Pls help a desperate mum

[ecnatsid]

Hi,

I have two kids 3 and 1. I'm a student nurse, working various shift patterns for placements.

DS(1) has never slept through, ever. Not once. He doesn't wake for milk, he's just extremely unsettled. I've tried:

Sleeping bag in a cot
Duvet and pillow in a cot
Sleeping bag and pillow
My bed, with duvet
My bed, just with sleeping bag
We've changed his mattresses twice
Tried a night light
Tried a projector
He doesn't like a cuddly toy or comfort blanket
We've tried sleep training, even though I didn't like the idea of it. It didn't work.

He was in a cot in our room till three weeks ago, his sleep was just as poor. The transition to his own room hasn't helped or made it worse.

I'm at a loss. He has a cup of milk before bed, sleeps in our arms then is transferred to his cot in his own room. He sleeps about an hour, maybe 2 and then he's up.. all night. Every hour.

His tea time is around 5, he goes asleep at 7;30, we've tried keeping him up later but at this point he can't cope and falls asleep anyway.

he doesn't nap in the day, never ever has even as a newborn he used to have ten min cat naps. Sometimes, if I'm driving far he will sleep in the car, but generally I don't drive that far so it's not a regular thing

He almost has all his teeth, so teething was a factor for a long time but it's just unbearable now.

DH and I argue constantly, I'm barely coping getting through uni. He's a super happy baby through the day, I have no idea what to do.

Unfortunately I don't think that there's anything you can do. Some babies/people just don't need sleep or as much sleep as others. If your dc is safe dry and not upset then you may just have to let them play in their cot so you can sleep it's what my mum had to do on and off for years with me.

I never slept as a baby unless I was medicated (40+ years ago and by a dr😮) and then only from 7pm- 11pm and was only for 12 week stints ie 12 weeks on the meds 12 weeks off where id take the odd 10 mins nap but that's literally it. I'm a natural insomniac who has spent years in sleep labs etc as I shouldn't alive due to my lack of sleep apparently however my brain does this weird thing where its both awake and asleep at the same time. Not sleep walking though as I am fully conscious whilst still producing sleep brainwaves.
My ds is the same and has been on melatonin for about 8 years now and consistently gets 5 hours per night which the drs say he must have for health reasons though it makes zero difference to him whether he sleeps or not and the sleep lab says he's exactly the same as me in all there tests.

What I'm trying to say properly quite badly is that some people don't need to sleep as much as normal and if that is the case with your dc you need coping strategies so you can sleep. Like sleeping in shifts with your partner so you both get some sleep and or not getting up everytime you hear them and just leaving them to play for a while. Do you have any friends or family who can help by having dc overnight once or twice a month so you can catch up on some sleep?
I would suggest talking to your health visitor and asking for help, they won't give any sleep meds before they are 4 generally and then only after a stint with the sleep lab. However they can refer you to baby massage classes. You can also try lavender Bath wash and/or plug in infusers which can help aid sleep. I'm sure that they will have some other advice/help that I can't remember as ds is now well past the baby stage.
But the most important thing to remember is that you are not to blame nor are you doing anything wrong or any type of failure you just have 1 dc who doesn't sleep.

It sounds like you've tried a lot of things, and potentially in a very short space of time. The key to a good night's sleep for adults and children a like is routine. It takes a month for a habit to form. Try one thing and stick to it. I get it, you're tired and desperate, but flitting from one thing to another doesn't help.
Something that does cause waking and failing to go back to sleep is changes when they go to sleep compared to when they wake. So for example, they go to sleep with a light on, you turn it off when you go to bed, they wake up, and things are different. So you turn the light back on for them to go back to sleep and off we go again. This can be any changes at all, noise, light, temperature, position.
You need to consistent, which also goes with the routine. So starting today, pick what is going to happen every night for the next month, before bed time, at bed time and during the night. Don't deviate.

Co sleep? Yes I know not recommended etc but it does work. I’ve cuddled into all mine in my bed (actually on the settee with this wee one) and they slept better.

Sounds like you're chopping anc changing too much and giving in too easily.

Sleep training will (in the vast majority of cases) work if you're consistent and stock with it.

You need to teach him to self settle so that when he wakes up he can go back to sleep without your intervention.

@HighlandPony

Sleeping on a sofa with a baby is really dangerous

I did a sleep program with GP years ago. Dc being put into bed awake is crucial.
My ds had been in /out of hospital for 10 months. Never slept alone or in the dark.
Had him sleeping through on night 3..
Life changing.
And no crying it out.

Sleeping on a porcelain tile floor not a fantastic option either though. It’s a four seater bigger than a single bed and I don’t move in my sleep. Ever.

@highlandpony

It doesn't matter how big it is or if you think you don't move.

Your baby is at significant risk of entrapment and suffocation.

Every single piece of research shows that baby in its own bare sleep space is the safest option and that you should never sleep on a sofa with a baby

How long have you tried any of these methods? How much sleep do you suspect he gets in a 24hour period because I cant believe he's not shattered.
Also what actually happens when he wakes, can you ignore?

What worked for me was consistent routine, almost to the minute, but a little give here and there as life is life....
I'd say tea is too early for a 7.30 bedtime. We do tea at 6, bath 6.45pm, milk 7pm, bed 7.30/7.45.
We now cuddle to sleep in their cot. Have taken side down, fixed in a collapsible bed guard to allow us to cuddle whilst they lay in cot. We gently hold them down if they're a little wriggly whilst sing 2 particular nursery rhymes for bedtime use only.
I think falling asleep on you then you disappearing when they wake in-between sleep cycles probably upsets them too much, if they go to sleep in the same place it may ease the transition between cycles.
We still give 8ozmilk before bed.
We shush when they stir and only last resort pick up and recuddle.

I had very challenging sleepers, the only thing that worked was making sure they fell asleep by themselves in their cots. I sleep trained them, it didn't it took 1 day with one of them and 3 days with the other. It wasn't as bad as I thought it would be, but was the answer for us. They will both wake and call for me in the night if they need anything so they haven't learnt that I won't come.

As PP have said, maybe try having him fall asleep in his cot rather than putting him in when asleep? I think this helps with self soothing as well as not disturbing him going from the toasty comfort of your arms to a cold bed. It can also help with him feeling more oriented to his environment.

Good luck OP, lack of sleep when you have a busy lifestyle is no joke!

Snore. She’s on the outside, I’m on the inside. The only way she can go is off the edge. And I don’t move. I never have. All my babies slept like this. As did we all as babies. This works for me and the settee is what I’ve got at the moment

@highlandpony

I suggest you reach out to ss or your hv if you only have a sofa to sleep on.

No. Why the fuck would anyone with half a fucking brain contact the fucking social?

My bath cracked, it flooded the house, there are no floorboards upstair while the lecky gets sorted. Don’t be a fucking pillock. Hello, is that the social? Aye ma baths flooded my hoosie and I’d like a new one please? What you’ve got thousands of folk with actual real problems? I’ve to suck it up and get on with it aye? 🙄

How long did you do sleep training for, OP?

I'd get your DP to do it and see it through at least a week. If need be, go out of the house and leave him to it. If you usually get DC down to sleep with millions of snuggles and co sleeping etc, it can help if someone else does it.

The stress and sleep deprivation that you're going through at the moment, I can completely empathise with. Trying to function yourself, let alone with 2 children and studying must be an absolute nightmare. I noticed that you have listen many things, but you didn't mention a bath. Whether you have tried this or not, we have personally found that if you keep them up later, then put them in a bath to relax their muscles, then have a milk. Always put the same soft music on so they can associate that with bed time, then hopefully they will sleep for a few hours at least. Let's say 5 hours. Hopefully some sort of routine could help in this regard. Basically "Bath, Bottle and Bed."

Have you tried cosleeping, just you and him, in a bed?

My DS never slept through the night. Didn't nap either. I put him in the same room as his sister and I got my first night's sleep since he was born. He was reassured by her being there.

You’ve tried an awful lot of things so I’m wondering if the lack of consistency is a factor. How long did you stick at the sleep training for and what method did you use?

It's highly likely the fact that he falls asleep in your arms that causes him to then wake up. The aim of all sleep training is to get them used to falling asleep by themselves in their own bed and for the majority of babies this will result in a significant reduction in night wakings. When you say you tried it, what did you try and for how long? We did gradual retreat over about ten days and it worked a dream, and it's a gentler approach if you're worried about leaving them alone to cry, but just as effective as something like controlled crying as it ultimately results in the same thing - baby falling asleep by themselves. If you try it, I'd recommend writing out the plan/schedule ahead of time and sticking to it so you're not tempted to drag it out for weeks or give up half way (we found the crying got worse in the middle of the ten days and then improved again. Zero crying by night ten)

This is a special kind of hell. You need to put him to bed awake so he learns how to fall to sleep himself. Just a gradual process of putting him down sleepy and comforting him till you get to a point where you can put him down and walk away. Everything crossed for you. It's so very draining. IT WILL PASS.

Following on from my previous post I've never sleep trained. It takes 5 mins of lullabies, 5 mins shushing, 2 mins of just still being there in contact with toddler and their asleep and creeping out the room.... so 12 mins of gentle love for 10 hrs solid sleep.

Sorry, it's probably not what you want to hear (fairy dust would be easier!!)

I agree with people saying he needs to be put to bed in his cot with the lights off (maybe a small night light if you must)

bath, book, bottle, bed - he needs to have a routine & be taught to self settle. He won't settle when he wakes, if he doesn't settle himself when he goes to bed.

lay him in his cot (in a sleeping bag, no pillow) shushhh Pat with your hand on his chest/tummy, not pushing him down, just using slight pressure to make him feel secure.

you won't crack his constant waking & needing attention, until he learns to self settle. Babies wake up & can be awake a long time. 'Sleeping through' isn't really 'sleeping through' it's 'not disturbing ithers for attention'.

you can do this!

I’m sorry, that sounds so tough 💐

The only thing I can suggest is that you and your DH sleep in shifts. If one of you is ‘on duty’ from say 9pm-2am, and the other takes 2am-7am, then you’ll both get at least five hours of unbroken sleep.