Confused about nursery, Covid, and childcare in general! Please help

[Radial5737]

Just wondering if anyone else has experienced difficulties with finding a nursery for their LO during Covid etc? Would love to hear some supportive advice and / or experiences similar as I'm a FTM and it's all a bit scary.

Basically my lovely chilled baby has had a complete and total meltdown on the three occasions I've taken him to look around a nursery. All we've done is walk through the door and they've asked me to get him out of his buggy and he's just been in floods of years. He's generally not a tearful baby unless hungry or something definitive, so he's definitely not liking some aspect. The way he cried each time was really distressed and frightened. He's 10 months and has only ever properly met DH and I due to no support bubble. Have had a few walks with other mums recently but not much, and lots of zooms of course but no big groups.

I'm worried about him starting nursery and feel really anxious about it now. I know babies often need settling in but at the moment they won't allow mums to go in, you have to just hand the baby over at the door. This is NOT going to work for me based on how upset he's been each time we have looked around. Also I really don't like the idea of upsetting him this much and although I know it's always hard for a mum to wave goodbye to DC at nursery, this feels worse somehow.

I am incredibly fortunate in that we could afford for me to delay my return to work for a few months longer (I work for myself). Not ideal but could try. I'm thinking should I just wait until Covid is much better and after 21st June when I'll hopefully be able to go along to settling in sessions with him?

I don't want him to be disadvantaged either way. I'm worried the pandemic situation will affect his socialisation in the long run. Does anyone have a view on this? At home with us he seems a pretty content little boy and confident to explore, laughs a lot etc. It's heartbreaking to see him so distraught. Also not even be able to kiss him because of the mask.

Finally - and I'm sort of ranting now - is it just me or are nurseries quite depressing places? I live in london and have looked at 3 so far across a range of prices, all popular chains with a waiting list. They were really depressing places I felt - but I don't know if I'd feel differently if my baby wasn't crying or if times were normal. The rooms looked bleak and toys looked tatty and some of the workers looked bored. Has anyone else found this? I always assumed the nursery thing would be fine. I'm seriously questioning the whole thing now but I don't know if I'm just reacting to his response. Wondering if nanny would be a better option, but then he wouldn't have the benefit of other children.

Can anyone handhold or advise me please?

The idea of shoving my baby in that room all day is rubbish

That’s really quite disrespectful to nursery workers, who work bloody hard, for minimum wage and have worked without social distancing during a pandemic.

Ours are caring, loving, fun and make so much effort with my kids.

In fact my teenage niece would probably do a better job at looking after him and engaging him!

Maybe that’s your best option.

You’ve come across as a real snobby ignorant person

My DD has been at nursery since she was 9 months old and the only settling in session that I attended with her was only 30 mins long. I doubt it made that much difference to her settling in, ultimately, which is what I'm trying to say, because she still cried the next session once she'd realised I'd left. But almost all babies will, it's normal. She's very sensitive and intense, but she settled in very well and fairly quickly. I think around 9/10m tends to be a lot easier and quicker to settle them than 1yr+. She has always loved nursery, she's about to turn 3 and still there. Our nursery is part of a local chain, very large so rooms are large with lots of huge windows for natural light, a large outdoor playground with a separate small playground for the baby room and there is a forest school area as well. It's about £50 a day (NW). We got good, positive vibes from the place when we visited, nothing like the depressing atmosphere you're describing. We chose a nursery over childminders for a few reasons - disliked the idea of a sole person being the main carer in case they personally weren't a good fit for our DD, worried about sickness absence/holidays etc with a childminder, the nursery we picked has loads of outdoor space and a forest school programme and our DD loves to be outside, the preschool room has a more structured environment to get them ready for school and our nursery included programs like foreign language classes and visits to the care home next door (although obviously this won't have been happening during covid times!). We couldn't have afforded a nanny but I wouldn't have wanted one anyway for the same reasons as we didn't pick a childminder really.

@Onceuponatime1818

In fact my teenage niece would probably do a better job at looking after him and engaging him!

Maybe that’s your best option.

You’ve come across as a real snobby ignorant person

This.

Nursery staff work really hard, for very little money. Many nurseries are now part privatised through government funding and can now longer run because they are making a loss.

Many nursery also struggled to get qualified staff because they have left in the job in droves.

Is it because you need somewhere at quite short notice? DD’s nursery is lovely and nothing like what you say you’ve seen. The staff do a great job and definitely better than a teenage relative (and me, tbh). But I got on the waiting list at 25 weeks pregnant.

I think you need to go for a nanny.

There is no reason to think that a nanny cannot socialise your child. You don't need to choose between socialisation and home-based care. Any good nanny will do both.

No baby needs to be 'socialised' by spending 50 hours a week in a room with a load of similarly aged children. Trips to the park, playgroup, activity groups, playdates and just generally being out and about and meeting new people is the sort of socialisation they need.

I'm an early years practitioner, under 3's are my specialist subject!

I'll be honest, not all nurseries are brilliant with really little ones. I'd maybe look for a nanny or childminder personally- you could always look for a pre school/nursery school in a couple of years so they get to meet other children who would be in their cohort at school?

* The idea of shoving my baby in that room all day is rubbish*

That’s really quite disrespectful to nursery workers, who work bloody hard, for minimum wage and have worked without social distancing during a pandemic.

Ours are caring, loving, fun and make so much effort with my kids.

You’ve come across as a real snobby ignorant person

Er, sorry but did you actually read my posts?! Why on earth is it disrespectful to say I don't want to shove my baby in a room with no external windows all day??!!!! And for £100 a pop?!!!

If they are on minimum wage and they work in a private nursery business then I'm afraid that's because whomever owns the business has set those wages at the minimum wage!! This is capitalism at its worst! I run my own business and I ensure everybody at entry level is paid above the London Living Wage minimum. Nothing stopping the likes of Bright Horizons / Busy Bees etc doing the same is there?? 🤷‍♀️

It's not "snobby" to want healthy decent conditions for one's own child, and nor is it snobby to not want to be ripped off!

That was to @Onceuponatime1818 btw

Hi @Radial5737 we had the exact same dilemma as you. Ultimately for a number of reasons decided against nursery and after some further reading alluded to by the early yrs practitioners here, realised that socialisation of my one year old wasn’t actually so important at this stage. To avoid the anxiety I decided to take a career break for another year until baby is old enough for pre-school. Appreciate that’s not an option for most, especially if living somewhere expensive like London as you do. If I need to work again sooner for financial reasons, we will probably go down the nanny/nanny share route. It’s such a short period of time so make a decision that you’re comfortable with for that year or so before they move onto the next stage.

Oh @Moules thank you! That's so helpful

The facilities aren't everything. You can yearn for a beautiful scandi style all you like but it's the staff that make the nursery good or bad. A one year old does not care if toys are tatty. Outside space and light is important but if you're in London that is going to come at a premium.

Your gut feeling obviously wasn't great when you visited and it's important you listen to that and consider other options. If you can delay your return to work then maybe start getting baby a bit more used to being around other people and busy environments. It might also be worth you looking around without your baby initially as it's difficult enough to get a feel for a place without trying to reassure a distressed baby simultaneously.

I wonder tbh how much of what you’re seeing is just a London thing. Our nursery is lovely, has a big garden and access to forest so lots of outside time. We’ve also used an outside forest school and it was amazing for pre-schoolers. I guess many London nurseries just won’t have the same access to space. I wouldn’t be keen on the children being stuck in a windowless room all day either. To be honest, if you’re yearning for the scandi style experience you’ll probably have to move.If you’ve found nurseries depressing it’s worth thinking about your school options.

I would honestly keep looking. My DS must be around your one's age and he's now at nursery 3 days a week. We looked at quite a few, but there was only one we were happy with. Waiting lists are long though, we went round when I was 13 weeks pregnant to ensure I could go back to work when planned. Plus side of that, is we signed him up pre-restrictions. I couldn't go to any of the settling in sessions with him, but at least I'd already seen round properly. I also requested a 1:1 30 min discussion (outside and socially distanced) with head of baby room on day of his first settling in session to make sure they were clear about medication, feeding etc which made me feel more comfortable. One of the ones we looked at had no windows in baby room, it felt like a cellar and I immediately ruled it out. Outside space and a nice light environment was important to me.

With what his reaction was like I would definitely delay your return to work. I'm sure he will settle just fine, but I couldn't imagine handing him over at the door in these circumstances. It can help tremendously to do a long-ish settling in where you first stay with him there for say half an hour, let him see that you trust the staff and are chatty and friendly etc while he explores on the side, then leave him just for the minutes at first, etc etc. If you can wait until covid rules allow a proper settling in like this, I think this would make a huge difference. Otherwise even with a childminder surely it would be very distressing for DC to just be handed over to a stranger. I don't think I could do this to such a small child.

just for ten minutes

Also re settling in, my youngest settled in during covid restrictions but we were able to do something close to a typical settling in process by doing it outside in the garden. I would have hated just handing her over in the car park. But, I actually hope they keep drop-off and pick-up at the door. It’s worked really well and seems much calmer and easier than having a stream of parents coming in to collect.

In your position I would delay your return to work; and in that time try and get baby used to being around lots of people, as it will be very hard for those born during a lockdown/pandemic to get used to being around lots of people and very busy places as sadly they’ve not had the opportunity to be in those situations.

Lots of baby classes are restarting so going to those will be great for baby.

I have two DC, elder at nursery and younger will start in the autumn.

I think the reaction you describe is probably very normal when faced with such a different situation. I suspect your DC would have been fine once distracted with a few toys and more likely if you weren't in the room.

The depressing feel isn't one I would like though. I looked around four, all were noisy and lively and staff said hello and were engaged with the children. Yes, some things seemed a bit tatty, but children are tough on toys.

I'm a big fan of nurseries. My son's ability to interact with friends and his speech are far better than peers from our NCT group. IMHO it's worth going through the settling in process to get there. I didn't stay for any of the settling in sessions, I felt it would be harder on both of us and drag it out if I did. I think my most heart breaking session was the forth one where he cried when I picked up rather than at drop off. BUT we both got there and he loves it.

@pinguwings I think you misunderstood what I meant by Scandinavian style! I wasn't talking about "style" as in interior design!! I'm not that shallow FGS!! I meant that in Denmark for example early years care is state supported and so parents pay nothing or v little for high quality nurseries.