Why can SO many people not drive properly on the motorway?

[londongirl993]

I don’t know why this annoys me SO much, but the amount of middle lane / third lane hoggers on motorways is actually getting ridiculous. There needs to be some sort of surveillance / fines for poor (and v.dangerous) motorway driving because it is getting so much worse!

There is literally no point having 4 lane motorways because nobody drives in the slow lane, or even the second lane. No point having 3 lane motorways either really because they are basically just 2 lanes of traffic.

It’s not only hugely frustrating for those who actually follow the Highway Code (like me), but also disrupts the traffic flow so much. And it’s so dangerous!! I honestly believe that if everybody / 90% of drivers actually drove on motorways like you were supposed to, traffic would flow so much better.

Okay, rant over. Anyone else agree with me? Can anyone give me an insight as to why people just don’t drive properly on the motorway?

@HotelCaliforniaOnRepeat

Why can't lorries overtake but you can? Lorries are limited to 56. Fully laden it is hard for them to pick speed up again if they lose momentum- if they didn't overtake when they needed to it would be carnage. You can help them out by letting them out to overtake before they lose their momentum and then they will get back in again more easily. You can't expect an empty lorry to sit at 45 behind a fully laden one lumbering up an incline. Be lorry aware and you will improve the flow of traffic. Selfish drivers are the biggest problem anywhere. Being inconsiderate slows things down as a rule. We live rurally, instead of stopping in the passing place they drive at you where there's no room to pass. Totally stupid. You rarely need to reverse if drivers pay attention and give way appropriately, and it's quicker and easier as the traffic flows.

Absolutely this.

I think half the issue with passing places is that folk also can't reverse so overshoot the passing place then keep on coming because they simply are incapable of manoeuvring their car

@HotelCaliforniaOnRepeat

Why can't lorries overtake but you can? Lorries are limited to 56. Fully laden it is hard for them to pick speed up again if they lose momentum- if they didn't overtake when they needed to it would be carnage. You can help them out by letting them out to overtake before they lose their momentum and then they will get back in again more easily. You can't expect an empty lorry to sit at 45 behind a fully laden one lumbering up an incline. Be lorry aware and you will improve the flow of traffic. Selfish drivers are the biggest problem anywhere. Being inconsiderate slows things down as a rule. We live rurally, instead of stopping in the passing place they drive at you where there's no room to pass. Totally stupid. You rarely need to reverse if drivers pay attention and give way appropriately, and it's quicker and easier as the traffic flows.

Maybe lorries could help drivers by not just indicating and moving immediately into the car's stopping gap at the same time. It's not for the lorry driver to assess whether I can move into the right lane to avoid them pulling in front of me; I make that decision, thanks!

I'm more than happy to move, but when I've decided it's safe, with adequate warning.

Maybe lorries could help drivers by not just indicating and moving immediately into the car's stopping gap at the same time. It's not for the lorry driver to assess whether I can move into the right lane to avoid them pulling in front of me; I make that decision, thanks!

This!! It's all very well indicating to pull out - it doesn't just magically create the space to do so.

What amazes me about driving in the US is a complete lack of awareness of stopping distances. So they don’t leave gaps at all. They will actually move into a gap just to fill it, like rats up a drain pipe.

@Comedycook

I rarely drive on the motorway. When I do I stay in the left hand lane. I genuinely don't understand though why if you're meant to stay left why there's three lanes? Why not just two? One to drive in and the other to be used for overtaking?

Volume of traffic. Motorways are built to take a higher volume of traffic than dual carriageways.

Maybe lorries could help drivers by not just indicating and moving immediately into the car's stopping gap at the same time. It's not for the lorry driver to assess whether I can move into the right lane to avoid them pulling in front of me; I make that decision, thanks!

I'm more than happy to move, but when I've decided it's safe, with adequate warning

Its usually pretty easy to predict when lorries are about to overtake, you can always slow down & let the lorry out, you don't need to keep to 70 and move lanes?

Most people don't want to be swapping lanes all the time, thats what causes accidents and with the volume of traffic keeping left becomes difficult, made harder by folk who drive at 80 or 90 plus and expect you to move out of their way.

Of course there are drivers who drive in the middle lane even at 2am but I focus on what i can control - my own driving, if i am constantly criticising others, it means i'm not concentrating on what i'm doing.

Its usually pretty easy to predict when lorries are about to overtake, you can always slow down & let the lorry out, you don't need to keep to 70 and move lanes?

There is a solid line if nose to tail lorries traveling at 50-60. I have pulled out to overtake the whole lot and am now in a solid line of traffic traveling at 60-70. How on earth can you predict that one of them is going to suddenly pull out to overtake (at a slower speed than the rest of the traffic in the lane they have pulled into), let alone make room for them?

Chevrons

www.sabre-roads.org.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Road_Markings/Chevrons_(Distance)

It's probably an awful generalisation but, having become obsessed with this and j therefore always look, it always seems to be a middle aged man doing the middle lane hogging. Always. It's like the motorway equivalent of man spreading.

It’s a bit sweary but Russell Kane does a bit on middle lane hoggers:

Its usually pretty easy to predict when lorries are about to overtake, you can always slow down & let the lorry out, you don't need to keep to 70 and move lanes?

Well, yes, sometimes you have to nigh on slam on as they move and indicate simultaneously. I'm pretty sure you're in breach of the Highway Code if you're pulling out and causing other drivers to take evasive action to avoid hitting you, however! That is frankly a large vehicle using their weight to bully other drivers.

If I see lorries who look like they're about to overtake, AND I have room to move over, I will, to make it easier. They shouldn't force their way out where there isn't a safe gap to do so, however.

Overtake when it is safe to do so.

Maybe lorries could help drivers by not just indicating and moving immediately into the car's stopping gap at the same time. It's not for the lorry driver to assess whether I can move into the right lane to avoid them pulling in front of me; I make that decision, thanks!

I had a lorry actually pull out onto me as I was overtaking in the middle lane. It touched the side of my car and started to push me into the next lane, fortunately the car about to overtake me braked sharply and let me in otherwise it could have been nasty. The lorry carried on and didn't even know he'd touched me, it was a LH drive so I guess he couldn't look over his shoulder. For quite a long time after that I didn't overtake a lorry until I knew I could pass it in its entirety.

@Seeline

I too use those 3 very regularly and there are definitely chevrons on parts of the London to Bristol stretches - can't remember exactly where.

Yes, but there are so many stretches with none at all.

A few weeks ago. Two people slowed down in lanes next to each other and started throwing stuff into each other’s car windows while shouting at each other. While doing over 70 miles an hour. I have no words

I should go back and check really, but has anyone mentioned the M8 through Glasgow yet?
My bf has just been here for a couple of days, he drove as his car is much better to get Dd and her Bf in, he's also a better, more experienced driver than I am, but I had to navigate him up the M8!
Anyone who drives it regularly knows exactly what I mean.
It was described on here recently as being exactly like Wacky Races, it really is, and you join in or you lose.
Don't think for a second a sav nav will help either!

That's no excuse. I learnt to drive very late in life around 40 and that was over 15 years ago. We never went on the motorway obviously, but we did use dual carriageways. I've always been aware of lane discipline on motorways. No excuse for those annoying mid lane hoggers.

@NeonJellyBaby

I’d imagine it’s because those of us who learned before 2018 were never taught how to to drive on the motorway properly. We were just expected to get on with it once we passed our tests.

That last post was to this.

The argument between the "middle lane sitters" and the "zig zaggers" will never be resolved (in practice I think the vast majority of us are somewhere inbetween).

It's like the debate between the people who merge when two lanes go into one, and the people who get into the left hand lane in plenty of time.

Personally I think there is a lot of hysteria about middle lane sitting, and I also think that it's safer to stay in the middle lane a bit longer if you can see you need to overtake more than one vehicle rather than pulling back in and almost immediately needing to come out again. I'm also not clear why sitting in the middle lane is dangerous (assuming not doing 40mph in a 70 limit). Annoying, yes. But not dangerous, unlike undertaking which is very dangerous.

Hi @igelkott2021

The argument between the "middle lane sitters" and the "zig zaggers" will never be resolved
It's very clearly resolved in the highway code! Some drivers just don't seem to like the answer.

I'm also not clear why sitting in the middle lane is dangerous
Because it reduces the number of lanes available to pass you from two down to one. And on a busy motorway this causes bunching behind you. It's not dangerous to you, and any accident you cause is very unlikely to affect your vehicle.

The middle lane drivers were out in force today, all sitting comfortably at 65.
I couldn't fathom why and obviously overtook them all for 20 minutes until my exit came up.
Completely baffling

@igelkott2021

The argument between the "middle lane sitters" and the "zig zaggers" will never be resolved (in practice I think the vast majority of us are somewhere inbetween).

It's like the debate between the people who merge when two lanes go into one, and the people who get into the left hand lane in plenty of time.

Personally I think there is a lot of hysteria about middle lane sitting, and I also think that it's safer to stay in the middle lane a bit longer if you can see you need to overtake more than one vehicle rather than pulling back in and almost immediately needing to come out again. I'm also not clear why sitting in the middle lane is dangerous (assuming not doing 40mph in a 70 limit). Annoying, yes. But not dangerous, unlike undertaking which is very dangerous.

This, and loads of articles like it, suggest that it's more than just an argument between driving styles. Mid lane hogging is illegal and police forces have been clamping down on it.

@BareVanilla

I think as long as people do 70 in the second lane then what’s the problem? I did 2, 6 hour drives a couple of weeks ago and the left lane should be for vehicles who can’t do more than 50 or 60, horse boxes and lorries. It makes no sense zig zagging in and out of lanes every couple of minutes. When I get into the left lane knowing the car ahead is going slower I find myself then having to slow to their speed while I wait to get in the second lane. If all the second/middle lane drivers drove in left lane they wouldn’t get anywhere. I’d still be in the second lane overtaking for 6 hours.

You are the definition of a middle Lane driver. You should be driving in lane 1 (it's not called the not the "slow lane") if it is clear, and then pulling out into lane 2 to overtake. You do not stay in lane 2 for 6 hours. It's really dangerous. Do you have any clue what is going on behind or around you?

@igelkott2021

The argument between the "middle lane sitters" and the "zig zaggers" will never be resolved (in practice I think the vast majority of us are somewhere inbetween).

It's like the debate between the people who merge when two lanes go into one, and the people who get into the left hand lane in plenty of time.

Personally I think there is a lot of hysteria about middle lane sitting, and I also think that it's safer to stay in the middle lane a bit longer if you can see you need to overtake more than one vehicle rather than pulling back in and almost immediately needing to come out again. I'm also not clear why sitting in the middle lane is dangerous (assuming not doing 40mph in a 70 limit). Annoying, yes. But not dangerous, unlike undertaking which is very dangerous.

Umm... these issues aren't 'arguments' or 'debates'

The Highway Code provides very clear guidance.

It's just the ignorant or arrogant who chose to inconvenience the rest of us by not following that clear guidance

Volume of traffic. Motorways are built to take a higher volume of traffic than dual carriageways

Yes but then if everyone stuck to the rule of keeping left then only the two lanes would be used wouldn't they?! Or am I missing something

@Comedycook

Volume of traffic. Motorways are built to take a higher volume of traffic than dual carriageways

Yes but then if everyone stuck to the rule of keeping left then only the two lanes would be used wouldn't they?! Or am I missing something

There are varying speeds!! Lorries are generally limited to just under 70. To overtake them you need to go faster than this. Some drivers wish to drive faster than that vehicle so a further lane is needed. It's pretty obvious why 3 lanes are useful!