How to word a difficult work email/WWYD

[4pmwinetimebebeh]

I currently work at a college teaching practical skills. I’ve been there 4 years and generally enjoy my job. In the past 6 months I’ve taken on a lot of additional responsibilities and roles, offered to me as ‘career progression’ and ‘role development’ with a view to progressing to the next pay grade/promotion. My manager has been very clear about my career path and I’ve done a good job (by all accounts) with the additional tasks.

After 6 months of this carrot I had an interview for the promotion yesterday and the phone call today. I didn’t get it. Someone external has. I don’t want to be petty but I am absolutely gutted and I feed a fool. The job description of the job I didn’t get is what I’m doing now. I was told I’m a highly respected and valued employee and assured they are going to apply to regrade my role to the higher one anyway within a couple of months. If that’s the case why didn’t I get the job? And also why have I waited 6 months for this job to come up when they could have regraded it!

I don’t want to sound petty and it’s an interview, of course it should go to the best candidate. But I’ve been assured that this was coming, the whole department expected me to get it and the interview went really well.

I feel so embarrassed and also taken advantage of. I want to email and basically say I’m disappointed and don’t want to continue to work at a higher level than I’m being paid for long term.

I was the person that got the job when an established member of the team was expected to get it. People were horrible to me for a long time which just wasn't fair! I'd just seen the post advertised and applied for it. She probably could do the job better because she was there and already doing it, but I would have learned the job much quicker if people weren't so obstructive.
We are both still there 5 years later, she got the role she wanted and I changed roles after about a year. Bet nobody else actually remembers how shit it was!

I’ve been there too - it’s utterly shit. Being told someone is “better than you” on the basis of a 30 minute interview when they know nothing about the job and you’re literally already doing it, it defies logic. (I understand recruitment etc but there is a unique pain about being told this, even been told “we know you’d do it better but they answered question 3 better”, makes recruitment processes seem absurd).

I’m sorry this has happened to you. What I did was calmly get feedback and then (a few days later) say that having gained that experience I would only be continuing working at a higher level if they could top up my pay on a temporary basis to be equal to the new person. Try asking for that. If they can’t or won’t do this then explain that you will be unable to continue carrying out those tasks. They can’t exactly make you and if you handle it tactfully they’ll be forced to accept this or basically ask why you won’t work for free.

I'd view this differently. Your work gave you some extra tasks, you did well at them and they want to upgrade you in line with the work. They realised how big a job it is and they need 2 people to cover what you have been doing. This is a win! You will have someone to work with who has complementary skills, you know the job and they are a star performer (at interview, let's hope that translates to the job) - you can learn from each other. Be positive.

I would email along the lines of "thanks for supporting the regrade, could you give me an anticipated timeline and let me know of anything that might impact on that? Can we discus how to transition in the new hire and how that will mesh with what I've been doing?" You're saying the same thing as your original sentiment but in a positive way. If they don't stick to the timeline you can refer back to whatever they say to raise a query and then decide if you want to stay or look for the hirer grade role elsewhere. If you like the job I'd stay where you are for now and see how things pan out.

That’s horrible @wonderpants but no one is suggesting that’ll happen here.

@Gearedtoyou

Don't send that email. I understand you want to. Write it if it will help, but don't send it.

Ask for a meeting and have a conversation about how disappointed you are and what your future in the organisation might be, but don't do it by email.

Yes def. Carefully crafted emails are what people do when they don't think they have any real power.

Schedule a meeting and say you're confused about your future with the college. Ask for a job description and where they see you progressing in the next six months.

Don't say how disappointed you are, the key word is confused. Then let them answer and just listen noncommittally.

FFS higher grade. There should be a 5 min edit option!

Only a deluded idiot takes someone on the basis of ONE interview over their knowledge of someone they’d work with for years.
I would ask for extremely detailed feedback, not the vague stuff. If it was “one question” I would be seriously talking to my union ( if I have one) and looking for a new job.
You have an absolute right to be mad here, be mad, make some fuss. This is not really acceptable.

I agree with those saying the reason you didn't get the role is most likely because the other candidate scored more highly at interview. I've had the situation where the role has been earmarked for someone and you still have to go through the charade of advertising and hoping nobody else answers the questions better.
So don't send any email this weekend. Next week I'd ask to talk to your manager not email them. Express your disappointment at not getting the role, and ask her the question about what should be your next steps. Try not to let your resentment at having done the role for free seep in - it's so important not to burn bridges.

I had a situation earlier in the year where I thought I did a fantastic interview for a sideways role, but then wasn't offered it. I was gutted, but put my big girl pants on and asked for feedback. Turned out I was second choice. From asking for the feedback and continuing to express interest I was offered a seconded role without interview and have recently been made permanent- again without interview.

It's a somewhat different scenario but I guess I'm trying to say, don't close down any contacts through your disappointment, I don't think anyone deliberately set it up to use you then hire someone else. Your manager will be feeling guilty I suspect, you have some leverage if you keep them onside.

@Mybalconyiscracking , our interview process - in common with most workplaces- is clearly documented. It sounds like it has been followed, involving the unions would achieve nothing in this scenario.

Had something similar. Worked up, applied for regrade, granted but minimal pay uplift. Relationship with manager never recovered and I’m about to resign. Employers can be so short sighted. They’ve upset a valued employee with a proven track record, who’s already been doing the role perfectly well, and for what? Manager here now backtracking big time, begging me to stay, but no. Enough’s enough. There are other things I can do and I’m not prepared to be treated like this.

Honestly, OP? If you can’t leave, get signed off sick with stress when the new person starts. Easy enough to do, the time will allow you to find something else and they’ll soon realize how valuable you are. Value yourself. You’re worth so much more!

I agree employers can be very shortsighted and take existing employees for granted and take on someone with perhaps one skill the existing staff don’t have - while overlooking the key skills the current staff DO have. I’ve seen it happen many times where a shiny new staff member starts and everyone else has to compensate for them - and I mean in the long term not during training. It’s really the fault of the employer for not designing their recruitment processes well, resulting in hires who can’t do a key thing (eg talk on the phone, use a spreadsheet).

Not saying that’s happened with OP.

I agree with a PP who suggests getting the feedback and finding whether you were a close second.

But also if you do want to progress I’d look for other jobs. If someone else wants you your current employer will have to up their game.

I would refuse to do the extra responsibilities if they’re not increasing my wage. If asked, I would not train up this new person. Fair enough you didn’t get the higher paying role (duties which are similar to your current ones), but I would revert back to only doing the duties listed in my current job role.

I don't get this whole you can only go on the interview thing. Obviously you would also use your in house knowledge in the assessment.

If I had a good in house candidate I would promote them and back fill the lower role.

Sorry its shit OP

@topcat2014

I don't get this whole you can only go on the interview thing. Obviously you would also use your in house knowledge in the assessment.

If I had a good in house candidate I would promote them and back fill the lower role.

Sorry its shit OP

You have to be able to show that the recruitment process was fair if there's any challenge on discrimination grounds. The result of the interview is the easiest way to do that and what most large organisations will use.

I think it would be reasonable to calmly ask whether you’ll be paid lower than the new hire for doing the same job, and if not what the differences would be.

Also, if you’re female, is the new candidate male or female?

Lastly - could you move elsewhere? I’d say that some workplaces get an idea of you at a certain level and find it hard to let you break out of that box. You might find you can reset that perception elsewhere.

I think if you want truthful feedback speak to the hiring manager or HR , whatever the process is in your company.

If you email, you’ll get a carefully crafted response designed so that the contents can’t be ‘used against’ the company.

You should expect to train the new hire but only in the ‘ways of working’ at your place. They should be coming in with the required skills as discovered at interview ? but would need to know the internal process which are unique to your place of work.

I also think you should put the above question in email. You can be polite and thank them for the opportunity to interview (I know 😩) blah blah. But answering a written enquiry can… sharpen the mind a little.

@Mybalconyiscracking

Only a deluded idiot takes someone on the basis of ONE interview over their knowledge of someone they’d work with for years. I would ask for extremely detailed feedback, not the vague stuff. If it was “one question” I would be seriously talking to my union ( if I have one) and looking for a new job. You have an absolute right to be mad here, be mad, make some fuss. This is not really acceptable.

This is terrible advice. Nobody is "owed" a promotion because of long service. If the external candidate was outstanding - they may have more managerial experience, can demonstrate that they've brought about significant improvements elsewhere - then of course they should be hired. A company would be foolish to just keep hiring internally. You want the cream of the crop. If that's the internal person, great! If not, great! We need new blood in organisations, it's healthy,

Ask for a meeting and see if they’ll commit to a date for your role regrade and agree to backpay you for the last 6 months. If they won’t do either, I’d start looking for another job.

Aren't we moulded to put up with a lot of shit? You are the second woman this week, the exact situation. Taking on extra work to the point of almost doing two full-time jobs. No remuneration, it was implied the job was theirs and then they didn't get the job. When I worked in corporations I saw this happen all the time to women. They would get seconded, do a ton of work for no money and then not get the jobs.

What is shocking for you is that you have been doing the job and yet they base their decision on a question in the interview. You already proved you can do the job but the other person answered a question better? That seems strange.

I'm not sure men would put up with this shit. I think you need to ask for feedback but also stick to your guns. Ask why your current job is not being regraded now and why do you have to wait? Definitely stop immediately doing the other work make it very clear that it will not be suitable for you to do the new employees training.

I would be incredibly professional but use them. What training do you want to do, what will they pay for? Use their budget and advance your qualifications and always keep your eye open for better jobs. It is becoming a seller's market so don't be loyal. It is your life, your career, be selfish about it.

À version of this has happened to me. I just copy the person responsible into every request for help and say I am no longer available to help but said person can.

I was the person who got the job ahead of an internal candidate "everyone" thought would get it.

The way she's behaved since has just shown everyone it was the right decision and it's highly unlikely she'll even be interviewed when I move on.

She was right to be disappointed, it sounds like the company behaved badly in the way they managed her expectations but it won't change after its happened so all you can do is continue to behave professionally, take note of any feedback and/ or leave.

Actually this has happened to me twice. The other time a man who'd been doing the job didn't get it and I did. He was lovely, really supported me settling into the role and shared a pot of internal knowledge I'd have struggled without.

A few months later when another (better) opportunity came up for him I helped him with his application and coached him for the interview. We're still good friends 20 years on although we don't work for the same company anymore.