What are GPs actually doing right how?

[Darkchocolateandcoffee]

I've just been talking to my 84 yr old mum who can't get a GP appt for love nor money and is worried what she does next as she has a serious condition that she needs to talk to the doc about.

I love 100 miles away from her but I haven't been able to get a doc appointment for my children for months either.

One had such severe hayfever all through the summer and the only appt I could get was with my GP surgery's pharmacist over the phone, who sounded very unengaged and said the only remedies were OTC ones despite me saying we had tried all of them.

I eventually gave up and did a one-off private GP appt and got him prescription meds which worked straightaway. But I wasted weeks beforehand in which he was suffering trying to get the same thing via our usual GP.

Everyone I talk to says the same. The rest of the NHS seems to be firing on all cylinders.

What on EARTH are the GPs doing instead?

I'm in Wales and get same day telephone call backs from a GP and in person booked in if I need it.

Its been fine.

I wonder why there is such difference in experience. Are some GP surgeries just poorly organised, or working less hard? I have a hospital dr friend and her and her colleagues are furious as one of their colleagues is refusing to take on extra patients, leaving them to work even longer and harder to try to get through the backlog.

All the doctors in our GP practice are part time.

They obviously find a part time salary is easy to live on.

Rather than increasing their wages, it might be better to cut their pay so that they need a full time wage and start working full time for it.

@TrickyD

All the doctors in our GP practice are part time.

They obviously find a part time salary is easy to live on.

Rather than increasing their wages, it might be better to cut their pay so that they need a full time wage and start working full time for it.

The beatings shall continue until morale improves.

Are you for real?!

@TrickyD

All the doctors in our GP practice are part time.

They obviously find a part time salary is easy to live on.

Rather than increasing their wages, it might be better to cut their pay so that they need a full time wage and start working full time for it.

Yes make working standards worse for less money. Sounds a brilliant way to solve the shortage of people entering the profession.

GPS will be seen by history as the yellow panted cowards of the covid disaster. If not shameful enough they have dragged down the rest of the NHS with them. It is disgusting.

I bloody love my GP’s and won’t hear a word against them. I’m sick of people whinging about them.

@JinglingHellsBells

I genuinely don't understand how the GPs on this thread have the time to be on a chat forum! Sure, you aren't all working full time. But the people I know who are at a similar level (educationally and responsibility) in other fields, and on £100K a year simply do not have time to browse forums even on their days off. They tend to work 12 hour days as a norm and in their free time are catching up on chores.

Not really relevant to the thread,but that's a real incentive to work hard at school etc - study hard,so you can work 12 hour days and spend your free time doing chores

@Darkchocolateandcoffee would it be possible for you to talk to yiur parents' GP?

When my mother became housebound in the summer (in addition to my dad) I found actually talking to the receptionists and the. The GP really helped.
I hear what you say about your parents having no joy but if you use your elbows politely it may help.
I also take in plenty of treats for the surgery - I find sometimes feel I'm over burdening them with my parents' needs, and that's my way of keeping us front and Centre. Plus I do appreciate all the home visits my parents have had

'Or maybe the theatres in a private hospital aren’t suddenly taken up with an emergency and the procedure has to be delayed or postponed?'

Well of course if ops are postponed due to emergencies (although emergencies do have they own theatre allocation they don't stick them in elective case lists) then that could slow it down.

However on a normal day in a like for like scenario, the same consultant in a private hospital manages far more operations then they do in an nhs hospital. Someone needs to do an undercover expose on it.

But what is really getting to every single GP in this country is the lies and misinformation that is being spread about us
Whenever something isn't working in this country the finger will always be pointed at everyone but the government. Shortage of covid tests = people are using them who don't need them
Shortage of hgv drivers to deliver petrol = the media encouraged panic buying
People can't see a GP = GPs fault

I'm definitely put off ringing my GP about anything these days given the total lack of engagement I've had the last couple of times I've tried to raise issues with them - the first, was Feb this year when I was at breaking point re stress at work, home schooling and covid and they offered me nothing. The second at summer when I tried to speak to them about HRT - we'll send you some information.

My dad's gp has finally woken up to the fact that he's having constant chest infections and lost shit loads of weight over the last 12-18 months, despite the fact he was ringing up the surgery a lot and telling them he wasn't well. The only person who tried to help was the diabetes nurse and she was limited in what she could do and needed the Dr to arrange tests etc.

I wish they would bloody charge a fee for an appointment - we might all think since we are paying we might demand a better service (I know we pay for the NHS but no one really views it like that). Friend said best healthcare she ever received was in France and Belgium where so much is free but you do have to top up

@TrickyD

All the doctors in our GP practice are part time.

They obviously find a part time salary is easy to live on.

Rather than increasing their wages, it might be better to cut their pay so that they need a full time wage and start working full time for it.

Yes, cut their pay. That's incentive to keep GPs working....

Do you know why GPs work part-time (officially-most work beyond their hours)??? Because it is a really stressful job with ever increasing responsibility and unlimited demand.

A rushed, every-stretched, burned out GP helps no one.

On the one hand we have GPs saying they are working harder than ever, and on the other we have people saying they can't even get a telephone appointment.

Yet others can. Which implies that some GPs are vastly more efficient than others, supply/demand issues aside.

I've not needed the GP since covid started. But my 82 year old mother has given up trying to even get a telephone appointment. Although I think she managed to see the triage nurse in person once.

@TrickyD

All the doctors in our GP practice are part time.

They obviously find a part time salary is easy to live on.

Rather than increasing their wages, it might be better to cut their pay so that they need a full time wage and start working full time for it.

When you have a shortage of a particular type of worker, do you usually make it better by making terms and conditions worse? 🧐

All GPs have options.

Many are dual-qualified and can work in hospitals as associate specialists. Weirdly, no one blames hospital doctors for waits to be seen, so this is an increasingly attractive option.

Other countries are keen to recruit. Australia is offering to quarantine UK GPs in 5 star hotels if we will move there. Salaries are $200-300, with none of the GP-bashing.

GPs who want to remain in the UK are over-whelmed with offers of work - from the out of hours services, locum agencies, desperate practices.

By all means cut the pay - if you want to see practices collapse completely.

@lockdownmadnessdotcom

On the one hand we have GPs saying they are working harder than ever, and on the other we have people saying they can't even get a telephone appointment.

Yet others can. Which implies that some GPs are vastly more efficient than others, supply/demand issues aside.

I've not needed the GP since covid started. But my 82 year old mother has given up trying to even get a telephone appointment. Although I think she managed to see the triage nurse in person once.

You are assuming there is an even distribution of GPs across the country, which is not correct. Some areas have half the number of others.

@TrickyD

All the doctors in our GP practice are part time.

They obviously find a part time salary is easy to live on.

Rather than increasing their wages, it might be better to cut their pay so that they need a full time wage and start working full time for it.

So why exactly would young people choose to go into medicine? And also - are they actually "part-time" or working elsewhere for part of the week? We had a local GP who also worked in the hospital for part of their week.

Had you thought through how a universal maximum wage might work as obviously this should apply to other professions besides medicine -anyone who can afford to work part time should have their pay cut to the point where they do choose to work full time?

[quote shallIswim]@Darkchocolateandcoffee would it be possible for you to talk to yiur parents' GP?

When my mother became housebound in the summer (in addition to my dad) I found actually talking to the receptionists and the. The GP really helped.
I hear what you say about your parents having no joy but if you use your elbows politely it may help.
I also take in plenty of treats for the surgery - I find sometimes feel I'm over burdening them with my parents' needs, and that's my way of keeping us front and Centre. Plus I do appreciate all the home visits my parents have had[/quote]
That is such a good idea. I hadn't actually thought of that. I am a long way away but could call them.
Thank you

One solution - make it part of medical training that everyone has to undertake at least 2-3 years in primary care before they can progress through the hospital consultant/ specialism route.

I understand that one of the reasons there are so few GPs is that being a consultant earns a lot more money and is seen as much for important (especially in certain specialities)

For example a friend works in a private hospital and they'll whip through 6 or more knee replacements per day. In the nhs it's 4. The same consultant.

Typically the NHS will deal with more difficult and time consuming cases. Plus issues dealing with emergencies and understaffing.
I’ve had procedures done both privately and in the NHS. The only real differences were the cost (lots vs. nothing) and the quality of the sandwiches.

@JaniieJones but what if the emergency patient needed an ITU bed and the elective patient also needed an ITU bed and only one ITU bed was available?

The elective patient would be cancelled.

Haven’t needed the gp during covid🤞But do wonder why practices are so different.My in-laws got a full checkup when they joined their practice,and an annual checkup since then. A friend has regular ‘pre diabetes’ checkups. My own gp has to be chased for everything and the word preventative seems to be unknown.

@prettyLittlefool

GPS will be seen by history as the yellow panted cowards of the covid disaster. If not shameful enough they have dragged down the rest of the NHS with them. It is disgusting.

Well I'll certainly pass on your kind words to my staff who worked throughout the pandemic, putting their own lives and their families' lives on the line to continue seeing patients, even when the NHS hadn't bothered to provide us with PPE.

I'll pass your words on to our practice pharmacist who spent 8 weeks in ITU with Covid, and is still suffering the effects, but has come back to work because she cares so much about her work.

I'll pass your words on to our GP with a profoundly disabled daughter who kept working, including face-to-face, throughout Covid, but who spent 8 weeks living in a Travelodge to that she did not expose her daughter to risk.

All to help bile-filled professional haters like you. Doesn't really seem worth it, does it?

'but what if the emergency patient needed an ITU bed and the elective patient also needed an ITU bed and only one ITU bed was available? The elective patient would be cancelled.'

Oh fgs. I'll try again. A private hospital and an NHS hospital.. same consultant doing knee replacements. In a like for like scenario (ie no ITU beds required, no emergencies - which the trauma team would deal with anyway) they manage far more per session in a private hospital than they do an nhs hospital. Anyone would think the £££ signs made them more efficient.

To be honest in this day and age are people even phoning up to book appointments, there are plenty of booking apps that cna be implemented and used. Okay there will be some people who cannot access the Internet etc. Fine the phone system is then free for them.

Like it shouldn't be hard, if I need to meet with a coworker at work I book a teams meeting in.

Should just do the same with GPs, log onto app see available appointments and book. Then if there is any show you could even automate it to send a £5 fine.

And if someone has to cancel rather than wasting an appointment cos they can't get through on the phone they could cancel vis the app. You could even have a notify me if appointment comes free alert that ppl can sign up for.

Ots is literally not that hard to put in place!

Even my gym has got a booking appointment app in place, book, cancel, can see how many spaces available. I mean ffs if a gym ( not a big name brand either) can sort themselves out whats the gps excuse!

When they were not working during the pandemic they had all that time to sort themselves out.

Then if you really want to get sophisticated the same app could allow you to request repeat subscriptions and if they need docs approval then fine the gp can go through the app and confirm yes or no I need to see you

The whole thing is so archaic, ring up to book an appointment, send 5 mkns whilst they look you up, another 5 going back n forth on whsts available vs when you can go.