Horrific nursery rhythms

[CrimeJunkie01]

Inspired by the sleeping bunnies thread, I'm wondering if anyone has been reminded of hideous nursery rhythms?

My favourite as a child was:

"In a cottage in a wood,
A little old man, at the window stood.
Saw a rabbit running by, knocking at the door.
Help me, help me, help me, he said.
All those guns will shoot me dead.
Come little rabbit come to me.
Happy we shall be."

All this is done with actions to go along with it, including shooting at a rabbit!!

Another is
" Rock a bye baby on the tree top,
When the wind blows the cradle will rock,
When the bough breaks the cradle will fall,
And down will come baby, cradle and all."

Goodness me, that's without finally learning exactly which market the piggy went to!!

Why are nursery rhythms so dark? 😂

My sister taught me when I was about 5:

Cowboy Billy
had a 10 foot Willy.
He showed it to the girl next door.
She thought it was a snake
And hit it with a rake
And now it's only four foot four.

I don't think it was technically a nursery rhyme though. I certainly knew and loved all the gruesome ones.

Pop goes the weasel is about poor kids pawning their Sunday clothes Mon-Fri for food and buying them back on Saturday.

It's urban myth that ring a ring of roses is plague

I though that had come full circle and it was now again thought that it was about the plague?

There's one in French (Il était un petit navire) about sailors on a sea voyage who turn to cannibalism when their food runs out, and the cabin boy draws the short straw:

====

There was a little ship,
There was a little ship
That had never sailed
That had never sailed.
Ahoy! Ahoy!

(Chorus)
Ahoy, ahoy, ahoy matey,
Matey sails the sea.
Ahoy, ahoy, ahoy matey,
Matey sails the sea.

It undertook a long voyage,
On the Mediterranean Sea.
...
After five or six weeks
The food ran out,
...
They drew straws
To find out who would be eaten,
...
The short straw went to the youngest one,
Although he wasn't very fat.
...
They tried to figure out with which sauce
The poor child should be cooked,
...
One wanted him fried,
The other wanted him fricasseed,
...
While they were deliberating,
He climbed to the topsail,
...
He prayed to the heavens
Pleading with the vastness
...
O Holy Virgin, O, My Lady,
Keep them from eating me,
...
At that moment, a great miracle
Was performed for the child
...
Soon, little fish jumped
Into the ship by the thousands
...
They were gathered, they were fried
And the ship's young boy was saved.

=====

A happy ending, but still grim!

…… couldn’t get up in the morning ….
He went to toilet and pulled the chain
And out came a
Choo choo train 🚂

@Cooroo

My sister taught me when I was about 5:

Cowboy Billy
had a 10 foot Willy.
He showed it to the girl next door.
She thought it was a snake
And hit it with a rake
And now it's only four foot four.

I don't think it was technically a nursery rhyme though. I certainly knew and loved all the gruesome ones.

You have sparked a memory! Only difference here is that it was 'Old King Billy' which makes complete sense when you consider that I live in Glasgow with it's sectarian history reaching back to King Billy ie William of Orange. There was a notorious gang member named King Billy of the razor gangs in the 1930s, so I reckon the cutting off of his willie is in response to him cutting faces. He was also rumoured to be a womaniser.

(Anyone interested read the wonderful Edwin Morgan poem 'King Billy').

Little Bunny in the wood was my favourite. . Along with another one about rabbits and bopping them on the head.

Ladybird ladybird fly away home otoh used to make me cry

The 10 foot Willy version we said was "my friend billy" and it was only 2ft4 at the end.

Little rabbit foo foo. That was it.

Is this one about Henry viii and Katherine of Aragon?

"I had a little nut tree, nothing would it bear
But a silver nutmeg and a golden pear
The king of Spain's daughter came to visit me
And all for the sake of my little nut tree"

I can hardly believe it now but we were taught this one in primary school! The tune is similar to Baa Baa Black Sheep but is more ornamented

I thought Mary Mary quite contrary was about Mary Anning the amateur paleontologist?

TBH I think parents nowadays over think too much!! Nursery Rhymes are just that…unless they are racist I genuinely wouldn’t worry about it !

I remember seeing this rhyme in a children's ladybird book with this unpleasant picture
"I do not like thee, Doctor Fell,

The reason why I cannot tell;

But this I know, and know full well,

I do not like thee, Doctor Fell.

I’m convinced that nursery rhymes were all made up by creepy uncles who resented babysitting and were playing ‘let’s scare the kid’

This scared me when I was little. It seemed like a conspiracy.

Who killed Cock Robin?
I, said the Sparrow,
with my bow and arrow,
I killed Cock Robin.

Who saw him die?
I, said the Fly,
with my little eye,
I saw him die.

Who caught his blood?
I, said the Fish,
with my little dish,
I caught his blood.

Who’ll make the shroud?
I, said the Beetle,
with my thread and needle,
I’ll make the shroud.

Who’ll dig his grave?
I, said the Owl,
with my little trowel,
I’ll dig his grave.

Who’ll be the parson?
I, said the Rook,
with my little book,
I’ll be the parson.

Who’ll be the clerk?
I, said the Lark,
if it’s not in the dark,
I’ll be the clerk.

Who’ll carry the link?
I, said the Linnet,
I’ll fetch it in a minute,
I’ll carry the link.

Who’ll be chief mourner?
I, said the Dove,
I mourn for my love,
I’ll be chief mourner.

Who’ll carry the coffin?
I, said the Kite,
if it’s not through the night,
I’ll carry the coffin.

Who’ll bear the pall?
We, said the Wren,
both the cock and the hen,
We’ll bear the pall.

Who’ll sing a psalm?
I, said the Thrush,
as she sat on a bush,
I’ll sing a psalm.

Who’ll toll the bell?
I said the Bull,
because I can pull,
I’ll toll the bell.

All the birds of the air
fell a-sighing and a-sobbing,
when they heard the bell toll
for poor Cock Robin.

My first language is French and French nursery rhythms are infamous for being horrific!

A green mouse :

A green mouse
Who ran in the grass
I catch her by the tail
I show it to these gentlemen
These gentlemen tell me:
"Dip it in oil
Dip it in water
It will make a snail...
All hot!"

And my fav «Good Tobacco»

‘’I have good tobacco in my snuff box,
I have good tobacco and you will get none.

I have some that's fine, and some well-shredded,
But they are not for your ugly nose.’’

I remember this one having actions that you did together as a group, can't remember what they were though - involved holding hands and mimicking the rocking of the ship I think. And then the sinking.

The big ship sails on the ally ally oh,
The alley ally oh,
The alley ally oh.
The big ship sails on the ally ally oh,
On the last day of September.

The captain said, 'It will never, never do,
Never, never do,
Never, never do.'
The captain said, 'It will never, never do,'
On the last day of September.

The big ship sank to the bottom of the sea,
The bottom of the sea,
The bottom of the sea.
The big ship sank to the bottom of the sea,
On the last day of September

Some people claim its about the Titanic but this theory is widely agreed to be incorrect.

@my8thMNusername

Horrified to find my 3yo watching this nursery rhyme on her Amazon fire - there was an old lady who swallowed a fly ends like this:

She swallowed the spider to catch the fly;
I don’t know why she swallowed a fly – Perhaps she’s dead
There was an old lady who swallowed a horse;
…She’s dead, of course!

My 4 year old shouts 'I hope you die' instead of 'perhaps she'll die' 🤣😂

It has to be 1 of my favourite songs 😂

Not a nursery rhyme, but I remember a fairy tale called the juniper tree. The stepmother murders her stepson by tricking him into teaching into a chest for an apple and slamming the lid down so he's beheaded. Then she replaces his head and ties it on with a scarf and tricks her own daughter (his half sister) into boxing his ears so his head falls off and the daughter blames herself. Then she cooks him and feeds him to the father of the children. I think the boys spirit turns into a bird and avenges himself by dropping a millstone around her neck from above. It's not normal for adults, let alone children, to find this entertaining. I'm not sure there is a even a moral to the story. Just pure gore really.

The history and meaning of nursery rhymes was researched in great depth by a couple called Peter and Iona Opie after WW2, for several decades. Opie, also playground games and toys, but nursery rhymes were their main thing. There is a huge body of research and several books including “The Oxford Dictionary of Nursery Rhymes”. Suffice to say, not many nursery rhymes started as little ditties to amuse children.

My children loved nursery rhymes and fairy tales . The more gory the better . They haven’t grown up emotionally scarred . I think parents look too deeply into this nowadays.

’Rock a bye baby on the tree top,
When the wind blows the cradle will rock,
When the bough breaks the cradle will fall,
And down will come baby, cradle and all.’

I wasn’t bothered by most of the more gruesome nursery rhymes but I never liked singing this to my PFB in case it gave him nightmares(!). I changed the words a bit if I ever sung it to him:

‘Rock a bye baby on the tree top,
When the wind blows the cradle will rock,
When the bough breaks the cradle won’t fall,
Mummy will catch you, cradle and all.’

He was only a few months old! 😂😂😂 I can laugh at myself now.

There's some significance to the left leg (as opposed to the right) but I can't remember what it is.

I assumed this was about catholics and protestants since some people used to call catholics left footers. I just looked this up and I think the term is too recent for the rhyme though.

There was an old woman who lived in a shoe
She had so many children
She didn't know what to do
She gave them some broth without any bread
Then whipped them all soundly
And put them to bed

I'm not sure if this is an urban myth but isn't the hokey cokey mocking RC mass?

@TaraR2020
We sang the Alleyalleyooo song as children, but only the first two verses. There was a sort of walking dance thing that went with it where the children made a chain by holding hands and threaded under a "bridge" until ending up in a circle with hands crossed as in Auld Lang Sin.
I have been told by several people that it is about the Manchester Ship Canal.