Stopping smoking / ADHD?

[tellmetologoffIamaMNaddict]

A few weeks ago I decided to stop vaping for various reasons but mainly because the amount I vaped had increased massively so my nicotine intake was much higher than when I had previously smoked cigarettes and I thought it might be contributing to my insomnia.

Since stopping I've found my concentration levels are completely shot and it's really worrying me. I work for myself in a job that involves concentrating on texts, a bit like copy-editing and I'm finding it much harder than usual to focus. I've also found that I'm constantly fidgeting.

A few months ago one of my clients started paying by the hour instead of by the page and for the first time I started recording how long I was spending on work. I was absolutely amazed to discover how little time each day I spend actually working and how easily distracted I am. The days when I am the most productive are when I'm working to a deadline and then I'm like a machine but on a normal work day I'm lucky if I do two hours straight.

I've started to seriously consider whether I have some form of ADHD and that nicotine was a form of self-medication. I know coming off an addictive drug will affect concentration but it's been well over a month now and there is no nicotine in my system. Shouldn't it be getting better?

I've always struggled with attention to detail and sticking to things (in my old job I often set up new systems and then completely forgot about them immediately after!) . I have always described myself as an ideas person and have lost count of the number of really great ideas I've launched (eg through volunteer work which I used to love) and then dropped (which has ultimately affected my self-worth and got me to the point that I no longer bother starting anything new). My current job has always suited me as I have deadlines I have to work to which makes me actually settle down and work!

I have a history of depression and was on anti-depressants for 10 years. I came off them last year without any difficulty at all really but now I have stopped smoking it almost feels like all my crutches have been taken away. I don't feel down or depressed (in some ways I'm more stable than I've ever been) but just very fidgety and unfocussed.

I spent the morning in prolonged interaction with three different people and had to come to bed afterwards. Since working for myself I've come to really struggle being in company for too long. I just have this strong feeling that there is something going on neurologically.

I guess my question is whether it is worth talking to the GP about this? Am I being a total hypochondriac? What is it like having ADHD? Do I fit the criteria?

I suppose the main reason I would like an assessment or a label would be to have a reason to give people for why I'm so bloody all over the place. And to be able to finally stop calling myself lazy. I've been calling myself lazy for as long as I can remember and I'd really like to stop. And I'm terrified that my work depends on my brain and my brain feels faulty. And in an ideal world I'd like to make better use of my work time and make more money. And I'm feeling such an urge to either smoke, drink or eat and I want to address these feelings in a healthy way instead.

It would be quite a revelation if I do turn out to have ADHD. I have had a life time of introspection and counselling and this never occurred to me or anyone I have seen for a second.

Sorry this isn't very clear. Any thoughts or advice would be really welcome.

bump

You sound very similar to my husband who I strongly suspect has adhd as my son has a diagnosis and they are very similar. He has struggled not to smoke and vapes instead like a crutch. He has similar business start up ideas to you too. He doesn’t think he has adhd however so has never sought a diagnosis but I went private for my son. Is this something you could consider? I think the nhs waiting list is around two years.

There's an interesting documentary about ADHD in adults on All4 at the moment, take a look and see if what you see supports your theory. There's certainly an interesting segment where nicotine use is discussed in cases of adults with ADHD - both as a potential causal factor and as a method of self-medication.

Id also advise looking at Additude online, but while you're researching adult adhd in women, don't forget to explore nicotine withdrawal symptoms as well.

You might find it useful to have some smoking cessation aids - nicotine patches or gum - to help your body adjust.

Lots of people are struggling with connotation at the moment, devices have contributed to a decline in ability to focus for lengths of time. Many adhd traits are not exclusive to the condition - im sure you aware that anxiety and depression can both affect concentration. That's not to say you should look into an adhd assessment if you think its a possibility, but part of this will be excluding other causes too so research both sides of the coin and see you feel.

You're certainly not bonkers for considering it.

Thanks so much for replying. I would consider it, yes. I looked up the process and it sounded really complicated, gathering the evidence and the like so typically I sighed and stopped reading....I think I'm going to call the doctor tomorrow anyway as, aside from anything else, I'd like to not start smoking again so something temporary to help with that would be good.

I don't know if I'm just being too self-obsessed or something.

I seem to have managed to adapt my life around my quirks and since I'm eternally single it doesn't really affect anyone else but the moment when I realised how little I was working and how much more I could be earning if I actually worked full days was a bit of a shock. It's not like I'm doing anything useful with the time I'm not working either. Just staring into space...I started doing the pomodoro method where you work for 20 minute intervals to help my productivity and found myself getting distracted with ideas and random thoughts and thinking that it must be near the end of the 20 minutes then checking and seeing I was only 3 minutes in.

Sorry, rambling. I don't feel I can be very open about this with friends and family as I fear they may think I'm being self-indulgent.

@TaraR2020

There's an interesting documentary about ADHD in adults on All4 at the moment, take a look and see if what you see supports your theory. There's certainly an interesting segment where nicotine use is discussed in cases of adults with ADHD - both as a potential causal factor and as a method of self-medication.

Id also advise looking at Additude online, but while you're researching adult adhd in women, don't forget to explore nicotine withdrawal symptoms as well.

You might find it useful to have some smoking cessation aids - nicotine patches or gum - to help your body adjust.

Lots of people are struggling with connotation at the moment, devices have contributed to a decline in ability to focus for lengths of time. Many adhd traits are not exclusive to the condition - im sure you aware that anxiety and depression can both affect concentration. That's not to say you should look into an adhd assessment if you think its a possibility, but part of this will be excluding other causes too so research both sides of the coin and see you feel.

You're certainly not bonkers for considering it.

Thank you. I'll check that out. It will be good to see if I recognise myself. Some of the things I've read really speak to me but others don't as much (e.g. I tend to be very early for appointments rather than very late (although I do often forget them!)).

I came off Facebook a year ago and have been gradually exploring ways to remove my smartphone from my life (like getting an MP3 player, leaving the phone downstairs when I go to bed etc.). That's not to say I'm not distracted by it at all but I've been working on that. I'm always looking at new systems and ways of organising my life. I heard this was also a feature.

The thing about depression and anxiety is I have suffered with both for years and this is the most stable my mood has ever been (I've found my mood over lockdown has actually been better than usual if anything - less enforced meriment suits me!). I have been keeping an evening diary (amazing commitment to routine for me!) and taking various supplements and focussing on getting a good night's sleep and all the other stuff you're supposed to do for mood. I feel generally good aside from fear that my job is changing and I need to earn money into retirement and I need to focus. And the general feeling of terror at having to reenter the workplace and learn something new because I genuinely don't think I could do it.

As you say I think the first step will be some form of nicotine replacement and see how that helps. I must admit I totally underestimated the physical effects of stopping. I thought that once the nicotine was out of my system I would feel fine.

Good luck op, I suspect it in myself so I do understand where you're coming from. There are books as well written by women with adhd which may help spread more light on it for you - and plenty of self help books about managing symptoms.

Women tend to be better at adapting their behaviours to compensate so the fact you're early for appointments isn't indicative of not having it. I'm early for appointments because I'm so aware of my tendency to be late!

I can't remember which forum but there was a really interesting thread about it here just a couple of weeks ago which also might be useful to you. Lots on YouTube as well.

I think there's a long waiting list on the NHS for assessments at the moment so if you can afford it you may wish to consider going private.

If you search, there are a couple of recent threads which are good. To repeat what I said there, get yourself a copy of Barkley's Coping with Adult ADHD.

It looks very like the For Dummies series, and is really is to dip into.

Most importantly, there's a long questionnaire at the back so you can do an informal scoring before approaching your GP. That way you have concrete evidence that it might be sensible to pursue the idea, rather than a scattered list of behaviours that you may or may not remember to take with you to the appt.

From your description, I'd say you have very good reason to explore this idea.

Thank you so much for taking time to reply. I don't feel like I can easily talk to others about this. I have tried, particularly with people who knew me as a child, and they don't think it is likely because I could "sit through double maths" and wasn't particularly disruptive. Mum said because I did well academically. Thing is, I think I could have done much better. I do think I am intelligent but I need short deadlines which really limits the kind of career you can do. And I stayed in a lowish maths stream because my brain shuts down half way through the bloody problem and forgets what it was doing. But I feel like I am being silly and they all think it is just me with another one of my crazy ideas. I felt some definite eye rolling.

Anyway, having a book to do a sort of informal self assessment before I speak to the doc would set my mind at rest. Could you confirm, is it this one?
www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1606233386/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_glt_fabc_VNXPQ4763GKBSC846RY9?tag=mumsnetforu03-21

I've been diagnosed with adhd. I gave up smoking ten years ago and have been struggling with brain functioning and depression ever since. I didn't know I had adhd at the time and it was a form of subconscious self medication. I can't take adhd meds due to the side effects so I struggle constantly now.

@bellropes

I've been diagnosed with adhd. I gave up smoking ten years ago and have been struggling with brain functioning and depression ever since. I didn't know I had adhd at the time and it was a form of subconscious self medication. I can't take adhd meds due to the side effects so I struggle constantly now.

I am really sorry to hear this. This is my thought too. It feels like more than addiction, like my mind needs the nicotine to function properly. Do you think nicotine replacement would work?

I truly truly don't want to belittle what you are going through but perhaps offer a little anecdote of my own for some perspective.

About 3 years ago I was on holiday with 6 other girls and while sunbathing was mindlessly scrolling around on my phone when I came across a list of ADHD symptoms in women. I felt quite paralysed at how many struck a chord with me. I did more research and became more and more convinced and worried (even though it is not a diagnosis to worry about).

By dinner I was feeling quite down and so opened up to my friends. All 6 of my friends hugely identified with the list of symptoms, some even more than me. And all of them seem totally 'typical' to me. We all procrastinate, all struggle to concentrate at times etc.

It may be that some of my group have ADHD, it may be that you do, it may be that I do! But the online lists aren't helpful because I am pretty sure that almost everyone identifies with a few traits. So try not to worry and speak to a professional.

As an aside, I have found after a lot of self reflection that HEAVILY restricting my phone use has made me feel much more 'normal'.

That is definitely an issue with self diagnosis, can feel a bit like horoscopes! The questionnaires don't seem very useful really. I find it hard to identify with generalisations like that. I want to answer "it depends" to everything!

A few months ago my phone broke and I deliberately didn't get it fixed for a bit and it was great. I do think modern life is causing a lot of these problems.

I don't think I would even bother investigating further if it wasn't for the fact that after years of coasting I have to try to explore new avenues for work and to make money and I am worried I just won't be able to focus. Being self-employed is so scary. And realising how little I am actually working was a real shock.

I think I will keep exploring and investigating but try not to get too obsessed. Either way I imagine that ADHD coping strategies are useful for others anyway so it won't hurt to learn about them.

Nicotine IS very helpful for ADHD. I've got ADHD and it sounds to me like you have compelling indicators.

I can recommend some podcasts for coping skills - ADHD Rewired and Hacking your ADHD are both very good. I do not medicate but there are some natural supplements that are very good, depending on which type of ADHD you have (inattentive, mixed, hyper).

I would see my GP if I were you. Your struggles and strengths (e.g. lack of ability to focus on things you aren't interested in, hyper focus on things you are interested in, and working well under deadlines (the adrenaline boosts the dopamine)) are indicators.

@NC4Todayx

Nicotine IS very helpful for ADHD. I've got ADHD and it sounds to me like you have compelling indicators.

I can recommend some podcasts for coping skills - ADHD Rewired and Hacking your ADHD are both very good. I do not medicate but there are some natural supplements that are very good, depending on which type of ADHD you have (inattentive, mixed, hyper).

I would see my GP if I were you. Your struggles and strengths (e.g. lack of ability to focus on things you aren't interested in, hyper focus on things you are interested in, and working well under deadlines (the adrenaline boosts the dopamine)) are indicators.

Thank you so much! I LOVE podcasts. I listen whilst doing boring tasks and they help me get things done! I will check those out. I am feeling more confident about approaching the GP now. What's the worst that can happen right?

From what little I have read I would say "inattentive" reflects my experience the best

Nicotine replacement is problematic because nicotine is addictive and has side effects. I got chest pain and tachycardia when I used a low dose patch to try and quit. I ended up going cold turkey.

The list of diagnostic symptoms is a problem because they can fit people who haven't got adhd. For it to be adhd there has to be significant life affecting problems that are present at all times as adhd doesn't fluctuate so you'll still experience them even if you're happy and feeling well. People with adhd tend to struggle massively at work and often chronically underachieve in education as well. You feel as though you're a fraud, are constantly exhausted through struggling to complete tasks and appear 'normal', it's not just about struggling to concentrate, get organised or clean the house.

People with adhd are often addicted to nicotine, sugar, food, coffee or illegal stimulants. When I was on methylphenidate, I was able to slow down, focus, concentrate, not feel stressed or anxious, felt slowed down and more measured in my approach to things.

I can't read a newspaper article right through, let alone a book. I can't cope with exercising for more than 10 minutes and struggle to achieve even that short amount of time. I can't fill any forms in without messing up and will drive 20 miles extra just to avoid being in a regular traffic jam.

Yes, that's the one, sorry about getting the name wrong.

As to self diagnosis being like a horoscope, well I'm not sure a checklist on insta or whatever would be especially helpful, but the back of that book has just under 100 questions, and the marking is more nuanced than yes or no, so it should be of value.

It really doesn't mean anything to worry about how you feel on one particular day, it's long term behaviours...

I also wouldn't feel depressed by the diagnosis, I find the idea that being like me should send someone into a spiral of depression quite insulting. You've already expressed the most difficult feelings I had, knowing I could've achieved so much more if I'd be diagnosed earlier, but after some difficult floods of emotion, it's been really so helpful.

It's well known that overuse of screens causes inattention in many, but that's hardly the same.

This one is really interesting to me. Just over a year ago I gave up smoking and my sleep turned to shit. I’ve probably slept 5 hours in the last three nights. My ADHD has also never been so bad. For me the two things must be correlated. I’ve no idea what would be a good way to address this though. For me, it’s not vyvanse and it’s not mirtazapine.

This is a topic close to my heart as my DD18 is awaiting assessment and the more study I do the more I realized I have probably lived with this myself without realising. I agree that the symptoms can affect many people but you need to have 6 out of 9 symptoms and not just have them but they need to be present in all areas of life( not just work or home) and need to be serious to the point where they are affecting your function daily. It sounds to me as if you meet this criteria and have missed diagnosis because you have had the inattentive type and not the hyperactive.

Thank you. I am absolutely certain I would feel liberated (and fascinated), not depressed. And I love self-help (for want of a better word) books so will order that today and do the questionnaire.

Sorry, that was a reply to @lborgia

@ABitOfAShitShow

This one is really interesting to me. Just over a year ago I gave up smoking and my sleep turned to shit. I’ve probably slept 5 hours in the last three nights. My ADHD has also never been so bad. For me the two things must be correlated. I’ve no idea what would be a good way to address this though. For me, it’s not vyvanse and it’s not mirtazapine.

It is somewhat validating to hear that my theory may have some validity. I have to resist the temptation to use it as an excuse to smoke!

@vdbfamily

This is a topic close to my heart as my DD18 is awaiting assessment and the more study I do the more I realized I have probably lived with this myself without realising. I agree that the symptoms can affect many people but you need to have 6 out of 9 symptoms and not just have them but they need to be present in all areas of life( not just work or home) and need to be serious to the point where they are affecting your function daily. It sounds to me as if you meet this criteria and have missed diagnosis because you have had the inattentive type and not the hyperactive.

Thank you. The only thing that is dissuading me a little is when I asked my friends who have known me since childhood them seemed quite dismissive. But then they work in special needs and similar and I think probably associate ADHD with quite severely disruptive kids

Ok so I wanted to report back here because I posted previously saying that my insomnia coincided with me stopping smoking 1.5 years ago. I’m having a bit of a tough time and I’ve been smoking again for a couple of weeks…and I can sleep. For me they are definitely linked. I need to stop again this weekend for obvious reasons but I wonder what I can do in its place if it’s an ADHD/dopamine thing. I’ll report back once I’ve stopped again for a bit.