Page 12 | Will DD likely be penalised for this

curiousitygotthebetterofme · 2022-06-04T21:44:00+00:00

DD(15) sat a GCSE exam yesterday, which she prepared so well and worked hard for. She is aware of all the exam hall rules including that you can’t bring mobile phones in with you. Yesterday, she had her phone with her but forgot to leave it at the school reception until after the exam was finished. She was not using her mobile phone during the exam nor did she attempt to. The phone was also switched off. It was in her pocket and it fell out onto the floor and invigilator seen it happen. Her head of year rang me yesterday to inform that they are obliged to report it to the exam board and that they could very well take marks off her or disqualify her. I feel sorry for DD as she worked so hard for these exams and she has been quite distressed over it all and the possibility of being penalised. It just slipped her mind but she knows to be more aware for future exams. I get that exam boards have to follow procedures, but surely the fact she wasn't actually using the phone will work in her favour?

ThanksItHasPockets · 05/06/2022 18:13

The PP pretending not to understand the rules must be on a wind-up. Candidates cannot even wear a watch of any description any more. It has caused a huge problem for us; the exams for my subject need really careful time management and our big clocks for the exam hall are all analogue. It turns out that a very large proportion of the students can't read analogue clocks any more. We have been trying to persuade the headteacher to buy some big digital clocks but of course there is no money.

MrsHamlet · 05/06/2022 18:14

I think any student found in breach of the policy should at least be afforded the opportunity to prove their innocence if their network provider can prove the phone wasn’t turned on during the exam.
The manpower needed to carry out this type of investigation for every student who committed this malpractice would be phenomenal. And in any case, the malpractice is having it in the exam room at all. It's not about being on in the exam room.

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:16

FlissyPaps · 05/06/2022 17:56

@minutesturntohours Wow, thanks for the abuse.

My point, for the hard of thinking, was aside from the 'rule', what is the issue with it?

Oh get a thicker skin.

If they scrap the ‘rule’ and make it ok for the students to have phones switched off in pockets, just imagine how that’ll turn out?

Some students will turn them on. Some students will use them to text their friends/parents etc. Some students will use them to cheat.

Are you the hard of thinking here? Serious question.

Also you didn’t answer my previous question.
Do you tell your children to ignore the rules?

No, but DD didn't ignore the rules. SHe made a bloody mistake. Are you telling me you've never left your house unlocked? Left your bank card? Lost something?

She made a mistake.

If SOME students may use them, then if the invigilator doesn't stop that, thats their issue. thats what they get the big bucks to do. The poor girl dropped her phone on the floor!

It's not about scrapping the rule, but you seem unable to tell me why havent a switched off phone on the floor is an issue.

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:17

Carrotten · 05/06/2022 18:10

No one uses the phone in the exam hall. They go to the toilet and Google the answer. This is cheating 101, has been a tactic since phones had Internet. It was talked about in my day 10 yrs ago. The phone is obviously switched off during the exam hall, so you can say "oh I forgot I didn't use it etc".

No one is caught with a phone and goes 'fair cop gov I was googling the answer'. It's always I forgot it was in my pocket, and that's exactly why all students caught with a phone are penalised. You simply cannot prove they didn't use it if it was on their person during the exam.

Phones are quite heavy, going off in the bag is different because you might forget to switch it off. But I can't believe that you don't check pockets and check again, when students are reminded again and again, you don't notice the weight of the phone in your pocket etc. The fact it was switched off suggests she didn't forget so much about it as she remembered to switch it off!

But she didnt go to the bloody toilet, did she?

sleezeandwineparty · 05/06/2022 18:18

I would be asking how they knew she had a phone on her? She could easily left it at home or with a friend rather than deal with having to remember and be bothered with going to take and collect her phone.
So how do they know she had it in the exam is it never came out? Which brings it back to the people who say it's up to the school/exam board to prove she was using it or even had it.

Simonjt · 05/06/2022 18:19

Minimum wage big bucks? Yes the OPs daughter made a mistake, but that doesn’t mean she is exempt from rules that every single child on this planet has to follow if they sit an examboard regulated by JCQ.

How do you suggests students are searched for phones before using the toilet to google answers? As thats easily done if a turned off phone is left in a pocket.

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:19

Maireas · 05/06/2022 17:46

It's not vitriol.
People are pointing out public exams procedure and the clarity of rules.

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Would you do that if it was your child? Your distressed child in tears - you'd point out rules, would you?

ZoyaTheDestroyer · 05/06/2022 18:20

I truly do not understand your point, @minutesturntohours. The possession of the phone is expressly forbidden by the organisation who administer the examinations. You can understand this and still have compassion for a sixteen-year-old who has made a mistake.

Simonjt · 05/06/2022 18:21

sleezeandwineparty · 05/06/2022 18:18

I would be asking how they knew she had a phone on her? She could easily left it at home or with a friend rather than deal with having to remember and be bothered with going to take and collect her phone.
So how do they know she had it in the exam is it never came out? Which brings it back to the people who say it's up to the school/exam board to prove she was using it or even had it.

I’m fairly sure it didn’t teleport from her bedroom to the floor next to her in an exam.

thingymaboob · 05/06/2022 18:21

There is absolutely no excuse. It's standard procedure and an important rule. If the exam board didn't take it seriously they'd discredit themselves

FlissyPaps · 05/06/2022 18:22

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:16

No, but DD didn't ignore the rules. SHe made a bloody mistake. Are you telling me you've never left your house unlocked? Left your bank card? Lost something?

She made a mistake.

If SOME students may use them, then if the invigilator doesn't stop that, thats their issue. thats what they get the big bucks to do. The poor girl dropped her phone on the floor!

It's not about scrapping the rule, but you seem unable to tell me why havent a switched off phone on the floor is an issue.

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I’ve made plenty of mistakes. I’ve learned from them.

I sat my GCSEs in 2010. Always made sure I handed my phone in to the invigilators and kept hold of my numbered ticket - so I was able to get my phone back after the exam.

Yes I agree the OPs daughter made a mistake. And she will learn from it.

There’s no excuses sadly.

Ive told you why it’s an issue. Can you not read?

She had a phone on her. Even though it’s switched off, it’s a breach of the exam conditions and rules.

It’s an issue to have a phone switched off because the OP’s daughter could have easily asked to go to the toilet and quickly switched it on to look up an answer or look at some notes.

If we allow all students to have phones switched off on their person - it will cause issues. I don’t have to list them to you. Use your brain.

ChateauxNeufDePoop · 05/06/2022 18:23

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:16

No, but DD didn't ignore the rules. SHe made a bloody mistake. Are you telling me you've never left your house unlocked? Left your bank card? Lost something?

She made a mistake.

If SOME students may use them, then if the invigilator doesn't stop that, thats their issue. thats what they get the big bucks to do. The poor girl dropped her phone on the floor!

It's not about scrapping the rule, but you seem unable to tell me why havent a switched off phone on the floor is an issue.

Show quote history

In case she did all the things outlined above! And in case she had a switched off phone in all her previous exams too and did the things outlined above.

All the mistakes you list probably wouldn't happen with numerous reminders in the lead up to it so it's more than arguable that she did ignore the rules.

And no, invigilators don't get big bucks, it's a little over NMW.

And yes, you're very hard of thinking.

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:23

FlissyPaps · 05/06/2022 18:22

I’ve made plenty of mistakes. I’ve learned from them.

I sat my GCSEs in 2010. Always made sure I handed my phone in to the invigilators and kept hold of my numbered ticket - so I was able to get my phone back after the exam.

Yes I agree the OPs daughter made a mistake. And she will learn from it.

There’s no excuses sadly.

Ive told you why it’s an issue. Can you not read?

She had a phone on her. Even though it’s switched off, it’s a breach of the exam conditions and rules.

It’s an issue to have a phone switched off because the OP’s daughter could have easily asked to go to the toilet and quickly switched it on to look up an answer or look at some notes.

If we allow all students to have phones switched off on their person - it will cause issues. I don’t have to list them to you. Use your brain.

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No, you still haven't told me why the person with a switched off phone in her pocket who didnt leave the exam hall is an issue, I'm afraid.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 05/06/2022 18:23

@minutesturntohours - this is the answer to your question, which @Scepticalwotsits posted upthread -

”Because said student could go to the toilet, turn it on while in the toilet get answers, turn it off and go back into the hall.

if a student really wants to cheat they can. Hiding phones in the toilets prior to exams is a common trick. Our school stopped that by only allowing students to use the ones in the sports hall, which were closed off except for exams in the hall over exam season, other schools in the area had this happen to them Jensen why ours changed their policy and secured the toilets.

also it being off means nothing. Doesn’t mean it wasn’t on at any point. That’s why the rule is no phones full stop. They don’t need to catch you in the act, just ban the item, which is what they do. Therefore if you have a phone on you there is a possibility to cheat therefor they treat it as if you have cheated”

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:24

ChateauxNeufDePoop · 05/06/2022 18:23

In case she did all the things outlined above! And in case she had a switched off phone in all her previous exams too and did the things outlined above.

All the mistakes you list probably wouldn't happen with numerous reminders in the lead up to it so it's more than arguable that she did ignore the rules.

And no, invigilators don't get big bucks, it's a little over NMW.

And yes, you're very hard of thinking.

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"in case" - bt she didnt, did she?

Why would she 'ignore' the rules?

And re invigilators - I'm a teacher, and we invigilate for free, so excuse me for not thinking it's wonderful how much pay they get a day for watchign weans write. If they weren't up to the job of being able to spot if someone is on their phone, they're not up to the job.

sleezeandwineparty · 05/06/2022 18:25

Sorry missed the bit about it falling out of her pocket, bang to rights I am afraid.

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:25

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 05/06/2022 18:23

@minutesturntohours - this is the answer to your question, which @Scepticalwotsits posted upthread -

”Because said student could go to the toilet, turn it on while in the toilet get answers, turn it off and go back into the hall.

if a student really wants to cheat they can. Hiding phones in the toilets prior to exams is a common trick. Our school stopped that by only allowing students to use the ones in the sports hall, which were closed off except for exams in the hall over exam season, other schools in the area had this happen to them Jensen why ours changed their policy and secured the toilets.

also it being off means nothing. Doesn’t mean it wasn’t on at any point. That’s why the rule is no phones full stop. They don’t need to catch you in the act, just ban the item, which is what they do. Therefore if you have a phone on you there is a possibility to cheat therefor they treat it as if you have cheated”

But she didn't go to the toilet.

You can't treat people like that. she didn't use it, so she shouldn't have been treated like she did.

I have known more people who have cheated by writing on hands and arms than using phones - therefore how do we deal with people who have hands and arms?

DelphiniumBlue · 05/06/2022 18:26

This almost exact scenario happened to my DS, he was disqualified and had to take the resit the following Autumn.

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:26

FlissyPaps · 05/06/2022 18:22

I’ve made plenty of mistakes. I’ve learned from them.

I sat my GCSEs in 2010. Always made sure I handed my phone in to the invigilators and kept hold of my numbered ticket - so I was able to get my phone back after the exam.

Yes I agree the OPs daughter made a mistake. And she will learn from it.

There’s no excuses sadly.

Ive told you why it’s an issue. Can you not read?

She had a phone on her. Even though it’s switched off, it’s a breach of the exam conditions and rules.

It’s an issue to have a phone switched off because the OP’s daughter could have easily asked to go to the toilet and quickly switched it on to look up an answer or look at some notes.

If we allow all students to have phones switched off on their person - it will cause issues. I don’t have to list them to you. Use your brain.

Show quote history

You can't list them because there are no issues,

She COULD have gone to the toilet, but she didn't!

Maireas · 05/06/2022 18:27

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:19

Would you do that if it was your child? Your distressed child in tears - you'd point out rules, would you?

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Well, I checked that they left their phones at home. They were put on my dresser.
If (in spite of that) they made that mistake, yes, I would certainly point it out. I'd also be a loving and caring Mum, and try to help them, but I wouldn't make an excuse, and think the rules were bad and exceptions could be made.

MrsHamlet · 05/06/2022 18:27

No, you still haven't told me why the person with a switched off phone in her pocket who didnt leave the exam hall is an issue, I'm afraid.
Because having a phone in the exam room at all is malpractice.

ZoyaTheDestroyer · 05/06/2022 18:27

You’re a teacher?!?!!!

PinkPomegranite · 05/06/2022 18:28

It's an issue @minutesturntohours because the exam boards say mobile phones are not allowed in the exam room. That is the issue. It means there needs to be no investigation into did the student use it/Google something/text a friend for the answer/take a photo of the paper for a friend who is starting their exam later. Just you had a phone you face a penalty.
It doesn't mean the OP's DD was cheating or that she ignored the rules purposefully, just that she had a banned item.

ChateauxNeufDePoop · 05/06/2022 18:29

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:25

But she didn't go to the toilet.

You can't treat people like that. she didn't use it, so she shouldn't have been treated like she did.

I have known more people who have cheated by writing on hands and arms than using phones - therefore how do we deal with people who have hands and arms?

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You
Can't
Have
A
Phone
On
You

minutesturntohours · 05/06/2022 18:30

PinkPomegranite · 05/06/2022 18:28

It's an issue @minutesturntohours because the exam boards say mobile phones are not allowed in the exam room. That is the issue. It means there needs to be no investigation into did the student use it/Google something/text a friend for the answer/take a photo of the paper for a friend who is starting their exam later. Just you had a phone you face a penalty.
It doesn't mean the OP's DD was cheating or that she ignored the rules purposefully, just that she had a banned item.

I get the rules.

I'm asking what issue a switched off phone in her pocket causes.

Do they check everyone's watch, given that most weans have google watches? Or check that every wean with her hair down doesn't have an air pod in? or check all arms to make sure things arent written on them?

Will DD likely be penalised for this

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