A Place in the Sun - Pros and Cons

[Twoginsonetonic]

Lockdown dreams…
A holiday den…
Do you have one? If so, where? Would you buy one if you could?
Is it worth it?

@Twoginsonetonic

I believe the rules are the same all over the EU. You can stay for 90 days in a 180 day period, so you can spend 2x90 days in a year there, but you have to leave for three months in between. You can not gain residency by holidaying there, residency for brits are quite hard to get in the EU now.

My parents have one however they are immigrants here so it's in one of their home countries. Both EU citizens as I'm I so no worries there.
It was inherited but still a bit of a money pit, it's never been rented out though. Parents use it about 3-4 months of the yr.

@snoken thank you for the info @simonTJ good luck with it!
90 days twice is probably sufficient for most.

@newnortherner111

I don't like second homes. I don't like people being unable to buy a house locally because someone has a home that is only used for say 100 days a year. So I would never consider one.

I agree with this. I do understand the big appeal of a holiday home but I can't overlook the fact that they often have a negative impact on the local community. Locals are priced out of the housing market and a home that could otherwise have housed a permanently resident family, who would contribute to the local economy (more than occasionally resident visitors) and whose children would attend the local school, sits empty for significant amounts of time. Additionally, if the holiday home is abroad and you visit several times a year, that probably means several flights a year so they are bad for the environment as well.

The property market seems quite good here at the moment but there have been times that it’s been very slow and it could take a year or more to sell.

When we moved 20+ years ago it was easy to become resident, now post brexit it’s more difficult. But if you do take residency you should spend at least 183 days here and your worldwide income has to be reported in your tax return.

Otherwise non eu residents can only spend 90 days in 180 in the whole schengen area, so if you still want to take trips to other eu countries that comes off the amount of time you can spend in your holiday home

I’ve gone one step further and taken citizenship, which took over 2 years and involves a language test.

I’m in Portugal too

@macsmirving I am not so sure. Firstly, one can drive if it’s in France or similar. Also, if people end up retiring abroad it means you end up benefiting the local economy quite a bit ( more so than your own).

A lot of countries depend on tourists. From a local point of view, does it really price the locals out? I would not like to live in a community that is resentful of this so it’s definitely something to think about.

Was in Barcelona two years ago (feels like a life time! ) and got a distinct anti tourist feeling … are tourists more resented in general our days?

You would not want to spend more than 90 x 2 days a year in EU country because if you did you would be liable to fill in all the tax forms there and pay too probably - which can be a nightmare as well as doing it in UK of course!

We will inherit a villa in Portugal. We spent all our family hols there when the kids were small so there’s an emotional aspect but tbh recently the kids want to go to other places. It was amazing when they were small to be met at the airport by the grandparents and have it all set up with all their old toys etc. If we can make enough renting it out I might semi retire on that income and manage it as a job but it isn’t at all set up to rent right now.

Wouldn't ever do it, no matter how rich I was. I'm a Highlander, and I see them decimating our local communities. Some villages are like ghost towns in winter, with more than half the houses empty. In the meantime, locals who would like to live in them permanently are forced to live with parents, or leave the area they were born in completely. I could never be so selfish and greedy as to contribute to this destruction of a community.

However, if this is a light-hearted 'in my dreams' kind of thread, I'd like a holiday home on a totally uninhabited island, and a boat to get there. No TV, just board games, wine, walks, climbing, swimming etc. Bliss!

@CrumpetsForAll unfortunately I think it’s unlikely that you will make enough from renting a villa, once all the running costs and taxes are paid

There will also be capital gains to pay when you sell

FIL has one, but I know he regrets buying, as he is tied down to one holiday destination. His advice is to rent. That way you can go to lots of different places, you don't have a chunk of money tied up, a complicated foreign mortgage etc.

@Twoginsonetonic The Solicitors fees were around £3K euro from memory. It was super-easy and they handled everything. We borrowed on the equity in our current property. We had to give the Solicitor / broker Power of Attorney. We had to pay approx 10% of the property value in tax.
We used to spend approx £2k on a holiday so I figure this is a good investment for us and our friends and family.

@DazzlePaintedBattlePants that’s useful to know, thank you.
Our DD was pretty cross when she found out that she was a generation too far to get hers

Just bought one in France, going this summer to decorate, it'll be rented out a lot so we won't feel restricted by it and will also go elsewhere but we absolutely love the area and would love to spend more time there as we get older.

Is this true ? I didn’t realise… surely one can get permanent residence if they own a house? It must be different in different countries too…

Yes it is true and applies to UK citizens throughout most EU countries.

No, you can't just get permanent residence if you own a house. You need to show tax records for previous years. Here in France, the deadline for UK citizens to apply for a residence permit (carte de sejour) is the 30th June. No idea what the process will be for anyone arriving after that.

We have friends who have decided to move from here to Spain, but they had to be there for 3 months prior to Dec 2020 in order to qualify for a residence permit there.

You can no longer just rock up and buy a house. You will be limited to 90 days in any one period and yes, customs are now stamping passports when you cross the channel so it is all recorded somewhere.

You may also have issues with qualifying for healthcare, registering your car and having a valid driving license.

You may not be eligible to work either.

Brexit has had a huge impact on things that UK citizens have previously been entitled to/taken for granted and it will be interesting to see how this is reflected in programmes such as Place in the Sun.

Thanks for all the insights. Portugal seems to be a popular choice and Spain also.
Thanks also for the insights into citizenships etc.

@newnortherner111

I don't like second homes. I don't like people being unable to buy a house locally because someone has a home that is only used for say 100 days a year. So I would never consider one.

Agree 100%

Our children have been priced out of the housing market due to this situation.