent behind it.

A carefull smack, with just as much emphasis on the shock value than pain, is an effective parenting technique for a child is struggling with boundaries, inflicting their own pain on others, theft, putting themselves at risk. It should never be automatic, it should be considered extreme, but it is a parenting tool.

Its actually more effective than some of the narcissistic behaviour that emotionally damages kids. I’m also pretty sure that because some parents consider it off limits, it’s creates wider society issues because they are so poorly disciplined.

Why on earth are you worrying about this now? It's like you are vaying for an argument over nothing with your DH?

Anyway, physical abuse, which is regularly hitting/harming, will met the threshold for social care involvement. If you leave then social care would continue to be involved with both parents until social care are certain both parents keep the children safe.

The family court system, separately to social care, decides on long term living arrangements.

@Bard6817 this is disgusting logic. Smacking is bitting and its also illegal.

*hitting

i’m afraid you are misinformed.

It is unlawful for a parent or carer to smack their child, except where this amounts to ‘reasonable punishment’. This defence is laid down in section 58 Children Act 2004, but it is not defined in this legislation.

Whether a ‘smack’ amounts to reasonable punishment will depend on the circumstances of each case, taking into consideration factors like the age of the child and the nature of the smack.

There are strict guidelines covering the use of reasonable punishment and it will not be possible to rely on the defence if you use severe physical punishment on your child which amounts to wounding, actual bodily harm, grievous bodily harm or child cruelty.

i’d also add, in 12 years of being a step dad, i’ve never smacked either of them. I decide early on to be far more clever with punishments, so i took it off the table early.

Did feel like it a few times, but always found better ways and worked with mum to agree what was appropriate.

I was hit as a child which led to severe trauma. I've promised never to hit my children and I haven't. You are experiencing some black and white thinking over it though, from your experiences.
Hitting a child constantly and a parent giving a one off smack after exasperation are different. I wouldn't condone it but wouldn't leave hubby over it. He's never hit the kids but I wouldn't let yourself decide where the line is before a hypothetical situation. We are human.
Patterns of abuse and hitting are not the same as the occasional smack. Would I condone it? No. Would I forgive a smack? In the context described previously (child being very rude/aggressive, parent really struggling and exasperated and smacks once- not hard. Then feels terrible after) yes..that is forgivable

This is all hypothetical, so I wouldn't waste any more time on it.

Custody would be given unless it was severe physical abuse. Hitting a child occasionally is unlikely to meet the threshold for being refused 50/50 custody or at minimum access.

But I agree, try not to worry too much about hypothetical situations.

This ^^

I don’t agree with smacking dc although I have tapped my dc’s leg twice in his life.
he’s 38 now and can’t remember either incident.

What I would say is that any parent that would seek to report and remove a dc from the other parent over a tap on the leg or hand when a dc has perhaps run in the road or touched a socket after being told no, that reporting parent would be inflicting far more trauma on their dc.
My dh has never smacked our dc and I told him on both occasions what I’d done as I was very remorseful. We discussed it, he made clear his disapproval and we moved on.
Obviously repeated smacking or hard smacking is a completely different matter.

Renember OP that parenting is not taught and not all parents have the education and emotional tools necessary to raise a dc so they may well smack if it’s what happened to them.
My dm hit me so hard I thought I was going to die, I think I have done amazingly well to have managed to parent fairly successfully imo with the upbringing I had. My dh was never smacked and had a calm home life so found parenting a lot easier.

It might be illegal by the time you have kids. It's illegal in over 60 countries now I think, including all of England's neighbouring countries. I don't see the tories changing the law but🤞🙏