High Child Benefit Charge - How to fill out the self assessment?!

[WinterWeather1]

I'm hoping you lot will be able to help me as I have already managed to stump 2 accountants today with this.
My husband needs to do a self assessment for the child benefit that we claim. From reading several forum posts and Martin Lewis, I am of the understanding that pension contributions (DH is defined benefit pension) can be deducted from the gross salary to get the adjusted salary.
This would make a significant difference to how much we need to pay back.
The issue I am having is how I put this information on the self assessment form. I put in the full gross salary as it appears on his P60 on the employment page but the only place I can see to put the pension is for claiming back tax relief on it. This then causes the system to think it owes us nearly £900 which is incorrect as I am pretty sure DH already gets tax relief on his pension.
Can anyone give me a dummies guide on how to fill out the form so that we pay the correct amount?
The childcare tax calculator makes it seem so easy but the form is so confusing!

Isn’t his P60 income net of pension contributions?

Nope. His salary is 58k, P60 says £57k and doesn't mention pension anywhere. Pension contributions are £4031 net.

He’ll only get basic rate relief on pension unless it’s a pre-tax pension - it depends on how it’s been set up - so he could get further relief. Does it say on his payslips if it’s pre-tax or post-tax?

Sorry, can’t help with the child benefit bit - I thought there was just a question somewhere (along the lines of ‘do you get child benefit? If yes, how much?’).

I don’t claim child benefit for this very reason! The amount of admin for no cash benefit doesn’t seem worth it! Hope you get it sorted.

HMRC are really helpful if you can get through to to them.

Are you sure he is getting 40% tax relief on his pension contributions?

I've done it last 4 years and as far as I know it's just the top line less tax and national insurance. The HMRC website actually provides the correct figure sometimes

I have no idea re the pension. We have emailed payroll but no doubt won't hear anything back until the new year and I am trying to get it done for the end of Dec deadline to get the payments taken out via PAYE.
I spent an hour on the phone with a friend who is an accountant and at first she said he could claim the tax relief but once I submitted the tax return where it said we were due a refund, she realised it was a defined benefit pension and so she thinks it is already getting tax relief.
The pension is shown on the payslip in the deductions column. NIC are showing as the correct amount for gross salary but tax is a little low so that is why she thinks tax relief might already be happening.
Naively, I thought it would be easy so left it until I had finished work for Christmas along with everyone else! 🤦🏼‍♀️

I would live chat or call HMRC. Alternatively can you call the pension company? Likely to be quicker then Payroll. www.gov.uk/government/organisations/hm-revenue-customs/contact/income-tax-enquiries-for-individuals-pensioners-and-employees

8-8 Monday to Saturdays

You don’t put in the workplace pension in the tax return. Only the income and tax from the P60. You get no further relief for a workplace pension as you are already getting it at source.
If he contributes to a personal pension plan, he can get further relief for the child benefit charge purpose.

@Netry this is what we do and it's always gone through fine

Look at his payslips and check if the pension is deducted from his pay before or after tax.

You put in the workplace pension?

@Netry we do exactly as you've explained to the OP

Ah thanks!
That’s how it works

@Netry I know I can't get any more tax relief on it but is that the same as what Martin Lewis is saying?

"ALL types of pension can help to reduce your 'adjusted net income', and therefore the amount you'd be liable to pay. This includes self-invested personal pensions, any additional voluntary contributions as well as any other contributions to workplace or personal pensions (and it doesn't matter if you were auto-enrolled or not). It does NOT include Lifetime ISAs, however, as they're not strictly pensions.

How you calculate how much pension contribution to take away depends on whether it's going from your before-tax or after-tax pay: 

• Employer pension scheme: If it goes straight from your before-tax ('gross') pay into a pension, eg, an employer pension scheme, you can deduct that same gross amount. "

@Netry

You don’t put in the workplace pension in the tax return. Only the income and tax from the P60. You get no further relief for a workplace pension as you are already getting it at source. If he contributes to a personal pension plan, he can get further relief for the child benefit charge purpose.

This

If his pension is deducted by his employer then it's already accounted for

You would only put additional pension payments made separately on the self assessment.....depending on how close you are to the cap sometimes making a small additional contribution is enough to get you under the threshold and thus retain the CB

Yes it’s all types. All types where relief hasn’t been given. For his workplace pension, he’s already getting relief at source so he won’t get the relief twice. That’s why you don’t put it on the tax return. That’s the correct treatment, you can do this and get it filed on time. Otherwise, file it now on time however you think you wish to do it and then amend it in January so you will still make the 31 Dec deadline for the deduction via your code

Any gift aid? You can put those in

We've just had this exact issue. What I've done and I really hope it is right is declared my husbands pension on the self return. He gets tax relief at source, his pension comes out after tax and NI but 20% tax relief is added to his pension pot. By declaring on self assessment I believe you can get the higher rate tax relief taken into account. This is what I read on standard life and also MSE.

Interestingly, before we did this we owed Hmrc about 500 and then after declaring the pension they owed us 250. Seemed a bit more of a difference than I was expecting 🤔

You're not trying to claim tax relief on his pension though (as others have said you're getting that at source) - you're just reducing his salary for CB purposes - that's a separate thing.

We were advised to put as the P60 salary what was on the P60 minus pension conts made that year.

@titchy I think that is where I am getting confused.
What I am trying to do is figure out the adjusted net income and hopefully reduce how much we need to pay back.
Martin Lewis gives an example of: Peter earns £52,000 a year, but 7% of his pre-tax income (£3,640) is used to make pension contributions. To see if Peter needs to pay the tax charge, we need to deduct £3,640 from his actual salary – leaving £48,360. In this case, Peter's pension contributions take him below the threshold, so he won't need to pay the tax charge.

So in my head, I am thinking the P60 salary total of £57k minus the £4301 pension gives is an adjusted net income of around £52k which means we pay back less of the CB.

Have I completely missed the point here and just being really thick?!

[quote WinterWeather1]@titchy I think that is where I am getting confused.
What I am trying to do is figure out the adjusted net income and hopefully reduce how much we need to pay back.
Martin Lewis gives an example of: Peter earns £52,000 a year, but 7% of his pre-tax income (£3,640) is used to make pension contributions. To see if Peter needs to pay the tax charge, we need to deduct £3,640 from his actual salary – leaving £48,360. In this case, Peter's pension contributions take him below the threshold, so he won't need to pay the tax charge.

So in my head, I am thinking the P60 salary total of £57k minus the £4301 pension gives is an adjusted net income of around £52k which means we pay back less of the CB.

Have I completely missed the point here and just being really thick?! [/quote]
That's exactly what we (well dh ) did and it was fine.

@titchy did you just input that into the salary section and that's it?

[quote WinterWeather1]@titchy did you just input that into the salary section and that's it? [/quote]
I think so yes. Though was a few years ago...

What does your husband think his salary is? eg 60k

What is the taxable pay on the P60, say 54k.

If that is the case then there is no further deduction or tax relief due.

Alternatively does each payslip show a total salary and then a taxable salary.