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Staffing crisis in schools - teachers/school staff, what's your school like?

571 replies

noblegiraffe · 26/11/2022 13:57

Discussions with fellow teachers about the current crisis in school staffing has raised the issue of whether parents know how bad it is. I guess they won't know if we don't tell them?

My school - struggling to recruit teachers. There are subjects at A-level where students are currently teaching themselves, and with no prospect of a teacher on the horizon. Last year we had similar issues, pupils went into exams not fully prepared, and coursework was a huge problem. At GCSE where we couldn't recruit, there was a teacher in front of the class, but not qualified in that subject and pupils complained about the syllabus not being taught.

TA provision has been cut to the bone. There is only in class support if a child has an EHCP, this support is then spread to other children who need help. Due to backlogs with EHCP applications, and applications routinely being rejected (the assumption is automatic rejection, then appeal) some very needy children get no additional help in class. In addition, we have bigger classes due to leaving teachers not being replaced, so teachers are spread even more thinly.

There are huge concerns about teacher recruitment for next year as the number of trainees on local PGCE courses has collapsed.

And I know my school is in a relatively good position compared to others.

OP posts:
noblegiraffe · 26/11/2022 20:53

Is it the attitude of parents?

Some of it is, certainly the blame falling on teachers when a child doesn't achieve when there are usually very many reasons a child may not achieve is a massive part of it.

But your memory of schools is of a very different education system. The failed policy of inclusion at all costs has closed huge numbers of special schools and put those children into mainstream, without the funding and resources to properly support them, and regardless of whether mainstream education is a suitable environment for them.

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PantyMcPantFace · 26/11/2022 20:57

As a parent I want my son OFF the video addiction (thanks you tube) and being taught. Teacher input. Teacher adapting to the class, responding to the interests/questions of that particular group on that particular day. Interacting. Changing the lesson plan as something from 3 weeks ago needs a quick recap. Reinforcing what was covered earlier. And most of all - after input - getting the students to learn themselves. For them to do a bit of research/investigation, share it with the class.

This all requires a live, human teacher in the room. Not too many students.
An expert in their subject.

I don't think this is too much to ask from a state education.

And to the PP who says they would rather have a functioning NHS....who the fuck do you think is going to work in the NHS if all our children are not educated?

Ponesta · 26/11/2022 20:58

Noblegiraffe thank you. I do appreciate its very different. You are right that when I was young children with special needs went to different schools. My teacher friend who has recently retired strongly believes that was better for all children and she found it very difficult to watch children struggling in mainstream schools when it wasn't best for them (but often what the parents wanted).

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

CharlotteByrde · 26/11/2022 20:58

It could all be fixed with decent resourcing and funding, not just of schools but by all the support and mental health services. Twelve years ago, schools were very different places. This shit show is the result of years of underfunding by the Tory government. Parents have been all too willing to lap up right wing newspaper headlines about 'moaning' 'whinging' 'lazy teachers', telling them to leave if they weren't happy. So here we are.

MrsHamlet · 26/11/2022 21:00

CharlotteByrde · 26/11/2022 20:58

It could all be fixed with decent resourcing and funding, not just of schools but by all the support and mental health services. Twelve years ago, schools were very different places. This shit show is the result of years of underfunding by the Tory government. Parents have been all too willing to lap up right wing newspaper headlines about 'moaning' 'whinging' 'lazy teachers', telling them to leave if they weren't happy. So here we are.

Exactly this. I have been in my current school for 14 years. The difference in resourcing in all sorts of ways is night and day.

ILoveAllRainbowsx · 26/11/2022 21:06

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MadameDe · 26/11/2022 21:06

I don't think many people get it. I left a reasonably well paid job to work as a TA when it was considered to be a good career move. I've decided that this will be my last job and possibly my last year. I feel too old to be running around like a headless chicken especially when in a 6 hour day, I don't even get 10 minutes to sit down. Although it doesn't sound like a long time, maintaining concentration on a class of 30 children is exhausting. What's worse is being told by the head we need to save money. The art cupboard is dry and there's barely a piece of paper in sight. How can you cut back when there's nothing left to cut back on?

JanglyBeads · 26/11/2022 21:10

Thanks to @noblegiraffe for speaking out about this.

We've had non specialists teaching several years Maths and Science at various points. It's got better in recent weeks as we've got a couple of qualified supply staff in. Let's hope they stay.

But morale isn't high at our place as Ofsted have just severely downgraded us, without any good cause at all.

This does not help teacher retention.

hjbmb89hjl · 26/11/2022 21:12

Thank you for bringing this out. Am I wrong to assume that there used to be specialist Maths and Science teachers?

MrsHamlet · 26/11/2022 21:13

All secondary teachers SHOULD be specialists. Many are not.

KatherineofGaunt · 26/11/2022 21:17

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But hang on, this imaginary "best teacher" isn't going to be doing any of the marking, assessing or feedback for the pupils. Which is a more powerful part of teaching. A fancy PowerPoint and worksheet is only so much.

So you still need competent, experienced teachers in front of the class to do all that stuff. To decide which pupils need more support the next day, which need consolidation, which can move on to something else. To talk through things again individually with pupils, or to give pupils a chance to show what they know through interaction with their teacher and peers.

No fucking video of a "best teacher" is going to give you any of that. So your idea just shows that you don't really know anything about what teaching involves.

noblegiraffe · 26/11/2022 21:19

Rainbows also doesn't realise how much of being a teacher is about forming relationships with your classes. It's a human interaction thing.

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woodhill · 26/11/2022 21:21

noblegiraffe · 26/11/2022 20:53

Is it the attitude of parents?

Some of it is, certainly the blame falling on teachers when a child doesn't achieve when there are usually very many reasons a child may not achieve is a massive part of it.

But your memory of schools is of a very different education system. The failed policy of inclusion at all costs has closed huge numbers of special schools and put those children into mainstream, without the funding and resources to properly support them, and regardless of whether mainstream education is a suitable environment for them.

I don't think it was always for the best

MrsHamlet · 26/11/2022 21:21

noblegiraffe · 26/11/2022 21:19

Rainbows also doesn't realise how much of being a teacher is about forming relationships with your classes. It's a human interaction thing.

Yes.
Bob got two grade 4s for me because I was the best teacher for him. I don't tweet, or YouTube and I've never won a prize. None of that matters.

KatherineofGaunt · 26/11/2022 21:25

And what about SEN teachers? How do you choose the "best" SEN teacher to teach all those pupils with their million different learning needs?

Because, after all, only the "best" should be teaching, right? I'd love to see the matrix for us SEN teachers...

QueenofLouisiana · 26/11/2022 21:26

After 9 pages, this is unlikely to be news…but it’s awful. I’m currently helping DH’s school out by marking their GCSE mocks in my degree subject. They are a specialist setting and no longer have a teacher for that subject.
I can’t recruit TAs for my own setting. Worse for 1:1 as people don’t want that sort of job. Those who do often don’t have the skills needed in an education setting (we expect basic maths and English skills).
I’ve had to cut down my applications for additional funding as I have to prove I am providing extra support with it. The funding doesn’t cover staff (even worse with recent wage increases as the funding has been the same for 4 years), so can’t get funding, so can’t put in provision…a vicious circle.
So much money goes into family/ social support. Social services and GPs refer so much back to schools. Our family support was 2.5 days a week, we now find 5 days plus overtime.

noblegiraffe · 26/11/2022 21:27

And what about SEN teachers?

SEN teachers can't be any good because their pupils don't get the best results.

OP posts:
borntobequiet · 26/11/2022 21:28

momlette · 26/11/2022 20:37

I don’t see the same issues at all within the private system. Smaller classes, more resources and fewer social problems. Pension is probably an issue for some but not all. On the point re laughing at parents re lockdown remote learning being difficult for kids, I agree that when in isolation it is dreadful and soulless. However to the teachers on here … I seem to remember you didn’t find it to be so dreadful at the time? Now you are seeming to be fairly disparaging about the merits?

You remember very wrongly.

aintnothinbutagstring · 26/11/2022 21:28

I think where support staff are concerned - the days of relying on (the goodwill) and massively underpaying women seeking school hour employment are well and truly over. And the few applicants you do get, schools are unwilling to train those that don't have the sufficient experience which is what other sectors would do - you know, invest and train their staff up to where they want them to be. It's a travesty really that these women have been exploited by the education sector for so long - good on them for finding better paid work. And lets face it, most schools operate as businesses now, with academy bosses handing out contracts/jobs to their mates - so if they don't have the acumen to attract the staff they need/want, then that's on them, other sectors will have the upper hand where recruitment is concerned.

MrsHamlet · 26/11/2022 21:28

KatherineofGaunt · 26/11/2022 21:25

And what about SEN teachers? How do you choose the "best" SEN teacher to teach all those pupils with their million different learning needs?

Because, after all, only the "best" should be teaching, right? I'd love to see the matrix for us SEN teachers...

The special school next door to us will be delighted that they can just stream videos of "the best SEN teacher" for their students. It'll save then loads of money. The visually impaired students might struggle... but hey ho.

KatherineofGaunt · 26/11/2022 21:30

noblegiraffe · 26/11/2022 21:27

And what about SEN teachers?

SEN teachers can't be any good because their pupils don't get the best results.

Ah, of course.

Maybe I should start a YouTube channel, then people might think I was the "best"?

KatherineofGaunt · 26/11/2022 21:33

MrsHamlet · 26/11/2022 21:28

The special school next door to us will be delighted that they can just stream videos of "the best SEN teacher" for their students. It'll save then loads of money. The visually impaired students might struggle... but hey ho.

And don't forget those pupils whose first language is BSL, @MrsHamlet . But no doubt the "best teachers" will be fluent in sign language, too, you know, being the "best" and all.

I'm clearly superfluous. Might take my professional skills and qualifications and go teach in Indonesia or something...

Perfect28 · 26/11/2022 21:37

We have already reverted to online learning for year groups because of staff shortages.

AntlerRose · 26/11/2022 21:42

I get upset about this topic. The children are not getting the education they got 10 years ago. We used to have a qualified play leader who helped social skills on the playground, a nuture room that was staffed with a trained home school link person, a qualified teacher who came in part time to hear struggling readers, a balance of experienced and new teachers, a senco 3 days a week, a class TA in each class and SEN TAs.

Now its all newish teachers, a TA per year group mornings only and the senco and head are the same person and SEN TAs and a home school link person for just two afternoons.

woodhill · 26/11/2022 21:51

There seems to be more special needs now as well