Do schools take pen licences away?

[Tuesday588]

DD is in Year 3 and was awarded her pen licence a few weeks ago. She's one of the first in her class to get one so was extremely pleased about this and I feel it has been a good confidence boost for her as she sometimes struggles in other areas of learning.

She came home from school upset today saying that her teacher had pulled her to one side and said that her writing isnt as neat in pen and it was in pencil and if it's the same tomorrow that she will be taking her pen licence away and she will need to go back to writing in pencil.

Does anyone or any teachers know if that is a thing? Do teachers actually take pen licences away once they've been rewarded?

Obviously dd is very upset by this and has gone to bed upset. If the teacher has just said this to get dd to try harder with writing in pen then fine but surely as she's only just started writing in pen it will take her a while to get used to it.

I just wondered if anyone had experience with this ? Thanks!

@arinah

Forget pen licences, the real devil here is spending 6 years being told to write in cursive, only realise in year 7 that no one cares if your letters are joined up or not, as long as it's legible

Sorry, meant to quote.

God this is another one of those awful practices designed to hurry a child's learning that in many cases serves only to cause children stress and poor self esteem because they don't take into account the fact that kids are physically different.

I'd have a word with the school OP. It's really not OK to tell a child "you're good at that" then a few days later "I was wrong, you're shit at it" - which is what any child will have heard in that nonsense exchange of licenses.

So pleased that our school doesn't have pen licenses, what a load of competitive nonsense!

And yet research shows that for emergent writing black (felt type) pen is best for children’s development. So...we give them early, take them away, give pencils( while discouraging rubbing out) then give ink back with a licence...and remove it as a deterrent to messy handwriting?

Any mention of own licences makes me come out in hives. Ridiculous antiquated idea that destroys self esteem.

Our kids primary school made them earn one every year. Hideous.

What a load of tut. How are children supposed to learn to write with a pen if they don’t have one? Totally illogical.

My DC's primary school didn't do this, they all moved to pens at the same time. Although the pens that they moved to were fountain pens which I personally think was nuts.

DH apparently had the pen licence or equivalent when he was at primary because it came out when we were having relationship counselling that he was sick of me insulting him by handing him a pencil when he was writing a note or shopping list. I genuinely had no idea as there had been nothing like that at my primary school, plus I have a maths degree and worked in statistical analysis so a pencil was the implement of choice because it can be erased.

They do this at our primary too!

DD in year four has moved to a black pen now, she’s absolutely delighted bless her 🤣

But yes, they revoke them if handwriting gets sloppy.

I’ve never heard of them being taken away

Ds2 smudged his work dreadfully with a pen...its went on for months and in the end i asked the school if i could buy their pens as he smudged his work less with those

The teacher said of course....then ‘ its almost as if he is writing left handed’

Well yeah...cos he is left handed 🤨

Never got his certificate taken from him....he was in year 6 though so maybe everyone had one by then

Why are people surprised that they could be taken away? If children start being complacent with their handwriting, which they sometimes do then of course they would get taken away - why would someone who isn’t writing as well as they can get to keep it? I’d have no problem if they took it off my DS if he started being messy, it’s not a skill you lose so it’s down to a lack of effort. Surely that’s the point? Like a driving licence - if you don’t drive properly you risk losing it 🤷‍♀️ Although I agree there should be a heads up and a warning beforehand.

I was at school in times of old. I can't remember when we started using pens, but all the desks had inkwells, which were topped up by the ink monitor each morning; she was allowed to come in early to do this. We were allocated a sheet of blotting paper. During a dull lesson I would pass the time by fishing in the inkwell and excavating pencil shavings and assorted gunk.

@Pinkblueberry Some children struggle with pencil, pen requires less pressure, but their handwriting may still be messy. My DS has hyper mobility in his hands, his handwriting is legible but not great at 15. He can put in the effect and do pretty writing if needed but can't while writing at a reasonable pace and getting ideas down on paper, you know, the actual reason we write!

Sounds like an excellent way to squash your child's confidence and love of writing (& love of pens) for good. How depressing! Pen licences sound like a completely ridiculous idea.

@Pinkblueberry

Why are people surprised that they could be taken away? If children start being complacent with their handwriting, which they sometimes do then of course they would get taken away - why would someone who isn’t writing as well as they can get to keep it? I’d have no problem if they took it off my DS if he started being messy, it’s not a skill you lose so it’s down to a lack of effort. Surely that’s the point? Like a driving licence - if you don’t drive properly you risk losing it 🤷‍♀️ Although I agree there should be a heads up and a warning beforehand.

Oh no, not being complacent with handwriting!!! God forbid!

getting ideas down on paper, you know, the actual reason we write!
To be fair, there's not much point in getting it down on paper unless it's legible enough for other people to read.

Ds1 was really sad that he wasn't going to get one even though his writing was neat. I told him don't worry no matter how shit anybody's writing is they will make you write with a pen in secondary school so the pen licence is all bullshit.

I think for KS2 SATs tests they have to fill the booklet in in pencil anyway.

@Pinkblueberry what fucking difference do you think writing with a pen or pencil makes? I mark work in primary school as a volunteer. They are not allowed to use rubbers, they have to cross out words if they make a mistake so it makes no difference whatsoever.

@GreyhoundG1rl

getting ideas down on paper, you know, the actual reason we write! To be fair, there's not much point in getting it down on paper unless it's legible enough for other people to read.

What about children who have beautiful handwriting, but when they join it's all messy? Legible,but messy.

By the way, the standard for pen licences is not legible. It's a lot higher than that, and completely unattainable for some children.

This is about as absurd as it gets. How are you supposed to learn to write with a pen if you aren't allowed to have one?

Ds1 is in the bottom 2% for handwriting

We only found out after GCSE and after year 1 of college

I mean I knew it was bad....but not that bad!

@landoflostcontent

They didn't call it a pen licence "in my day" but at junior school in the 1950's we were very proud when we graduated to being able to use a pen ( can't think why as we still had inkwells and scratchy nibs) but if our writing was not up to standard the "privilege" was removed and it was back to pencils. At least it wasn't chalk and slates I'll just climb back in my rocking chair...

My dad, in the mid to late 40s, did indeed use slates.

My son took a while to get his pen licence in year 3. Then his wretched yr 4 teacher took it off him - only I didn't realise / he didn't tell me. The problem was though, he was pressing too hard, and the more he used a pencil the more he kept pressing. He needed to use a pen to solve that one. His writing in exams still isn't great, though he can do all right if he takes his time. (had him assessed over a few things when in yr 6 and they thought he'd better learn to type ... luckily he already could so I just kept encouraging him to improve his writing and he got there eventually)

And he had a pen from about year 4 !

I have just asked my Y3, and he says that the whole class use pens for handwriting practice and some of their English work.

My DC has scruffy writing and isn't able to do cursive yet either so if pens were given out on writing ability then he wouldn't get to use pen.

Come to think of it, my mother was sent to a dame school at the age of three during the war and taught copperplate from the outset. Caused problems later when they insisted she do something different age 6 or so.

@GreyhoundG1rl

getting ideas down on paper, you know, the actual reason we write! To be fair, there's not much point in getting it down on paper unless it's legible enough for other people to read.

Yes, legible, but most of the time handwriting doesn't need to be perfect. My point was that you can't expect amazing effort in all areas at the same time, usually handwriting just has to be legible, not your best, as it's what you actually write that matters.