Navy or RAF at 16 or 18

[moshmoshi]

My DS, 14 nearly 15, really wants to join the RAF or the navy. His dream is to be a pilot but he does realise that is very competitive so he would be happy to do another job if pilots weren't recruiting or if he didn't get selected.

He's now considering joining at 16, straight after GCSEs, rather than do A Levels or a BTEC/T levels. His reasoning is that he could train in something he found interesting and be in the same position as an A Level entrant 2 years later. He also thinks that he could apply to pilot training from within the navy or Air force. The areas he'd be interested in would be engineering, communications and intelligence.

I'm not sure if his reasoning is correct as we have no armed forces experience. If I spoke to a navy/raf careers office would they give honest answers or tell you what you want to hear?

He is very academically capable (7s, 8s and 9s expected for GCSE) but does not see the point in learning for learnings sake. For him it needs a practical purpose. He is quick on the uptake and I think he would do well with a forces apprenticeship, I'm just not sure what would be the best thing for me to advise him- would there me more/better opportunities for him at 18 with good A Levels or would the experience and qualifications he would get from 16-18 in the forces put him on the same footing?

Is there anyone with more knowledge/experience who could advise me?

The full recruitment information is on the relevant websites but it's my understanding that pilots need to be at least 17.5 (same for many positions) and under 25 ... check the current rules. I would suggest he goes to 6th form but speaks to the recruiter because it takes a long time to get through selection. My dd is navy and it took 11 months from first going to the recruiting office (under 18's need to be accompanied at least then)

Navy travel and experience a lot more from the job

He also needs perfect eyesight! My DD's isn't, hence she isn't a pilot.

I highly recommend the navy, and also going to university first - there's huge bursaries available for some disciplines if you join up whilst at university, DD's living costs have basically been covered by the navy

With the caveat that my info might be somewhat past it's sell by date I'd tell him if he is aiming to be a pilot he'd probably be best hanging on in education at least until A levels.

AFAIK pilot numbers required by HM Forces now are relatively low and the selection process will be highly competitive. There's also the issue that not everybody can pass the required medicals and selection, and after that not everybody passes pilot training so it's not a bad thing to have a few strings on the educational bow in case the career path doesn't work out.

For completeness I did know a couple of people who joined the RAF as apprentices, then took a commission and went though pilot training but that was a long time ago and it was rare...be interesting to hear from someone more current on the subject.

If he really wants to be a pilot I would advise him to get the qualifications and apply for pilot.

I believe that if you apply from the ranks you still need to have the qualifications for the role you want to apply for. So he would need to go through recruit training, trade training, then do A levels once he starts his first posting. The services would support him to get qualifications, but with all the moving around in the early years, exercises, and the potential of going on operations once he is 18, it might it be practically quite difficult and take a long time. I think his chain of command would also need to support his application to be an officer.

Pilot recruitment is extremely competitive and candidates really need to show that they really want it to be successful. If someone doesn't quite make the grade they might be offered a different role so I think it's worth aiming for the top and working down from there. Recruitment centres may try and channel people into the roles that are harder to fill.

I left the RAF 10 years ago and I wasn't aircrew so my advice might be out of date.

Thanks for the advice, seems like sixth form before application might be better. He might be persuaded to do Maths and Physics or an engineering T level. He has no interest in university at the moment but may change his mind. He does realise how competitive pilot selection is which is why he's trying to think of broader options. I think he'd be good at lots of the careers on their website but that could be mum bias!

@EllaCorazon

That's much better advice than I gave - I'll admit I hadn't considered the complication of trying to consolidate trade training, take A's and the factor of Ops disrupting the process.

If the OP's sons aim is aircrew I would agree that he has to aim for that first..

He was hopeful that a level 3 apprenticeship might be considered instead of A Levels but maybe not.

Navy is great. I have a relative who just wanted to leave school. A high achiever in every exam since joining. Travelling the world and being paid for it. There's no real need to spend money so already has huge amount of savings. So much better than huge debts from uni and an (often) useless degree.

Could he be sponsored by the forces at university?? DH was RAF pilot but is now retired. Loved the job.

I think TBH a trip to a recruiting centre is needed but I'd heed EllaCorazon's comment about the recruiters steering people towards less popular roles.

One issue mentioned upthread was medicals - one advantage of beginning the whole process by applying for aircrew is that if called forward for selection (?at Cranwell these days for the RAF) your son might find out PDQ if there are any medical issues that might bar him from serving as aircrew...I'm not trying to frighten anyone but there can be some really almost trivial conditions that could be a "stopper" on a flying career.

If the intent is to join any trade with a view to transitioning to aircrew it would be best to know if there are any medical blockers to flying duties lurking in the background, rather than finding out about having been "in" a year or two.

Didn't think about the medical side of things apart from eyesight, but you're right worth knowing in advance. Better than choosing a trade then finding out future air crew wasn't even a possibility!

Hi, I used to be a pilot in the RN.

1. You can't join either service as a pilot at 16. You need to join as an officer with A levels or higher from age 18. To achieve this you need to pass flying aptitude tests and AIB (RN) or OASC (RAF). To take these tests you need to convince a (officer's) careers recruiter that you've got a chance of passing. N.B although they work out of career's offices they are not there full time. If any recruiters are talking up the possibility of joining at 16 and transferring to be a pilot later they are being very optimistic/lying.
2. Factors to consider:

What does he want to fly? Where does he want to end up being based? Does he want to spend long (6 months) deployments on ships? Does he want to just fly (more RAFy) or have a more rounded job with more management/wholeship responsibilities (RN).

1. In his position I'd recommend doing A levels or whatever fits and is acceptable to both services. I'd spend the next 2 years doing lots of C.V/personal development in leadership positions e.g DoE/outdoor pursuits/organising. Then apply to both and see what happens.

Thanks for all that detail @ForestDad. He is certain about any of those things yet, more drawn to Navy I think going by discussion about how he sees his future. I will talk to him about the transferring after joining at 16 probably being over optimistic, hopefully that will convince him to stay in education another couple of years! It looks like a good career in either service tbh and I would be fine with him joining at 16 but I don't want him to restrict possible opportunities for the sake of 2 more years at school/college.

He does a few of the personal development things you mentioned- just finishing bronze Duke of e, does air cadets, sails and cycles but will talk to him about how all this could be developed.

One of DS friends is training to be a pilot, they met in air cadets. His other friend was turned down on medical grounds. I honestly think 16 is too young to make a decision that impacts your entire life so much. DS friends were all in cadets till they aged out at 20 and then applied. They took A levels and then worked for a couple of years.

My daughter he's just gone in the RAF at 17. I'm extremely Glad that she has, rather than docking about at sixth form then Uni for the next 5 years, getting into debt and coming away with a ten a penny degree... or working in a minimum wage job with miserable people.

Excuse typos 🙈

Go and talk to the relevant careers office. Pilots are nearly always graduates. Joining the Air Cadet Corps or Sea Cadets gets you points. It shows you have an interest. Loads of jobs you never think about. Logistics, medicine, catering. Flying is the glamour one. Helicopter or fixed wing? But there are Navigators, Warfare Officers etc. The men and women who fly in the surveillance aircraft do an important job. A loadmaster is responsible for securing the loads in transport aircraft correctly. If you don't mind the discipline and some of the pointless stuff the forces are a good career. I know a few who have done it and it set them up for other careers. Not all glamour though.

Should also say they do fund people throug University but you are a member of that Service, paid accordingly and expected to behave as such.

But there are Navigators

Just as a point of info AFAIK Navigator as a specialisation in it's own right in the RAF disappeared a while ago ..

www.key.aero/forum/modern-military-aviation/109575-raf-say-farewell-navigator

Bit late adding this but does your local college do a uniformed services course? It can be used as access to higher education/is equivalent to alevels but is focused on preparing 16-18 year old for the military, police etc. Lots of physical elements, so not just classroom.

@lovelilies there are lots of ways to do it and whats right for one isn't for another
Not everyone is min wage jobs is miserable , yes we want the best for our kids but my friends son is not very academic and hes loving his just over min wage job and since leaving school saved quite a few grand and and will have a good deposit.
So many paths to go down and each child is different
OP if i were you I would speak to the recruiters and find out current requirements and what they recommend
My ds is doing the UPS course level 3 90 credits as he is interested in the RAF but as he wasn't totally sure , the UPS course was a good fit for him

I was referring to the Navy but suspect RAF might still teach it. Knew someone whose son was Navigator on Ark Royal. Billion pound ship with crew depending on him to get them safely from A to B. Reporting only to the Captain thats a lot of responsibility and pa ys v.well

I’ll never forget the midshipman I met on HMS Albion just before I did my AIB. He was just 18 & was steering the whole ship. I was absolutely in awe of him!