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Original poster

Comments at work from colleague re English people

58 replies

JFLEA · 03/01/2022 13:17

Name changed due to very personal information under my own username and I’ve spoken to a few real life friends about this (have been around since 2007 (icod/Littlelapin etc etc)

I work in a very multicultural environment and usually everyone runs along very well. There is one man who is bothering me quite a bit and I can’t put my finger on why.

I am a single mother (divorced). I also have another child from outside that marriage. He makes comments, which aren’t said in a nasty way but which are bothering me.

His comments are about my culture (white British), we don’t take marriage or family serious enough.
We give up too soon. In his culture marriage is for life and his children are raised the same way. We don’t look after our old people like they do, we don’t take family or respect for older people seriously. None of this is said in a nasty way; you can tell he genuinely believes this to be true.

My DD has a part time job whilst she is doing her A levels. This is something he commented on that in his culture this wouldn’t happen as children are supported so they can take their education seriously. I argued back with this and said well she’s learning responsibility and independence. This circled back to the “family supporting each other” argument.

I was having a discussion with my daughter on the phone about her tidying the house whilst I was at work. She didn’t want to do it as she had plans with her friends. Again he commented when I got off the phone that his kids and kids of his culture wouldn’t be so disrespectful to their parents.

I would like to tackle this as it’s bothering me but I don’t know the best way to go about it without basically saying well you’ve got your culture and we have ours (which has been my tactic for the last few months)

OP posts:

Dreamstate · 03/01/2022 13:49

So even if your not in a conversation with you, he feels he can comment on a phone call your having with your daughter. Wtf anyone else would be told to mind their own business.

I would go and complain to HR its highly inappropriate. If it was reversed you could be up for racism, harassment etc.

I've know a few like him think their way of life is so superior to anyone else's.

Harlequin1088 · 03/01/2022 13:53

Tell him to fuck off and keep his opinions about you and your life to himself. This isn’t about him comparing his culture to yours. This is about him looking down his nose at your but dressing it up as an interesting cultural comparison. Tell him to get in the bin then phone HR and report him for workplace harassment.

VeganCow · 03/01/2022 13:54

I'd shut him down. I would say there are positives to both cultures however the negatives in his outweigh the negatives in yours. Women and kids trapped in abusive homes for starters.

Asvan · 03/01/2022 13:55

@2Gen

Yes they do! It's quite common for Muslim men to "marry" more than one woman in an Islamic ritual, as they're allowed up to 4. In the West, some of them marry more than one woman according to Islam but do not Register the marriage with the State, and then they send the "wives" to live as single mothers and claim State benefits. I had a neighbour whom this had been done to. This man is being disingenuous!

Comments like this do not help at all. I am a born and bred Muslim and I know Muslims from different cultural backgrounds. In the UK, it's extremely rare for a Muslim man to have more then 1 wife. Off the top of my head, I only know of one family where this is the case. Islamic law states that if a man does marry more than 1 wife, he has to treat them all the same in terms of how much money he gives them and the time he spends with them etc- and as you can imagine in this day and age this is extremely difficult.

Coming back to the OP, as you say I dont think your colleague realises the affect his comments are having on you. You need to take him to one side and explain how his comments are making you feel. If he Carrie's on speak to your manager.

RB68 · 03/01/2022 13:56

This isn't about culture - this is personal to you and about you and being done in a paternalistic manner - wich is mysogeny. The constant comments and disapproval amount to harrassment and as he wouldn't do this to a man is effectively sex based harrassement if not sexual. It is not his place to comment so personally and with a levelof ignorance around the norms in the UK.

I would be thinking carefully how to word it but defintely a report it situation

OverTheRubicon · 03/01/2022 14:02

This is sexism as well as a lack of inclusivity. If you're senior to him or you're peers, I'd say it straight to him (you can email if you want a trail, either instead of speaking or after speaking to confirm what you discussed/agreed), or if he's senior, even if he's not your boss, then I'd speak with HR. It's really inappropriate.

DarkCorner · 03/01/2022 14:06

Definitely not on. I'd just say something straight forward and icily polite like "It's not appropriate to comment on aspects of my life in the workplace, please don't do it again". If it continues then go to HR. Something I've also used with my slightly inappropriate (at times) boss is to just totally ignore any comments he makes that are innappropriate, say absolutely nothing and carry on with work.

I think some men simply don't appreciate how much work and sacrifice women put in to make these cultural norms work. They must think it seems easy and don't understand why everyone can't live like that
This is such an interesting point. It'd be interesting to hear of any women making comments like his or are they less critical because they can see the benefit (even if it isn't in line with their personal beliefs) in a different cultural approach.

Boood · 03/01/2022 14:11

Don’t have personal conversations in front of him- move away from your desk so he can’t listen in. Then shut down any comments about your personal life straight away- just say, sorry, I’m not going to discuss that with you, it’s none of your business. If he keeps doing it, go to your manager and then to HR.

Walktwomoons · 03/01/2022 14:14

If he says it 'kindly' and you don't want to go in all guns blazing, I would tell him that his comments hurt you first. E.g. just saying "ouch" or "it makes me sad that you look down on me and my culture. I always try to respect you." From extensive personal experience, he will never change. I have had people like this approve of me and the best it will get you is "you're not like other English people". He is very, very stupid, too stupid to see people as more than a stereotype. Just like a racist English person. I've had identical conversations with both "sides". It might help to show him that you're human and you're hurt by him, since stereotypes are about dehumanising someone. He will probably respond with more "fake concern", but I would be vulnerable a couple of times before you get angry. Also, I expect you already know, but "close" patriarchal families and relationships are often unhappy. You are good enough and the way you are living your life is good enough. Don't let people bring you down xxx

Ahoyashipg · 03/01/2022 14:16

@MoreAloneTime

Exactly. It used to be the 'norm' in this country as well. Who is doing the daily grind of looking after elderly relatives and children/teens? Who is cooking the food and wiping the bottoms of elderly relatives that are being looked after by the "family"? Women.

Men can sit back and pontificate on the benefits of this system which relies on their wives and sisters sacrificing their time and lives to keep it running. It benefits men, not women.

Muckymaisonette · 03/01/2022 14:16

Oh he’s having a dig at you while dressing it up as “cultural differences”.

I find not telling judgemental people stuff about your life circumstances may mean they move onto criticism of someone else, also best not to reply by saying “what about justice for female rape victims in Pakistan then” as he will run to HR, waving the racism card.

In the words of Ronan Keating’s song, which was mentioned recently on another thread “you say it best when you say nothing at all”

Brainwave89 · 03/01/2022 14:24

OP, have a discussion with him first and be clear this is not appropriate. In a workplace he keeps his views private, and it is inappropriate to provide such judgements. If it does not stop then speak to HR.

BananaBlue · 03/01/2022 14:28

I wouldn’t get into a tit for tat, but I would aim to shut it down.

Next time he makes a comment I would send an email to this effect.

Dear x,

Earlier you stated that ‘unlike in my culture, your culture does/nt x,y,z’.

You have made similar unwarranted comments in the past on my private life, which make me feel quite uncomfortable.

Can I ask that you refrain from making such comments to me in future, so that we can maintain a professional inclusive working relationship.

Kind regards

And I’d cc my manager and/or HR.

godmum56 · 03/01/2022 14:37

If you haven't already said it to him, then I'd be saying publicly that you find his comments TO YOU inapproprIate and for the future that you expect him to confine his conversation TO YOU to work matters. For the future, if you have to ask him again, you will be taking it formally to HR. You may also like to put this in writing and to inform HR of what is going on....plant the flag so to speak. Its much harder to control what he says to others in your presence. The other thing with having a chat to HR now is that they may have other advice.

IntermittentParps · 03/01/2022 14:55

Tell him to stop making comments about your personal life.
I agree. Then if he continues, log them (with times and other people who are present, if possible) and punt it to HR.

But maybe don't hold personal phone calls at work.

powershowerforanhour · 03/01/2022 14:56

I think it's time to saddle up your high horse and say stonily "Well in my culture it's considered shockingly rude to make unsolicited negative comments on somebody else's personal life". And tell HR.

TerraNovaTwo · 03/01/2022 15:03

I wouldn't engage. Change the subject or respond with a hmm. He might get the message. Or just tell him outright as PPs have advised. Report to HR if he persists.

He actually sounds quite narrow minded. He's also speaking from the perspective of a man, women in his culture very likely see things a lot differently.

I too originally come from that sort of culture. And I'm divorced from a Brit (living in UK). Across cultures, not all men are abusive but so many are, some cultures more so. While the UK is still very patriarchal, women have greater freedoms than many other countries - to an extent though.

godmum56 · 03/01/2022 15:13

@powershowerforanhour

i'd be REALLY careful about doing this....its not unknown for the race card to be played.

Elodeastar · 03/01/2022 15:18

Speak to HR - your personal life is none of his business and him thinking he has a right to pass comment isn't on. They need to know that he is stepping over boundaries and making you feel uncomfortable. He sounds awful tbh!

JuergenSchwarzwald · 03/01/2022 15:21

Women in his culture don’t raise children on their own as marriage is for life/they don’t have kids outside of marriage

what happens if the father dies?

JuergenSchwarzwald · 03/01/2022 15:24

i'd be REALLY careful about doing this....its not unknown for the race card to be played

not sure how you could play the "race card" if someone tells you you are being rude. And why is sexism ok and racism isn't? But if you don't want to open up something like that just say

I consider it shockingly rude to make unsolicited negative comments on somebody else's personal life and I would like you to stop. If you don't, I will report your comments to HR if he tries to minimise, tell him to shut up or you will report him now as you no longer intend to put up with his overbearing and sexist remarks.

lucillelarusso · 03/01/2022 15:25

I had this with a man at work. I laughed in his face and said "I'd like to hear your wifes opinion" then repeated various versions of this when he commented eg "I bet your wife thinks differently", "well that's easy to say when you have a wife at home cleaning and doing all the childcare, but I bet she resents it", "I wouldn't want my daughter to grow up passively accepting she should do what a man says, it's 2021, not 1832 you silly man". He shut up quite quickly. Laugh at him, these sorts of men hate it and shut up pronto.

girlmom21 · 03/01/2022 15:28

@lucillelarusso

This is a great response!

NearlyAHoarder · 03/01/2022 15:30

He sounds horrible. I'm a single parent with two teenagers, work ft and some of the comments I've had over the years, not a barrage, but here and there, they've left me boggle-eyed.

Let him have his little say and then say ''so happy my children have a good role model''.

It's easy to say ''just say this or just say that''. I know it's infuriating when it's real life and when it's relentless.

He's a leveller though. He's seething that despite the fact that you're doing everything on your own and you're still doing the same job as him, even though all of his needs are spoonfed at home.

He knows that you get more done and do it on your own so he's taking you down a peg.

I'd deliberate misunderstand him. Say ''thank you yes, I am doing what takes two in your household all on my own, and still doing the same job, thank you yes!''

HoliHormonalTigerlilly · 03/01/2022 15:30

She and I were listening to the radio one day (think it was Woman's Hour) and a reporter said there is domestic violence in over 40% of households in Istanbul (where he was from.) She dumped him immediately.

Wtf?!

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