'You need to move on' Family situation escalating

[Iamlistening]

It has taken me over a decade, with the help of MN and three years of therapy to find the courage to go very low contact/no contact with my father.
My father was very abusive when we were younger, and the police were sometimes called, other family were regularly coming to our house to help my mother, as he had explosive outbursts of temper. My mother had a breakdown when I was eleven, and her parenting effectively ended, and I became the 'parent' cleaning, listening to her etc.

The worst of it was not that my father hit me, but that he told us a lot that he 'did not want kids' which is true I think, he agreed to keep my mother happy. However he hated any noise, he never once played with me, spoke to me, hugged me or even once said he loved me as a child. I lived in total fear of him. Living with a father who openly hated me was extremely difficult as a child, I became highly dependent on other relationships and people pleasing as a result.

Fast forward today I have no real relationship with my only sibling as such beyond birthday and christmas presents, and this week out of nowhere I have been ordered to 'move on' and 'stop living in the past' by him. He told me 'he does not remember' the abuse at all, and effectively told me I was making it up - I answered that I still have scars on my face to remind me every single day. My brother seems hellbent on rewriting history, he said every parent 'in the olden days' (we are in our 40s) hit and abused their children, and that we had a 'good' childhood?!!

I have been told I am responsible for my mother's current depression as I won't 'move on' and be a 'normal' family with my father. I am 'torturing' my father by trying to outline my reasons for no contact and that I should be glad he paid the bills and didn't have affairs?!

For clarity, I did initially give my father lots of chances, but he ended up being emotionally abusive to my own children by commenting on their clothes being 'cheap' and 'tatty' (they were fashion jeans with holes) and a running commentary on their weight, eyebrows etc (they were pre teen at the time, and very hurt and cried when he would say those things) so we had to stop seeing my parents, and now only see my mother occasionally without my father.

Now my mother has stopped speaking to me because I won't move on, and is giving me the silent treatment whilst my brother has waded into the situation, and I am really very upset he is seemingly forgetting everything has happened, although he acknowledges 'Dad has a nasty temper'

I feel like I am being blackmailed with my mothers depression to accept this in my life again. They are the only family we have .

Thanks beige I am definitely going to look into that. There is a sense of isolation that comes from choosing better for our lives and children, as my friends have good relationships with their families, and I can see what a normal family looks like. It makes me feel worse sometimes, as I can see how much I have lost.

I feel a little like an orphan, but with living parents. It is bizarre. My parents are not 'real' parents in the sense of the word, they would never offer to help in an emergency or anything. I know not to count on them or even confide in them. I have close friends that are my family.

It’s all about appearances, your mum knows her husbands an abuser and so does your dB. But if they pretend that was just a normal childhood back then you become the problem.

They won’t want anyone asking why their dd doesn’t have anything to do with them.

My dn calls situations like this the bubble of bullshit.

I’ve got the T-shirt

You my love @Iamlistening got the T-shirt, the sweatshirt and the matching hat and gloves

I’m so sorry for what you’ve been through. I’ve had my own sibling reignite all the feelings of disparity, the hurt dredged up from years ago, and I haven’t been able to handle it too well myself

Can you have a quick session with your therapist? My therapist has just retired and to start again when I know it’ll all die down and I’ll get through it eventually just doesn’t seem worthwhile

I have severe MH issues brought on by extreme violence and sexual abuse as a child and young woman. My illness was triggered by childbirth. My sisters have a different version. Not all of us were sexually abused, two of us were, they do remember the violence but have minimised it.

The behaviour of your family is surprisingly common. It’s the main reason abuse perpetuates. It’s minimised, they close ranks and pretend it didn’t happen. The family member who does not want to hide it all can be ostracised and can end up with MH issues because everyone is against their stance. Families gang up up on that person who won’t live the lie.

Fortunately my stepfather died when I was a teenager but my Mother lived to a great age. I moved miles away and had increasingly low contact.

Your reality is your truth, keep your dc away. Your Mother like mine is or was an enabler. Her depression is almost guaranteed to be because she has remained with your Father.

When my Mother died in her nineties a couple of years ago I actually felt happy. Any Mother that allows their child to be sexually or violently abused and mine knew what was happening, plus she was incredibly violent does not deserve the title Mother.

Never doubt yourself.

Your insight into this is incredible mzhz

That is exactly it!

Their 'moving on' is me going back into my role and becoming a fake by pretending he didn't really do the things he did, so my father can continue at his pleasure, my mother can pretend again that it is all fine and lovely with her family.

My 'moving on' means the family acknowledge what happened, apologies are made and we agree re established boundaries so it never happens again.

The crushing feeling I felt in my chest, when I read your second line, 'it is never going to happen' reminds me that I have been so hoping for my version of moving on, and yes you are right I don't think it is ever going to happen.

It now feels like a pitched battle -

@Iamlistening You are so wise and self-aware. This exactly it isn't it?:

I feel a little like an orphan, but with living parents. It is bizarre. My parents are not 'real' parents in the sense of the word

Sadly they are parents in a technical sense only. They and your brother do not meet any social or emotional definition of a family.

You sound very strong OP and your brother is the last thread keeping you tethered to this abusive family. If you find a bit more strength to cut that thread you will be fully free of them all.

You're brother knows where you are if he ever breaks free himself.

for you The Unbearable that sounds absolutely horrific, and I am so sorry that happened to you as a little girl. Have you had lots of support over the years to help you through this? No one should have to suffer what you have suffered.

Thank you grief It is a life time's work unpicking childhood for some of us, but I had got to a great place of acceptance. Accepting my father could not be a better parent, that he was unable to offer love, and that is no one's fault. I was actually feeling forgiveness towards him, not enough to have him in my children's lives, but sorry that it could not be better for all of us, and to hope his retirement is peaceful and noise free as he prefers.

My brother comes along like a bullet and drags it all up again, and it has been really unsettling. I know he is damaged too, I know this will have had an awful impact on him even if he can't admit it. But I refuse to pretend we are anything other than what we are. I am not lying to keep everyone happy. I am not putting my kids through the living hell that was my father during my teen years. I am not going to another family function where my father loses his shit in a restaurant over something small, and everyone else tries to smooth things over. I am not doing it anymore. Ever again.

How do I get them to stop pestering me, and let me be?

Over the air I can tell you are a fellow soul MzHz immediately. I am sorry you have had to go through this. You sound extremely wise and together though. What doesn't kill us (in the literal sense) makes us stronger, and it really does. Not one tells you it can takes decades though.

Stck to your guns with your brother. Hats off to you for actually moving on by refusing to put up with shit. Go LC or Nc if you must, if they go on bullying.

@Iamlistening

Do you think I should go low contact/no contact with my brother? I had tried to keep some kind of relationship going, I feel sad for him that he too had a difficult childhood, even if he is now blaming me for being a 'difficult child'

I had chosen to break the cycle, and it was initially really painful to give up on the hope of having a happy, normal family and grandparents for my dc. I had to work really hard to break free.
They are the only family we have (PIL and dh sibling have died)

I think you can try to stay in contact with him and your mother but expect the interaction to be unsatisfying and sometimes bruising on both sides, as you want completely different things. You want to try and have a healthy, boundaried relationship with your mother and brother but they want you to come back into the fold and continue to help them keep your father happy and pretend that everything is great.

I don't have any words of wisdom on how to deal with this TBH. It is just crap. I sometimes wish I could adopt the grandparents of some of my kids' friends.

@Iamlistening

Brother seems fixated with minimising everything! Not once has he held my father accountable, he just chooses to relentlessly blame me for all of it.

Maybe he is just dealing with it in a way that works for him. We all deal with things in different ways but if the way you both deal with it has a bad effect on the other low contact might be the best way.

By the way did your psychologist really diagnose your father without meeting him? That doesn't sound professional to me.

Huge hug to @TheUnbearable

@Iamlistening I’m sorry if I jolted you, but yes it is the “they’re never going to change, any don’t WANT to either”

I know that if I sat my own mother down, even with a truth serum, she’s never going to admit to herself what she’s done

Oh she’s told EVERYONE what she wants them to believe she’s done, ie the exact complete opposite of what she actually did.

The periods when she’d go radio silent for weeks at a time if I mentioned I was having a not too great day, the “fact” that she came to where I was to save me and bring me home… she came for a holiday and spent hours telling me how my partner wasn’t abusing me and that I should just stay put, when she saw at first hand what he was like. She pulled the rug on support every single opportunity she could, kicking me when I was down and then she hurt my son, physically with a side order of emotional manipulation. All the stars eventually aligned, I had to call the police and have seen her once in the last 10 years and no plans to see her again.

I know that isolation, and my oh family offers absolutely nothing to offset that either, but we have to work with what we’ve got (or haven’t got)

If you have not already popped into the stately homes thread on Relationships, that’s a great source of support.

You’ll get through this, you’re not alone and you’re doing the right thing (((hug)))

The behaviour of your family is surprisingly common. It’s the main reason abuse perpetuates. It’s minimised, they close ranks and pretend it didn’t happen. The family member who does not want to hide it all can be ostracised and can end up with MH issues because everyone is against their stance. Families gang up up on that person who won’t live the lie.

^Yep this

I have been through a version of this too. It is so confusing and it hurts like hell. Your brother does not need to believe what you say for it to be the truth. You are not the problem here. On some deep down level they all know it and that is way they don’t want to face, that they are the problem.

Move from LC to NC if that is what it takes. It is extremely hard but you have already done a tonne of the work.

What doesn’t kill you really does make you stronger, yes!

And yes it takes forever and the weirdest of things brings it all back in a flash.

You are processing your feelings, you’re talking it out and it will pass

ancient Yes she told me that my father's actions the total absence of love or any emotion apart from anger typifies a psychopath, and indeed everything she has heard over the years would indicate to her that he may not be able to love me. He may simply not be capable. She did not 'diagnose' but she did indicate to me that it is nothing something I can change after 47 years, that I needed to see him for what he was (rather then who I would love him to be)

Of course for a proper clinical diagnosis, he would have to seek professional help, and there is more chance of hell freezing over than my father admitting he may need help.

You do need to move on, from your family . They will never be the family you want/need them to be , no matter what you do. Your dm and dB will never stand up to your df nor will they ever admit to themselves what he was/ is. Their fantasy is obviously vital to them to continue surviving, it makes it easier for them to deny it ever happened. You can't pretend , you need the truth to survive. So your families needs and your needs do not align. Once you accept that you cannot change this, things will be easier for you. I know because I've been here with my own family. I've grieved for the child I was and the neglect/abuse and put all my energy into healing myself rather than trying to get them to it , to see me!

**that it is not something I can change after 47 years

They’re not interested in your own health or well being, just that they want you back in the position they created for you; a source (in both you AND your dc) of power and psychopathic feed

your brother is not a safe person to have in your life. I would also sadly say your mother isn't either but those are decisions only you can make. With support from your chosen family.

Look after yourself, @Iamlistening..... and remember the above, which is really all that matters.

If I can be honest, because I ended up in more of a parenting role as a child, as my mother would regularly fall apart, I do feel an element of responsibility for my brother. Even though my father targeted me for most of his abuse.

I DO feel very worried for my brother's children (they still see my parents regularly) I feel bad for my brother living this life of a lie and I feel most worried that he can not seem to identify what abuse even looks like, so what kind of parent is he turning out to be?

I know this is not my problem, and I will have to walk away anyway, but I can't help but feel my brother is raising the next cycle of this, I can't get past the nagging feeling that the new generation of abuse is being born and there is probably nothing I can do about it. I feel particularly worried for my niece whom is pre teen and prime pickings for my father, would my brother even notice if my father starts with her? And why wouldn't he, he has done the same to my children.

What underlies all of this, is is a pure hatred towards women. I can see it now, after years of feeling confused. He is the only man in the world I know to have not cared when his own mother died (my grandmother) and she was a lovely lady, not perfect but loved my Dad.

Oh @Iamlistening - you poor thing. What a terrible situation you find yourself in and it is so not of your doing.
Your brother is what some might call a "flying monkey" set to do the bidding of your father and mother by trying to bring you back to tow the family line.
I fear you will have to go low/no contact with him too and while they might be your blood relatives, sometimes we find better friendships and bonds with others that are not related to us.

Your father sounds like a puppet master and has your mother and brother dancing to his tune and because they are still tied they can't see the scenes they are playing in ... but you have managed to cut those strings and are free and can turn around and watch what is happening now and you can make those changes and establish those boundaries and be free.

Best of luck to you in dealing with this

I am sorry that you have had to deal with all this. I do have some sympathy for your brother though. He either has to face the fact that he watched you be treated appallingly and did nothing, (not his fault he was a child too) or rewrite the past so that it never happened.

It was probably less obvious to him, as it sounds like you took the brunt of it, so quite easy to pretend it didn't happen. In the same way you have been desperate for the kind of parents you wish you had, he may be trying to convince himself he has that happy loving family.

None of that helps you, or changes what you need to do, but I can see why he might be doing what he is.

The only thing you need to consider is what benefits you and your children. Having this man in yours and their life is only going to have a negative impact.

In fact by allowing him contact you are pretty much condoning what he did not only to you but to your children. Blood doesn’t mean that the person can treat you how they want and have no repercussions.

I was about to post the same as @Stormyequine
Bear in mind that your brother is every bit as damaged by his childhood as you are. His coping methods though, then and now, are very different from yours. He has clearly shut down those memories in order to protect himself. And he is now desperately trying to make things normal, to prove that actually everything is and was, fine.

It doesn't really help you of course, but it might enable you to understand where his behaviour is coming from. He may have done such a good job on his mind that he absolutely believes what he's saying.

It's so sad, for both of you.