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Original poster

Is this normal age 3?

18 replies

twirlinginthesnow · 04/10/2021 10:10

Hello,

Just after a bit of perspective.

I have two children, girls, age 5 and 3. My eldest was diagnosed with autism at 3 so I don't really have a benchmark for 'normal' behaviour in 3 year olds. She couldn't speak at all until she was 2.5, then it came in paragraphs (and she hasn't stopped talking since). Eldest is extremely high functioning (I hate that phrase and appreciate that it doesn't mean she doesn't struggle, but am using for the purposes of you understanding what I mean easily). As in she's verbal, no learning difficulties (she's advanced academically) but always struggled socially. She still does, she has an EHCP in mainstream school.

Anyway, my (just) 3 year old. She does not struggle in the same way as her sister did, or at all really. She spoke at 1, and quickly progressed with it, her speech from a young age was amazing. She's very happily sociable, mixes easily, loves preschool (not a single tear or wobble at drop off from her first day) and is beautifully behaved and compliant there she's never even been told off there!

She does have some autistic traits - she tiptoe walks sometimes, she is very restrictive and repetitive with food, she sorts toys (but does also play 'normally' and is good with imaginative play using small world toys etc), she recites short books like The Hungry Caterpillar from memory and has since she was 2, she's already starting to sound out phonics and can read some 3 letter words (since joining in with reception homeschooling earlier this year, I didn't 'teach' her this on purpose) and counts brilliantly. She subitizes too, up to 6, again because she joined in homeschooling.

But generally I don't - or didn't - have any massive concerns about autism.

However. Her tantrums! They are extreme. My eldest never did this, she has meltdowns that in hindsight were due to sensory overload etc (something we still deal with) but nothing like this at this age.

Youngest will go absolutely wild if she doesn't get her own way, isn't allowed to do something for herself that she wants to do. I'm quite chilled about letting her be independent with getting dressed etc, but she's not allowed to take her dinner out of the oven, much to her disgust!. If she loses a game, decides on this occasion she doesn't want to share, basically if anything displeases her or she is asked to do anything she doesn't want to.

She will scream and scream excessively and hysterically for an hour or more. She will hit and kick. She will say I've hurt her (when I haven't, I will maybe have picked her up to move her away from a situation or sit her somewhere else but I never, ever hurt her!) . She will throw things. Last night she actually tantrummed herself to sleep because her Dad refused to read her five bedtime stores (a random demand - she'd had her usual one each from us!).

Is this normal? On the one hand I'm worried about autism and thinking perhaps she is affected, I need to get her checked and just presents very differently to her sister. On the other I'm thinking this is perhaps what NT 3 year olds are like and that this is just standard 3 year old behaviour that I need to handle differently to how I would a meltdown, as in with appropriate discipline not other strategies which were better for my eldest.

She really is an absolute delight, half the time. The other half she's like a violently tempered tyrant!

OP posts:

Inim · 04/10/2021 10:14

I think so, my eldest is autistic and never had tantrums as such but his 4 year old neurotypical brother throws absolute fits sometimes!

Tomnooktoldmeto · 04/10/2021 10:26

I’m not really sure, DD 19 had tantrums when transitioning but otherwise was more like your DD1 she is diagnosed

DS17 much more chilled but all the same things as your DD2 also diagnosed

Could be autism, could just be sibling differences and not autism as she’s 3, surely if you apply autism strategies for calming behaviours it can’t not help?

It’s quite usual for high functioning girls to be diagnosed much later as they are less well recognised and mask more effectively

even within families the saying’when you’ve met one autistic person you’ve met one autistic people’ applies, I say this looking at DH, dc, and most of DH’s extended family

Jujujuly · 04/10/2021 10:32

My son is the same age and NT (as far as I know!). He’s also extremely verbal and advanced generally and I foolishly thought he wouldnt have tantrums as people always say they come from inability to express themselves, and his language has always been so sophisticated. Boy was I wrong! He has awful screaming tantrums just as you’ve described, over really inconsequential things. The severity of the tantrums has actually caused me to wonder if he has some unidentified issues, but they’ve improved in the last 6 months (he’s 3.5) and I think it probably is just down to age. So no advice really but solidarity!

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

3 year olds 5 year olds Families Primary education

Generallystruggling · 04/10/2021 10:34

Yep, I think so. All of my DC are NT and the tantrums at that age were off the scale sometimes, usually over completely ridiculous things as well. My DS will be 3 this month and he had a violent tantrum a couple of weeks ago because his food was ‘too orange’ so…

Toddlers aren’t rational. One of my DC still threw tantrums at 4 and 5 and tbh, she has the odd one now at 9 but they’re thankfully few and far between.

Generallystruggling · 04/10/2021 10:35

Oh and also wanted to add that 2 of my DC have memorised books at 2/3 years old including my 2 year old now, he knows the gruffalo off by heart.

80Dodgeballs · 04/10/2021 10:36

I have two autistic children. I was initially convinced my youngest wasn't but, by the time they were still having tantrums at age 7, I questioned it. I went through phases of thinking that I must be imagining it, he can't possibly be on the spectrum too.

They both present very differently.

My eldest sounds exactly like your youngest at the same age (apart from the tantrums). Taught herself to read basically. Played imaginatively but occasionally lined up toys too.

I think the chances of having a sibling on the spectrum increase if you already have a child on the spectrum.

Trust your instincts and get your child on the pathway to assessment.

80Dodgeballs · 04/10/2021 10:45

My eldest also spoke very early too. People used to do a double take when she was speaking in 6 word sentences at 18 months. She'd try to engage with everybody in the supermarket and they couldn't believe this baby was speaking in that way. She'd start of by saying something like "scuse me lady...what you got there?"

80Dodgeballs · 04/10/2021 10:49

The only reason I say to start the pathway is because we all know it can take years to get to the assessment stage. With my youngest's tantrums I'd think "he's only 3. He's only 4. He's tired from starting school". When he got to 7 and was still having hour long tantrums I was thinking "surely this isn't normal?"

I don't think that regular hour long tantrums are normal, even at 3. 20 minutes, yes but not regularly for an hour each time.

Original poster

twirlinginthesnow · 04/10/2021 11:07

I'm not too worried about getting on the pathway @80Dodgeballs . I honestly don't think she'd meet the criteria at the moment but we went private with my eldest (initially, she has an NHS diagnosis too now it was needed for the EHCP) and we would do the same for the youngest if needed. But I would prefer to do this by age 5 if we need to as here they can be seen via the community paediatrician for their NHS MDA if they're under 5 rather than fighting through the nightmare that appears to be CAMHS.

I've left a message for the HV to call me. She's fab and knows our family really well, she helped a lot with my eldest. I'm going to speak with preschool too, they were amazing with my eldest - without them and their SENCO we'd not have realised at all that autism was what the issue was - and I've got a great relationship with them. I will ask for the SENCO to spend some time 1-1 with my youngest. I trust her judgement.

Eldest masks like a champ, so I'm on the lookout for that.

OP posts:

Itsbeen84yearss · 04/10/2021 11:11

Mine was like that at three. The tantrums were epic. It passed

Original poster

twirlinginthesnow · 04/10/2021 11:11

@Jujujuly

Yes and sometimes I think that this is it. She's bright, independent and speaks her own mind. She does not like it when she cannot have her own way (typical child!) and throws a wobbler.

I think it's this, combined with the more unusual things she does/can do that sets alarm bells ringing for me a bit. But equally if I didn't have an older child with autism I probably wouldn't be thinking anything of it and would think 'bloody threenagers!'.

OP posts:

Howmanysleepsnow · 04/10/2021 11:30

I have 4 children, all NT. One of the four was very similar: an absolute delight in nursery , really sweet, kind, clever… but could tantrum for hours (including throwing herself on the floor, screaming, biting, you name it) at age 2 and 3 when she couldn’t do/ have things her way.
All 4 of them went through restrictive eating around that age, and 3 went through phases of walking on tip toes too.
I’d say that while this level of tantrum isn’t normal for all children, it definitely is for some. Only one of my DC ever had an autism screening (as part of dyslexia testing, not due to any suggestion of ASD), and that was my DD who had the massive tantrums at 3. She scored incredibly low, so in her case at least it definitely wasn’t linked to that.

80Dodgeballs · 04/10/2021 12:03

@twirlinginthesnow I think that talking to the HV and the preschool is the right way forward. Could be something and nothing and they will at least be able to give you independent observations knowing your child and family well.

user1471538283 · 04/10/2021 12:07

My DS did not tantrum for long and only very occassionally but oh my! He would go off like a rocket! I think at that age they are aware just how limited their agency is.

WithMyEncyclopedia · 04/10/2021 12:23

My eldest was exactly like this at 3. even reciting the Hungry Caterpillar! Tantrums calmed down a lot more once he was 4. Used to throw beakers of water etc.

My other dc was a delight at 2, became more of a stubborn grumpy little dictator at 3. It's largely being 3, in my experience.

SparryG · 04/10/2021 12:29

Normal typical 3 year old behaviour.

Original poster

twirlinginthesnow · 04/10/2021 15:03

Yes to all those who are saying about tantrums being over anything and everything. 'Mummy gave me the pink cup, I wanted blue', 'My biscuit is broken!'(yes, because you bit it!), 'I put on my OWN shoes!' (but they're mums shoes, sweetheart, not yours!).

We have the odd one about more serious things like if she loses at a game, or throws something/snatches but mostly it's the small stuff!

And if she wants me and gets DH for whatever reason, well then world has utterly ended!!

OP posts:

8Sense8 · 04/10/2021 15:16

TBH my DD with ASD was just as you described at 3. She wouldn't have got an EHCP and she did well at school but struggled socially yet was/is very sociable. She didn't get diagnosed until teens. However, it's not really clear, from what you've said that she does have ASD. Maybe something to monitor though....As other pp have said, big tantrums are common at that age. My NT DS stopped at 8yrs!

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