This is why A&E is overwhelmed

[PackedintheUK]

And it's nothing to do with over anxious patients seeking "unnecessary" medical care.

I have a very sore very swollen ankle as a result of an insect bite. I've asked advice at the pharmacy and been told it looks nasty, see your GP, you probably need antibiotics.

So I've tried. I've been calling GP surgery all morning and finally got through to have receptionist incredulously say "you want to see a doctor for a gnat bite?" and then be told the next appointment is 16 Nov.

Me: but pharmacist said I need seeing urgently.
Receptionist: All the emergency appointments are gone for today. You'll have to call back tomorrow.
Me: but I've been calling all morning, won't the same thing happen tomorrow?
Receptionist: Well I can't do anything about that, if you're that worried go to A&E

So,I'm not sure that I am "that" worried, but I have been told by someone better qualified than me that I should be seen. We lost a colleague to sepis this year, a fit young woman and it happened incredibly quickly, plus I have a friend currently in hospital on intravenous antibiotics from a very similar looking bite he got at the same park.

I also don't actually feel that well.My body aches and feels heavy and I'm a bit queasy, which could be coincidence or my imagination.

Probably/hopefully it is nothing that won't heal itself in a few days but it feels irresponsible not to take the advice I've been given. Also to go to A&E

So A&E for something that could (probably) have been dealt with in a matter of seconds in a GP (telephone/video?) appointment?

There's no walk in or minor injuries here.

I'm baffled that people seem to think GP appointments should be a bottomless pit. What if all the slots are full? What happens then? Do you expect doctors and nurses to just stay at work until everyone is seen? Because they could be there all night!
If you want to book a flight and all the seats are taken, do you insist they fit you in anyway?

I think you are missing the point: people are being blamed for going to A and E for issues that could be dealt with by GP. Op and others are explaining why, in their experience, they may be forced to.

Trouble is...it's not one more phonecall...it's 30 some days. That's another 5 hours work!

It's not safe but there is no easy answer to the problem.

Wasn't it once the case that GP surgeries would be charged if their patients ended up in A&E???
Or am I making that up?

With regard to booking an online appointment, I’ve tried that, only be be told you need to see your GP and ring for an appointment. Complete waste of my time.

@Bagamoyo1 no, the process just needs to be followed correctly p. Every request for GP appointment within hours needs to be triaged. Out of hours the triage happens at the out of hours place.

[quote Moonopoly]@Sirzy but not all of these will be genuinely medically urgent.[/quote]
No they are not but the patient says it is to the receptionist so we have to deal with it. Once we have started the call you may as well finish it as it's easier than trying to shift it to another day when there are still not enough appointments.
It is horrendous just now. I've been in tears with the workload and I do understand the patient's frustrations.

[quote julieca]@Staffy1 There would be more GPs available if everything was privatised for those who can pay.
I used to use a surgery that offered care to homeless people across the city. They used a lot of appointments and GP and nurse time. Privatise the service and overnight those patients disappear.
But lots more would go to A and E. Attendance at A and E would soar.
Poverty is going through the roof in this country. There are a limited number of people who can pay £50 a time for GP appointments.[/quote]
Yes, it’s not ideal, but I just meant the problem is not a shortage of GPs as such, but the number of NHS depends on how many jobs are being made available by the NHS and how many they are willing to pay for. The service is not adequate for the number of people.

Bagamoyo no one is saying GPS and nurses should work into the night. However, it is extremely hard post Covid to get a GP appointment at all. It is not acceptable to wait days or even weeks to see a GP whatever you may think.

NHS GPs

@Rassy

I haven't RTWT but I thought pharmacists can prescribe antibiotics for insect bites?

Only if they are qualified as a PIP - Pharmacist Independent Prescriber (currently about 18% of all UK pharmacists) or the patient is under a patient group direction (PGD) which allows medicines to be supplied to a patient with a diagnosed clinical condition that requires repeated treatment such a urinary tract infection.

There are not enough GPs

This government has not done anything about increasing course numbers to increase those qualified

The U.K. has become hostile to immigration, so not a welcome place for many

And this is the result

It’s not your receptionist fault, or the gp surgery

Please stop with the people don’t want to pay higher taxes bollox. Our taxation rate is quite high enough thanks.

@Spicychickentenders

I understand your frustration, but I don't understand what you expect be done, if all the appointments are gone for today? The GP surely does not operate an unlimited service? If the appointments are gone, the they are gone.

Some GPs have chosen to strictly implement a book on the day service, as otherwise the appointments are booked months in advance.

I just wonder what you think should happen, if there are no more available appointments. Surely you understand that they will run out at some point during the day?

But it's the fact that you can't get in the queue for tomorrow either. It drives me mad that GP's seem so unaccountable for this. The structure is completely wrong.

I’d be happy for income tax to increase by 2% over £60k

Out of curiosity op did you ask if there was a nurse appointment?

I’ve seen the practice nurse about this type of stuff and they could perscribe

@HalzTangz

I don't know why people aren't signing up for online services for their doctor's surgery. You can book an appointment online without trying to ring all day.

You can't use online for under 16s.

I've only read your posts, not the whole thread, so appologies if I'm cross posting.

I'm sorry to hear you're struggling. We keep inadine in the house to put on wounds like this as soon as they start to look even slightly infected. It's really good. It's just a piece of fabric with iodine in it and it sorts out infections really fast. All you do is cut a little bit off, put it on the wound and stick a plaster over it. You need to change it regularly.

This is the stuff:

www.acelity.com/healthcare-professionals/global-product-catalog/catalog/inadine-dressing

I think you should probably change surgery. They sound totally overhwelmed. Or you could ask to join the patient participation group and try to bring about change.

I think given your symptoms now, you probably want to be seen soon and I would go to A&E in your situation, but it shouldn't have come to that.

The underfunding is the problem. I think everybody's snowed under.

@ivykaty44 yes I think a practice nurse would be great for this too.

Our GP surgery suspended online bookings, which made it a lot easier to book an appointment, since covid appeared and haven’t reinstated them. This is the message given:
“Online booking of appointments has been suspended on advice from NHS England. This is because we need to triage all appointments to mitigate the risks associated with potentially infected patients attending the Practice.
To book an appointment please telephone the surgery.”

*There are not enough GPs

This government has not done anything about increasing course numbers to increase those qualified*

I don’t think it’s just a lack of qualified GPs so much as a lack of GP positions being made available by the NHS. I’m sure if there were more surgeries allocated and more roles became available, the qualified GPs would materialise. Also there jobs would be less stressful and horrible if there were more of them to go around, so some of those who have gone private full time might be tempted to work for the NHS again.

@Sloth169

111, should be able to make you an appointment at a walk in/minor injuries/OOH rather than waiting forever and a day in A&E

Not everywhere has those services. In our area, it literally is either GP or A&E.

@Nonnymum

"The nhs isn’t perfect by a long shot, but it’s there and free at the point of care. I’d rather have what we have than a US style.*

Absolutely. Of course people are only likely to post when there are problems. You won't hear about the very many good stories . No system is perfect But I would back the NHS over a USA type system every time.

This is the thing though, people always turn it into NHS vs. USA. I have family or friends in quite a few other countries (Canada, Australia, Israel, Germany, Switzerland) -- none of them have American style systems and none of them have such bad access problems as the British.

The UK, for a very long time, has not trained enough GPs while demanding they do more than their colleagues in other countries for less money. That's why so many GPs are part time now, full time work is exhausting. They also emigrate for better pay and conditions--NHS GPs are NOT overpaid and most aren't GP partners, they are salaried. Then Brexit hit and the NHS lost even more doctors.

OP isn't the one saying her doctor should drop everything and treat her. She's right, though, that if you can't go to the GP and there's no walk-in option that it's inevitable that A&E will get overloaded with relatively minor cases.

@Staffy1

*There are not enough GPs

This government has not done anything about increasing course numbers to increase those qualified*

I don’t think it’s just a lack of qualified GPs so much as a lack of GP positions being made available by the NHS. I’m sure if there were more surgeries allocated and more roles became available, the qualified GPs would materialise. Also there jobs would be less stressful and horrible if there were more of them to go around, so some of those who have gone private full time might be tempted to work for the NHS again.

Nope. There aren’t enough GPs. Not surprisingly no one wants to be one, or retirement is a very attractive option right now

If all the appointments were booked I’m not sure what you wanted to happen? Should the GP have to stay there all night to see all the ‘extras’? Either it’s an emergency (a&e) or you could wait another day?