Abortion for autism

[Intimes22]

My son is severely autistic with no language or understanding. He can be violent and needs all self care done for ,him.
We saw his doctor today and during that appointment we discussed cause and that in her opinion a gene is responsible for asd. She mentioned that her hope one day a cause is found with prenatal screening.

So it got me thinking if a test was created and all women was offered it. How many would opt for an abortion? As asd is a spectrum.
down syndrome is different obviously but its still a spectrum where most women abort if found during prenatal screening.

I believe that its the womens choice no matter what.

Women who TFMR do so because there precious and loved baby will suffer and they can't bear for that to be their experience of life.

When you receive a diagnosis of a fetal anomaly, it is checked, scanned, double checked and tested.

My babies were perfect, but they were very ill. And the grief of the loss of them is always present

I won't derail too much, but I hope you escaped your abuser and have a happy and healthy life now. ❤️

I completely agree.

Women have the right to choose full stop.
Would I have an abortion if I wanted the child but knew they were disabled? Yes.
Would that include Autism if it was a 100% accurate test? Yes.

I completely agree the womens choice trumps all.
In my opinion the law shouldn't come into abortion full stop. its a medical issue not a legal one. Instead more support and information regarding disabilities. Better sen provision in schools and at home.
I would hate to live in a world without autism or down syndrome but the answer isn't a ban.

There is no "autism gene" but polygenic scores for autism can be created; this would allow embryo selection. It wouldn't be clear-cut or guarantee anything, but would certainly reduce the likelihood of having a child with ASD. I think this will almost certainly happen in the near future. I don't know whether it could be used in a prenatal screening test as well as in embryo selection--I guess some variant of the NIPT test could be used to work out the polygenic risk score of a particular embryo?

absolutely it's the woman's choice. Personal experience of the most severe downs syndrome and the most severe autism, I "d find the latter harder to deal with and ttheir quality of life seemed worse too.

As a pp said, a lot of this is tied into the current lack of support and educational provision for those with ASD. If we did a much much better job of that, so people knew there was help available, a decent financial, practical and educational support care plan to access at every stage of the person's life then it might be a far less daunting prospect that parents could prepare for. I also believe that it's ultimately the parents' choice. In questions of competing 'rights' it's always ultimately about choosing one over another.

Neurodiversity is a bit different to most forms of "disability" and at the high functioning end, neurodiverse thinkers are hugely influential on our society and its development. That doesn't mean that they don't require appropriate support and education.

It is support (or the lack of) that creates a burden on parents and their families.

I don't work because there isn't a financially justifiable form of childcare that maximises DS's capacity to function and retains the financial benefits of me working. He's an intelligent, loving child and generally a great asset to society although can become overwhelmed at annoyances like birds singing.

Having an autistic child with a lower capacity to function in a society that doesn't support caring or respite must be extremely distressing and draining to parents. I grew up with a relative with high care needs but placid disposition for other reasons and the emotional toll was different. He also fortunately had clear care needs and it was probably the golden age of support during his young adulthood.

The mother's needs have to come first; she bares the physical risks of producing a child, and is most likely to bare the emotional and social toll.
But mothers don't cope because social support is inadequate. That can be changed if society wants to prioritise it

I adore DS and the only thing I'd manipulate for him as a person is to ease his frustration. I'd love for his threshold to cope with life to be higher. But I love who he fundamentally is. Creative, focused thinkers like him do advance society. Society would suffer if neurodiverse thinkers were edited out.

However part of the reason that there isn't a DC3 is because DS was such a bloody hard toddler. I naturally self-edited my family around what we could live with (another major factor was my SPD hips-t'other SPD, we collect both sensory and pelvic versions). That was done without awareness of autism being present or the requirement of abortion.

It looks like autism is too genetically complex for this to be a logistically viable option anyway and will remain a hypothetical debate.

I would abort.

As a pp said, a lot of this is tied into the current lack of support and educational provision for those with ASD. If we did a much much better job of that, so people knew there was help available, a decent financial, practical and educational support care plan to access at every stage of the person's life then it might be a far less daunting prospect that parents could prepare for.

I don't think so, to be honest. That's the "nice" fig leaf argument that everyone always gives for the reason why they might choose to abort a disabled (or neurodivergent) child. But it's probably bollocks. Excellent care services have done nothing to slow the shift towards near-universal abortion of fetuses with Downs in places like Iceland and Sweden.

I think the deciding factor will be families' risk levels, and how good polygenic score technology turns out to be. If PGS turns out to be reasonably accurate for ASD in practice (and the signs suggest that it is already not bad at all), families who are already struggling with a child who has autism may be strongly motivated to use the technology for subsequent siblings.

@greenteafiend you may be right, absolutely and the situation with Downs is certainly interesting. In the end, even with excellent support, raising an ND child or one with severe needs isn't something I think we can force on anyone at a point where abortion is an option...but then the question becomes when does it stop being an option? The situation where the 24 week limit can be ignored in cases of downs and other conditions is morally dubious already from an equalities perspective.

Thanks for that info. i wonder if thats what she meant ...

Bit late to this thread but my son is also severely autistic, sounds similar to your child. I can't say whether I'd have terminated the pregnancy had I known how difficult my life would be because I can't imagine my life without him, I don't want to. I wouldn't judge anyone who decided to terminate a pregnancy on this basis though.

Fwiw, I'd say his quality of life is pretty decent. It doesn't take much to make him happy and he is content most of the time. He'll never have the worries that most of us have.