Can you help me decipher this old note please?

[silvertits]

I've just been given some snuff boxes that belonged to my grandmother and have been going through them and making a note of what I've actually received today. A fair few of them have notes inside claiming to be pieces of the Mary Rose, Old London Bridge, the Royal George and similar (chinny reckon). I've managed to decipher most of the stuff that came with those boxes but now I'm stuck.

I've read the top half of this note - saying the box was made from Napoleon's willow 🤔but am stuck on what comes after it says the tree fell in 1829. Can anyone help me decipher what it says please?

It's very creased and the ink is faded - very difficult to make any of it out.

Not quite sure but it's certified so it must be true

Can you flatten it and share another photo? The shadow is making it even harder to read.

Yes it's been folded up very small in a snuff box for eons - I can make out "This box is made from a willow tree which grew around(?) the tomb of Napoleon Bonaparte & to which a rope was fixed for lowering the Coffin into the Grave.
The tree died and fell in 1829" but then go cross eyed

This is the best I can do. Am not sure it’s any better

From what I can work out, it's then signed my someone G... Military xxx and Aide de Camp to Lieutenant (?) Sir (?) xxx

And then there's a second signature xxx Commissioner to xxx
Dated May 31 1895

Is it an address in the bottom left? Bedfordshire or Bedford Square.

Tbh, I have no idea about this style of handwriting but I'm enjoying guessing. I do know people who do a lot of history or ancestry are much better as understanding these shapes of letters so hopefully someone like that will be along soon!

Picked out a few words

did someone die in 1829? (Fell - perhaps war related)

Do you have a phone that scan the text? (In iPhone, scanner is in notes 📝)

Oh I'll give a try with the phone - didn't know that was a thing. Thank you @BobbyGentry

@MaggieFS I think I've worked that bit out a bit G.... Military Secretary and Aide de Camp to Admiral Sir Hudson Lowe.

Hudson Lowe was governor general of St Helena and his Aide de Camp was Gideon Gorrequer - but I can't make that signature make Gorrequer at all. Possibly Gideon at a stretch.

I'm actually rather enjoying the squinting and hoping and mad googling. There are worse ways to spend an afternoon.

I can make out up to the “god bless you” bit. What a fantastic piece of history to own though (even if it doesn’t make much sense!)

The top bit reads This box is made from a Willow tree

Oh just realised you already wrote that in the OP 😂

Hudson Lowe was Governor of St Helena when Napoleon was there.

Charles Dallas was Governor at the time the willow tree is said to have fallen (1829). Sir William Grey-Wilson at the time the note was written (1895). Neither of those names seem to appear on the note.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Governor_of_Saint_Helena

The last bit looks like 'Commissioner to St Helena' but I have't been able to find a list of names. Perhaps the address is where they lived/worked?

Do you think the whole thing was written in 1895, or the first part soon after 1829 and then the 'certified' section in 1895?

I don't think it says 1895, I think it's 1835 - the 3 on May 31 and the 3 in 1835 look the same, and I know that Hudson Lowe had left by the time the tree is reputed to have fallen.

The more I look at the signature the more it looks like Gioden - so a misspelling of Gideon. I am under no illusions that it's genuine in any way, but I do think it's pretty old and is probably some old scammer trying to make his willow snuff box worth more 😂. That said there are some writing examples of Gideon Gorrequer online and it's strikingly similar to the top half of the note.

I think I could argue that the signatures are allegedly of people who were on St Helena at the time of Napoleon's death and are using their title/rank from that time to give credence to their claim that this is Napoleon's willow rather than any old willow from the UK, and I suspect given the supposed date on the note it will have been supplied in the UK. Not going to hold my breath though, just trying to work out what it says. And rather enjoying what I can work out and how suspicious/believable it makes it all.

Ah, I see what you mean about the second date being 1835 not 1895.

Hudson Lowe wasn't an Admiral, he was in the army and was a Lieutenant-Colonel.

I have seen a reference to there being willow trees next to Napoleon's grave, so that does make sense.

How well made is the snuff box? Could it have been made on St Helena or does it look professional and therefore probably made in Europe?

Good point about him not being an Admiral - but I can't make the word before Sir Hudson Lowe make any kind of army rank, maybe General if I want to really convince myself that's what it says but it just doesn't look like anything other than admiral.

The snuff box looks pretty well made - it's nicely turned and polished - but I don't think that helps a huge amount because that surely could have been done in St Helena or in Europe.

I really don't believe it to be a napoleonic artefact or anything like that, but the old note is interesting and I really want to work out all the words.

I think the second signature might be followed by Captain, New Commission to St Helena (and my googling suggests that the St Helena Act 1833 makes it possibly plausible a commission was created).

Anyway, this is fun and informative - I feel I've learned more today than I expected to.

If the last name relates to a job title of 'Commissioner to St Helena', I've found that men with that title were sent to St Helena at the time of Napoleon's exile:

(page 50) books.google.co.uk/books?id=TVNf50szNoMC&pg=PA50&lpg=PA50&dq=%22commissioner+to+st+helena%22&source=bl&ots=Lxukr77enh&sig=ACfU3U2ozRktPCL8K6lmY5DHTRdPLnLlKQ&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiyv7DUmcn5AhWQRMAKHTOeDPQ4ChDoAXoECAMQAw#v=onepage&q=%22commissioner%20to%20st%20helena%22&f=false

Under the Convention signed in 1815 the Prussian, Austrians and Russian were to send Commissioners to St Helena (to keep an eye on things). Austria sent Baron Bartholomaus von Sturmer; the Russians sent Alexandre, Count de Balmain; but the Prussians didn't send one. The French did: the Marquis de Montchenu. Could the person who signed the note have been the aide-de-camp to one of those men, not Hudson Lowe?

And I've found out more about the willows at Napoleon's grave than I ever thought possible:
napoleonswillow.weebly.com/the-real-napoleons-willow.html

If people really did manage to keep cuttings from the willow alive long enough to survive a voyage from St Helena (weeks if not months) that would be impressive.

I'm pretty sure I remember an episode of the Antiques Road show where someone had something made of Napoleon's willow with an authentication letter like yours, and the Antique's Road show presenter said they made loads of commemorative memorabilia out of the wood when the tree fell and shipped them back to Europe.

According to this book
books.google.co.uk/books?id=7z49zZlicO4C&pg=PA95&lpg=PA95&dq=napoleon+willow+souvenir&source=bl&ots=WwHnh-_iel&sig=ACfU3U3ym6ONP7TgCTIY-dAXuMtyzPjwRg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiG-bC6p8n5AhVGiVwKHf-YAk8Q6AF6BAg1EAM#v=onepage&q=napoleon%20willow%20souvenir&f=false

"After Napoleon's death at St. Helena, the trees that lined his grave site were stripped of their branches, the wood carried away and slivered into souvenirs. A "Piece of Napoleon's Willow" is a standard item of Napoleana ..."

What are you going to do with it? Even if it's not genuine, it's probably a genuine 'fake' souvenir, so is still interesting!

What are you going to do with it? Even if it's not genuine, it's probably a genuine 'fake' souvenir, so is still interesting!

This is how I feel about it - it's clearly old so even if it's not legit it's interesting.

No idea what I'm going to do with it. I have 16 others too, and no need for them. I'm not really sure what modern uses there might be for snuff boxes either. I suspect my first port of call is to get them appraised and try to find out how they came to be a collection - certainly they went to my grandparents that way so I'm really not clued up about their providence or heritage.

If you lay a piece of glass over it, it would be easier to see... alternatively, take a photocopy.

Good idea @merrymelodies - have just remembered there's a flatbed scanner on the printer. DH is now casting his eyes over it too.

Put a cloth over and iron it.

So I've had a little bit of success this morning by going through the British Library's online Endangered Archives Programme records for St Helena from 1841. There was an entry in the correspondence from the governor about a DeuTaaffe. Which I think is the first signature on the letter. A bit more delving found a record of baptism on St Helena for a George Andrew DeuTaaffe from 1795. I can't find out much more about him, but it seems like there was a chap who could have been on St Helena at the appropriate time whose name was written on the note in my snuff box.

It's pretty amazing what information you can find without leaving your house these days.