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Original poster

Pronouncing H's

64 replies

nothingbutsnow · 07/03/2022 20:30

Or Aitches!

I love language and dialects, etc, and having grown up around a fairly quaint mixture of rp and regional-to-me accents I can't say that I ever really thought about it very much, nor noticed anyone stringently stress the H at the beginning of every word. Or else I didn't take a great deal of notice.

So take the words 'He was happy for hours and hours', do you stress the H here or not? Or just the first one?

It really alters the rhythm of your voice and sentences (obviously) but I find it fascinating. Equally I find it just as intriguing to attempt sentences in a very local dialect, too.
This made me think that how we pronounce our words has a great effect on our personal 'voice' and even how we use it.

Still, not many H stresses in my peer group, although quite a few older people I know do. To pronounce every 'h' in 'he was happy for hours and hours' slows the speech somewhat (makes it more considered perhaps) and I presume most people now prefer to talk faster! I mean, who has the time to give a damn??

Thoughts on this, do you do it?

OP posts:
Original poster
nothingbutsnow · 08/03/2022 00:12

Also, when I try to speak in an accent typical to my northern neighbours, the cadence of my voice lowers. So I am intrigued by how the 'lilt' of one's voice alters depending upon pronunciation and accent.

This reminds me of being at school and having a laugh with friends trying out different accents from around the world. Apparently I was pretty good at California and Australian - and with both my voice lifted higher especially towards the end of my sentences.

OP posts:
JaneJeffer · 08/03/2022 00:16

@Foxyloxy1plus1

I thought this was going to be about ‘aitch’ and ‘haitch’. The second is wrong and extremely irritating.
Not wrong or irritating.
JenniferBarkley · 08/03/2022 00:35

People posting that hatch is wrong and extremely irritating are wrong and extremely irritating though.

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

General education
Original poster
nothingbutsnow · 08/03/2022 01:04

But!

Is it AN aitch
or A 'aitch?

OP posts:
Alfixnm · 08/03/2022 01:13

I'm Irish (south) and it's "a haitch" here for sure!

alexdgr8 · 08/03/2022 01:44

are you saying that you honestly didn't know that the h in hour is silent ?
or were you being sarcastic ? hard to tell in print.
if you are a native english speaker, how could you not know that ?

teezletangler · 08/03/2022 01:47

without his emphasis

I struggle to pronounce the H due to the initial 'without' taking my breath. Does that make sense?

This is fair enough, I think. I am Canadian and we pronounce all words correctly Grin But when I say that quickly I do skim over the H a little and it sounds more like "without is emphasis". I think when people talk quickly there will always be sounds that elide.

LifeExperience · 08/03/2022 01:58

Americans don't pronounce the "h" in "herb" because it comes from French. There are many American ways to say "mirror." I say "mir rer. " Many southerners say "mir ra." Some other accents say "meer." I say "squirrel" exactly as it's spelled : "squi (short i) rel."

LifeExperience · 08/03/2022 02:04

Americans pronounce the name of the letter "h" as "aitch." In fact, the British pronunciation of "haitch" really grates on me. Otherwise I think most UK accents are attractive, although heavy Scottish accents are hard to understand.

mathanxiety · 08/03/2022 03:08

I say haitch. My mum says haitch.
My dad said aitch.
We're all Irish. Dad's family spoke West Brit English.

It's 'a haitch' and 'an aitch'.

'A hotel' and 'an hotel' are both correct, as are 'a history/ historian' and 'an history/ historian'. Which to use is a matter of personal taste.

The H in hours is always silent.

The H in He and Happy are not, but there is often a slide where the H is not pronounced, for example in the sentence 'Did he...?' where the D and the H run into each other.

Original poster
nothingbutsnow · 08/03/2022 04:44

@alexdgr8

are you saying that you honestly didn't know that the h in hour is silent ? or were you being sarcastic ? hard to tell in print. if you are a native english speaker, how could you not know that ?
you seem terribly invested in this Grin
OP posts:
ElliotGoss · 08/03/2022 05:18

Is it Haitch or Aitch from steps?

PinkNails1 · 08/03/2022 05:23

If we disregard the words with a silent h in them, I always sound out the h in words. I think cockneys say ‘otel but most places would say hotel. I thought this thread was going to be about haitch and aitch (I say the former).

PAFMO · 08/03/2022 05:48

@nothingbutsnow

Can I ask?

Another H thing.

In the sentence "without his emphasis' I struggle to pronounce the H due to the initial 'without' taking my breath. Does that make sense?

Unless we are doing a very quick pronunciation of 'without' that leaves room for less than a gasp Grin

Yes, it makes sense but it's not really to do with breath, but where the bits and pieces in your mouth have to move to between saying the "t" (which, at the end of the word "without" will be different to the "t" in the word "tea" acoustically) and getting to where they need to be for an "h". If you stand in front of a mirror and say the sentence very slowly, you'll see the movement. Your lips change position at the same time as your tongue moves backwards, and out of the way!
ChairCareOh · 08/03/2022 06:30

This reply has been deleted

Withdrawn at the user's request

girlmom21 · 08/03/2022 06:37

@RosesAndHellebores

Happy Her Huge Harmony

An 'otel
An 'istorical story
Short o, short I.

You should hear the H when saying hotel and historical.

Although I live in the Black Country so know people who don't pronounce any H's...

JenniferBarkley · 08/03/2022 06:59

@ElliotGoss

Is it Haitch or Aitch from steps?
Ah, now we're getting to the important questions Grin
TwoCoffeesPlease · 08/03/2022 07:04

@Foxyloxy1plus1

I thought this was going to be about ‘aitch’ and ‘haitch’. The second is wrong and extremely irritating.
It’s not wrong and the notion that it is is routed in classism.

amp.theguardian.com/science/shortcuts/2013/nov/04/letter-h-contentious-alphabet-history-alphabetical-rosen

girlmom21 · 08/03/2022 08:33

It’s not wrong and the notion that it is is routed in classism.

Why can't people just disagree on things without them being accused of some kind of discrimination these days?! Every time someone feels offended they cry about an -ism.

JenniferBarkley · 08/03/2022 08:59

Someone posting today that they hate haitch/gotten/aks may not be doing it from a consciously classist or racist standpoint. They've been raised to think of those words as incorrect and so their use is irritating.

However, many such words are used by Irish people/Black people/Catholics etc and the distaste at them has its roots in some pretty unsavoury views.

It's not unreasonable to point that out and hope some people might change their thinking from "right and wrong" to "different groups of people use language in different ways and that's ok".

PAFMO · 08/03/2022 09:26

@girlmom21

It’s not wrong and the notion that it is is routed in classism.

Why can't people just disagree on things without them being accused of some kind of discrimination these days?! Every time someone feels offended they cry about an -ism.

Well, the case of people saying that "haitch" is "wrong", is arguably worse than many -isms. Unless sectarianism and religious persecution don't count. The "classism" part of "haitch" v "aitch" came later. Either way it's not incorrect to say "haitch"
whywouldntyou · 08/03/2022 09:40

Each letter can be found in the dictionary. The letter H will be found in the 'A' section - aitch.

But:
Almost two thousand years later we are still split, and pronouncing H two ways: "aitch", which is posh and "right"; and "haitch", which is not posh and thus "wrong". Smile

girlmom21 · 08/03/2022 09:43

I say haitch because I'm not posh but I don't think that makes a difference to the really outdated class level that I fit into - or that 'class' is relevant.

merryhouse · 08/03/2022 09:48

Almost two thousand years later than what?

Please don't tell me Boudicca's main concern was not being allowed to talk about Adrian's wall...

amusedbush · 08/03/2022 13:32

Someone posting today that they hate haitch/gotten/aks may not be doing it from a consciously classist or racist standpoint. They've been raised to think of those words as incorrect and so their use is irritating.

These comments might not come from a consciously racist/classist place but being taught that it is wrong still displays ignorance.

Especially words like "aks" in your example, which are part of African American Vernacular English. AAVE is its own dialect so we should be moving away from the trope that it's wrong or a mispronunciation.