Is this normal for an employment contract?

[Patienceisntvirtuous]

I am starting a new job in February, and the contract they've sent me for it is 37 pages long (not unusual but longer than most I've had before) and from a solicitor's firm. It also states ' Executed as a Deed by (employer).

Is this a normal thing?

Under 'Job Description' it states 'see attached' but nothing is attached. I am going to ask for that before I sign.

The company have given me a few red flags but I really want the job. E.G being vague about certain things, sending me a document with someone else's name on it and sending me a document to sign with 'optional' written on it, but then asking me why I've not signed it.. I just have a bit of a bad feeling-this may be affecting my views about this contract.

Executed as a Deed is a rather old fashioned, formal way of saying the terms are legally binding. E.g if they sign they’re paying you £40k a year then they can’t pay you £20k. If your hours are signed at 35 a week, you can’t decide to work 20. And so on. Legal explanation here www.squirepattonboggs.com/-/media/files/insights/publications/2017/12/how-to-execute-a-deed/how-to-execute-a-deed-quick-guide.pdf if you want to read it.

WTF? Listen to your brain, why don't you? There's red flags all up over the place here. And from what you wrote, they would be considered legitimate flags. If this job is meant to start in February I would be trying hard now to find another job before then because this would sound suspicious and scamful to me,

Thank you-I guess that's the sort of response I wanted @Fleurdaisy .I did try googling but ended up more confused. I've not heard of it and I am pretty old-fashioned in things I do myself!

@Keyansier I agree. It's just, I've always wanted a job doing what this one is but I am lacking certain qualifications (albeit over qualified generally!) and It's the first place that have accepted me to do it!

No it is not usual.

If everything else is okay though it might indicate a firm that is over cautious and rather than getting HR to do this, think they need a qualified lawyer - they do not.

“Executed as a deed” is just one way of entering into a binding agreement. It’s usually used when there is a lack of “consideration” (value) being provided by at least one of the two parties, to ensure it is still binding, but there are other reasons to use it too. On its own, it definitely isn’t a red flag. But the other stuff doesn’t sound great.

It really doesn't sound great and there are other things I've not mentioned as well as I tend to try to trust my instincts nowadays and they're not telling me good things!

But, I really am looking forward to the actual job itself.

Sending you a document with another persons name on it without an attachment etc sounds terrible.

The attachment thing has concerned me admittedly. The name-well in fairness that's happened to me before at an employer who were largely great so perhaps I am biased in that area!

I've emailed them back and asked for clarification-one thing being that there's no job description but the contract says 'see attached job description' (no attachment).
They've also stated 28 days holiday but 5 of these are set aside for the Christmas period and the 28 days includes bank holidays. This is just a bit rubbish isn't it? But again, I have decided I want the job. Just seems unprofessional.

28 days including bank holidays isn’t unusual. That’s the stat minimum. 5 days at Christmas again, not unusual for companies to shut down that week.

The attachment, they’ve just forgotten and the wrong name suggests the same lack of attention to detail but neither are dreadful.

I would be expecting 29 days next year with the extra bank holiday.
that in itself would put me off…..I get 33 plus all BHs ( pro rata) and it’s still not enough

It's all very well people saying 'red flag - run' but presumably you need a job. Go in with your eyes open though. They sound pretty disorganised. The person sending you this shite likely has no real input. What I'd do in your situation (assuming you're gonna go for it) is read through the document and any bits your unsure of ammend/delete. I did this once when the whole workforce had written contracts full of archaic legalese and some clauses no one had agreed to. We were bullied and harassed to sign so I took my copy and amended it. When I left they tried to withhold my wages because I'd given them insufficient notice as per T&Cs...er no T&Cs mentioning that Mr Boss man....they then discovered that indeed, that wasn't in MY contract, which had been signed and witnessed in front of most of the shopfloor.
They can't even send you the right stuff, so are unlikely to read it. As for the optional one, decide if you agree. It's likely something like an opt out of the Working Time Directive.
Don't rock the boat, quietly do your thing.

Thank you again for the replies! Well, my 'spidey senses' were right! Always trust your gut people!

I LOVED the job and was so so glad I took it.
Unfortunately the company 'went bust' under suspicious circumstances two months later so I am now out of work!

I would hazard a guess that either:

-the company has been “persuaded” to pay a firm of solicitors vast quantities of money for a contract of employment and the solicitors have simply dusted off the template that they have used for all employers and provided without actually checking that it suits the business size/culture/needs etc; or

-one of the owners/senior management team had the document as their contract of employment when they worked for a large organisation. They have given little to no thought as to what sort of contract would be appropriate for the current business and just used this old document.

It is a shame, but both of the above scenarios are extremely common with small businesses.

I’m so sorry, I had missed your update when sending my post. I hope you find a better job very soon.

Thank you, @Plastichanger .

You're probably right! And I appreciate your response. There were definitely some very dodgy things going on, by the document we have from the administrators!

Again, I am glad I took the job. I met some lovely people and I LOVED the job so much, I now know definitely what I want to do and it has opened up some new doors for me, I have learned some new skills and am on the right track.
Not a great time to be made redundant though (if there ever is such a thing) is it?
Thank you for your well wishes :)