Was society too lax in the 90s/00s or are we too careful/paranoid now?

[december2020]

Becoming a new parent recently I've been reflecting on my own childhood and what his childhood may be like.

Potentially, I partially see my childhood through rose tinted glasses but everything felt so much more carefree back then. You could cycle with your friends without worrying that someone would try jump you and steal your bike. You could walk with your friends to the shop and buy some candy, where you'd feel safe and your parents wouldn't worry.
The list goes on.

Yet, it feels like DS will never get to experience that side and innocence of childhood anymore.

So it made me wonder, is it that society really has changed over the decades and become more sinister and malicious?
Or is it a factor of 'always-on' news from TV, radio, social media, web where scare and shock factor sells and it's really ramped up and built that fear and paranoia into us?
Or was society really dumb (for lack of a better word) back then and didn't realise the peril?

I'd love to hear your thoughts?

I think a major factor is the formalisation of time and avaliability.

I live on a dopey, "safe" housing estate and there used to be children playing out. My two are juniors age, but they don't because no one is free to play with. There are few SAHMs so children spend a lot of time in childcare and when they're not, it's weekends away, big days out and formal activities. I have to send DS2 to sports clubs in the summer to get a change from DS1's company. He has a classmate next door, but they're just not free for casual, spontaneous meeting.

I'm going to let them go out this year at 9 & 11, the 11yo needs a dose of independence before secondary, but there just hasn't been anyone around to let him do it with previously. DS2 was a bit on the young side and careless with crossing roads but has matured now. Also they're both small and look young so would look conspicuous playing out unsupervised.

Sitting at home on the internet/ gaming/ messaging isn't necessarily "safer" than being out in the real world with boundaries.

For me there is just far too much traffic but we live near a busy road with lorries and the like coming through.

I agree with children having a lot more scheduled activities these days, DS has some friends who have sports both weekend days, by the time you add in downtime, family time and a bit of homework there’s little time to play out

In the area I live there are more cars and so more traffic. I was actually in 6th form very close to where I live so I know the traffic is worse. This means that children can't safely play out.

Also in the 90s/early 00s school heads weren't on top of parents if they decided their child who was 8 years+ could walk home on their own, and wait an hour or two on their own before an adult came back. I have nephews and nieces who were children then and allowed to do that. Roll on to the late 00s and beyond, and I have family and friends having fights with their school heads about allowing their 10 year old to walk home with their same age or slightly older sibling.

Reading with interest.

I had a free range childhood in the rural North during the 90s, and now MN seems very, very risk averse to me. I also have a professional specialism in child development, and know how very beneficial the degree of freedom I had was to my confidence, my problem solving and thinking skills etc.

Part of it at least comes down to being so averse to risk that it seems to have tipped to a point where we don't get the benefits either any more.

Way more cars and people now, less ‘community’ feel etc as well. But we were probably too lax in the past as well as being a bit over cautious now.

It depends where you live. My 5 year old has more independence than I did at that age. He is allowed to knock on for friends 2 doors down and at the top of the road. My eldest walked to school by himself (with friends) aged 8, and my youngest will too if he wants to. I was probably more like 12 before I could do that, but I grew up in a big city and my children are growing up in a village.

My 5 year old is the oldest on our street, but if there was say a 7 year old going to the park I would allow him to go without me

My parents were more strict than others, even back in 80s and 90s.
Not allowed to go down the woods with the other kids, even though I was about 9 or 10.
Not allowed to the other housing estate, 10 minutes away, in Upper primary.
Not allowed down town at night to get pissed in the park until I was 15, which made me a social outcast.

I thought they were way over the top, compared to other parents.

My biggest fears for my kids, living here:
Cars. People drive like knobs.
Other kids. Especially those who move in packs, carry weapons and drugs, and dominate the route between our house and high school.

I was never allowed to play outside and wander off to the park or shops with my friends. So in that sense, my childrens childhoods are similar to mine.

I think we have a bit of a rose tinted view of the 90s/00s. We didn't hear as much about the really bad stuff then. No 24 hour breaking news apps or constant internet with dial up. You watched the news, and then you turned over to the soaps. You felt more disconnected.
I don't think there is any more danger than there has been for decades but I don't think the constant knowing about it is healthy.

We try to give ours freedom and time to be bored. We live in the countryside but have kids nearby and one neighbour kid (7) practically lives at our house. I send the 9 and 7 yr old to go get eggs down the road alone. We teach them to do things for themselves rather than do things for them. We are fairly strict at times but they get a lot of freedom too. So for example they can’t have screens after 7.30 and ones that can read have to do that for a certain amount of time. But if they want to try bake a cake, they can. But must clean up. Stuff like that. Sometimes I’m a bit shit and shout at them, but I do apologise and explain that I was tired, hangry, frustrated and it wasn’t about them, it was me. I hope that by being honest and helping them understand and not totally shielding them from my own failings or being shouted at a bit unfairly, they don’t grow up scared of unreasonable people or a colleague who shouts at them.

Basically I’m trying to do the best job I can but when things go tits up, use that too to help them learn to cope.

Growing up we would play tennis in the road, that would be impossible now, with the constant traffic and parked cars.

We would take a picnic and spend all day outside, mum wouldn't have a clue where we were and have absolutely no way of getting in touch with us. This was long before mobile phones.

We knew there were bad people around, but we had a community that looked out for each other. We could go to any neighbour if we felt we needed help.

I don't think the 24 hour news or social media have helped. We now seem to be bombarded with constant bad news.

@purpledagger

I was never allowed to play outside and wander off to the park or shops with my friends. So in that sense, my childrens childhoods are similar to mine.

I wasn't allowed to play in the street or nearby streets as too many cars. My council introduced traffic calming measures in the form of road humps on my road in the late 80s as lots of the side streets were being used as rat runs.

However I could go to a play scheme at my school in the warmer months, played in some friends gardens as they had to watch younger school aged siblings, with their younger siblings in tow we could wander off to play in parks and to local shops.

It then escalated to quite high road humps by the mid-90s. While I heard of it happening, I actually saw a couple of kids being run over from my bedroom window.

By the 00s all the surrounding side roads had road humps as well as being narrowed roads and with cars parked on both sides to slow drivers down. Some of the roads are also one way. It worked as you can safely cycle down those streets now at anytime though still not safe for kids to play in them, but it took about 30 years for the council to find out what worked...

So many more cars on the roads than there used to be. And poorer driving. I worry for my own safety sometimes never mind the kids.

I've never worried about abduction but always worry about them being hit by a car.

Agree with the fact that kids are in many after school clubs and activities now. When I was younger (for girls) there was only ballet, gymnastics and brownies, and most people only did one of these. There was no after school club. Lots of my sons friends have an activity every day. Life is very busy now so there's less time to just be free.

80s is nothing, we used to trust much younger kids to go out in earlier generations www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-462091/How-children-lost-right-roam-generations.html

Partly, before labour saving devices women had too much work to do within (or out of) the home to be able to keep tabs on their kids the whole time.

Stories like Maddie McCann, the Soham murders etc sell papers but the increased focus makes people think there's increased threat and I'm not sure that's true. Kids are most likely to be abused or killed at home. Keeping them in doesn't stop bad stuff from happening.

On the flip side, keeping them in does have negatives in terms of resilience, anxiety, being streetwise. But you need a critical mass of kids to watch out for each other and make sure people know to drive slowly etc.

An older friend who was young in the 40s told me they all knew who the dodgy people in their community were and which places they shouldn't go alone as they'd be cornered by dirty old men etc.

Places like Japan still let kids roam like they used to - I read 5 year olds just take themselves to school and it's normal. The way we raise kids in this country is exhausting and quite unhealthy.

I wasn't allowed to be free range
But I think a big difference for teens is tech. It was easy enough to bunk off school or to lie to your folks about where you were at other times.

Now kids have phones and often their parents use Find my phone type things. No more saying "late from school, netball practice" and going somewhere else instead.

I feel sorry for teens not having that freedom. I think 24 hour news is a very bad thing.

My parents were strict in some senses and my my mum was a worrier - but I definitely had a lot more independence than was I see now and read on here.

I completely agree - it feels like lately we're in the need to be so busy with lots of activities that kids just aren't available to "hang out" in an impromptu way.
Growing up me and my friends had activities either during the week or weekend but usually it was 1-2 a week and could fit in easily around daily life without being run ragged.

Wearing my rose tinted glasses it does make me feel a bit sad for DS if nothing changes , everything will have to be super structured and so much less freedom in fear of gangs/drugs/traffic/lack of community etc.

I think social media has a big part to play, especially when you’re a teen, as you’re never away from being in touch. You can’t just close the door on the outside world.

However, I also think, partly due to social media (and fomo), people/parents feel they have to be doing something.

Although yesterday was walking along seafront and there were lots of families out just going for a walk, toddlers on scooters etc, ie. Normal activities, not ‘organised’ ones.

I agree whole heartedly!
I'm so happy social media and an "always on" phone wasn't a thing growing up.
There was a nice thing of being able to disconnect from school. I can't imagine the pressure kids now are under - especially if they're being bullied. There is never a "safe space" anymore.

Even now, I can see how much time I waste aimlessly scrolling and wonder if I should just get rid of certain apps and platforms.
Or will I just replace the distraction with something else?

It does feel like kids aren't allowed to be kids anymore!

There are few SAHMs so children spend a lot of time in childcare and when they're not, it's weekends away, big days out and formal activities. I have to send DS2 to sports clubs in the summer to get a change from DS1's company. He has a classmate next door, but they're just not free for casual, spontaneous meeting.

This though being knocked for happend a few times for my DC both places we lived in.

As they get older though as teens - it can depend on what space is about as people aren't always welcoming to groups of teens or even one or two - somehow expecting the worst with no reason.

I think it really depends, my kids are young adults and had plenty of freedom, but I noticed others really over scheduled their children, stressing themselves out in the meantime! More women are in full time work than even 20 years ago but it varies a lot by area, very few did where I lived (I finished at 2.30 which was common)

When I was a kid we went out to play at 4pm after school. Now the kids all have two working parents and are in childcare till 6pm so there are no kids to play in the street. Same during the school holidays - no kids in the street because both parents work so the kids are in childcare.

I don't think the activities have caused this cultural shift, they are a product of it. My DD has activities to interact with peers after school (and it helps she develops different skills at them too). When I was her age I was out 'calling on' friends with no parental supervision. That doesn't happen anymore so I take her to activities to facilitate it. I don't think if activities all stopped (as they did during covid) that everyone would revert to letting kids play out more.

I think Madeleine McCann is the key trigger, rolling news, and the blaming of parents (women) for high profile cases has created a culture where people are scared of the monsters, but also scared to be blamed. I would be reasonably happy with my DD playing in the fields nearby with friends, but I can imagine the reactions of others so it's not something I feel I can do. Even on Mumsnet we have people wanting to phone social services because a 12 year old was left at home for 10 mins.

I don't think the activities have caused this cultural shift, they are a product of it. My DD has activities to interact with peers after school (and it helps she develops different skills at them too). When I was her age I was out 'calling on' friends with no parental supervision. That doesn't happen anymore so I take her to activities to facilitate it

That's true - I sent my DC to groups to get interaction and to less extent learnt new skills even when I was a SAHM and it was to some extent expected as all the kids are DC first primary did something extra.

I agree there's been a shift - but I think it was coming for a while and Madaline probaly just accelerated it. I do agree other parents affect or inhibite decsions - when DD1 first wanted to start going up into town with friends - they were all at secondary - it was other parents insisting they couldn't walk or use bus they had to be driven or stay in town just in case.