Business logo from agency awful

[tigerbreadandtea]

Can someone help me word this...

I am in the process of setting up my own business and found a small agency I was happy with to make my website. As part of what I paid I was offered a free logo.

The logo has come back twice now and is just awful. So dated and old fashioned and the designer clearly isn't listening to my brief.

I can't set my social media channels up without my logo and I feel it's slowing down progress so over the weekend I had a look online and found someone who has nailed what I'm after first time on fiver. He said it was easy because I'd been so clear about my brand, audience and vision, so I don't feel it's due to me not providing enough info.

I'm now feeling that this has been a very poor first impression and I'm worried about my website not being what I want.

Thinking of ringing or calling them but don't want to slag off their designer.

You are paying them to make something for you based on specific requests and and they have not produced something that fits the brief.

Phone them and tell them. It’s not slagging off the designer, it’s informing them that you are not satisfied they have captured what you wanted for your log and can they come up with something that does.

Well the thing is I don't even want their designer to continue, I am really happy with the one that's been designed for me over the weekend by someone who is clearly a professional designer. They sent me three and all of them were miles better. I think I'm just feeling a bit annoyed that they offer a logo as part of the package and it's clearly someone very amateur.

Have you paid them? What does your contract say? You can end a business relationship if you're not happy with the output - and this would definitely make me nervous that your website wouldn't be all you hoped.

In that case be completely truthful as constructive criticism is understandable in this situation.

I would just say that upon receiving the finished logo you feel that the companies vision and your own dont align and that you feel it would be best for your business to cancle the website design and end the relationship. If they cant do a basic logo then I would also have serious reservations about their ability to build the site to your liking.

I would ask for a progress update on the website and could they share some visuals, as you’re concerned that perhaps your brief hasn’t been clear enough* as evidenced by the logo not matching expectations.

• I’m not suggesting you haven’t been clear, but just as a way to soften the blow if you know what I mean.

You simply tell them that you were very disappointed wth the free logo they offered and have arranged with another designer. You will send it along as soon as it is done, to be added to your website.

My website and SM were built around something my website designer and I muddled up between us as a place holder. As soon as I could afford to get a professional one done I did and it took about 5 minutes to drop it in place.

You'll have to pay for their time anyway, the website that is. And if it does what you want it to then it is pointless throwing that away for a logo that you already have sorted.

You have to be more pragmatic than that!

Many web designers are not graphic designers - they are techies. I actually find it difficult to get both in one place unless it’s a graphic/digital design agency, and they tend not to come cheap. You could possibly ask the designer you have found to liaise with the web person and produce some visuals/brand assets as guidance - I’ve done this very successfully, but it needs careful handling!

As I understand it, it's not the same person doing the website that has produced the awful logo.

I would echo @blackcatsrule88 and ask to see some website visuals. I wouldn't say it was because you were worried about not being clear in the brief, but that you were concerned that the style of the free logo is representative of the website and it's not what you are looking for.

I think softening the blow will actually mean you either have to do repeated go-backs (and cost you time) to get what you actually want. Or you'll end up compromising for something a bit shit.

Tbh running a business means you have to stop worrying so much about asking difficult stuff. Your business success (and potentially therefore keeping yourself financially afloat) relies on this stuff. How dare they not deliver what you asked for?

How dare they not deliver what you asked for? That won't get you very far! They delivered, OP didn't like it. Logos are wholly subjective, like any other visual offering.

Having been in business for quite some time be wary of "free" services - they are invariably shit.

I have always had to hire designers in addition to web developers as no companies can do both well. DO NOT leave web design to the company developing it. Produce what you want and get them to code it.

You absolutely 100% do not need to have a logo yet to set up your social media channels. Depending on what your business is, for your profile image use a professional looking photograph of yourself, a product image, or a free to use stock image from e.g. Unsplash, and substitute in your logo whenever you have one that you are happy with.

"As part of what I paid I was offered a free logo."

I'm not really clear if you paid for the logo or if it was free, based on this wording. If it was free, then cut your losses and go to the designer of your choice. Regardless of if it's free or not, it is very normal to liaise with a designer and give feedback about their concepts. Be sure that you are briefing clearly, which it sounds like you are doing. I worked in marketing for 22 years before going self employed and I will say that the creative agencies who were very wildly out 1st and 2nd attempt at logo design, never did get it anywhere near right, so if it were me I would fairly quickly ditch the idea of getting a logo from your website designers.

Have you paid the person on Fivver yet? If you don't and instead take their concept to your web design agency you could be in real trouble for stealing their IP.

The old adage Fast/Cheap/Good, you may pick only two, really does apply to logo design. I'm concerned that you are perhaps just not getting a proper graphic designer as part of your web design package (the two things are separate skills) and I've also got red flags going off at the fivver designer - some of the people on fivver are professionals, but many of them won't actually be designing you your own logo but pulling from their generic stock, and you may never properly own your logo design and files, so proceed with caution and due dilligence. Be sure that whoever is designing it they are giving all rights to the artwork to you, and that you get high res image files to keep of all versions of it, including without a background.

Just my thoughts on a Monday morning.

When I set up my last business I did the whole going keenly to a designer to get a logo thing that 99.9999% of new business owners do. I feel lucky that the designer I went to was a good what I would call "proper" designer (one skilled and experienced in logo creation) and she talked through what I wanted it for and persuaded me that I didn't need a logo just yet. I did social media & website without one, and when I thought honestly about it I didn't actually need business stationery (business cards, leaflets, letterheads etc) just yet, and/or could have them without a logo. When I did, I had been operating a while and was better able to afford the £500-700 odd that it cost to get it done properly.

I've retired that business and am starting a new totally different venture now. I've got website & social media up and running and am busy with a whole load of word of mouth referrals. I don't really need a logo yet, although I'm itching to get it done - I think that's just part of the excitement of having a new business! I have a slightly different marketing plan this time that when I have time to execute it would benefit from a logo sooner than I needed one last time. Having said that I'm actually very happy with the growth of my business purely through word of mouth referrals right now, and what's much more important to me than a logo is getting my website properly running with a scheduler and payment-taker so I'm not doing the admin on those things myself which will make me very happy

I have another business, which I still don't have a logo for after 15 years successfully operating. I have just never needed one.

Hope that is helpful.

Thank you all. Some good advice here beyond just saying "I don't like it".

I obviously looked at sample websites before deciding to use them and I had liked what was in their portfolio. Just seems like they are using someone amateur for logos.

Produce what you want and get them to code it. That! Works out far better as you know your business best. My web designer was more than happy to discuss layout, functionality, etc and then to take what I supplied and make it work. She hosts it and makes minor modifications as part of the hosting package. So a colour tweak, a correction if I modify something that goes awry, or I forget how, anything that takes more than 5 minutes she bills for, which seems fair to me.

It's a working relationship and we now both have a better idea of what we both expect.

If the logo was free, are you happy to just let it go, or do you want them to compensate you for having it done elsewhere?

If the former, I'd adapt what BlackCat has said... ask for some visuals or mock-ups of the website, and explain that you're concerned because the logo didn't match your brief or business, and therefore you've had to have that created elsewhere.

If they're making a website for you, they should be updating you pretty regularly with mock-ups anyway, that's just good practice.

I'd also offer the same caveat as everyone else - are they designing and developing the site? It's rare to find someone who is good at both unless they're using quite templated sites, in which case you should be able to see functioning versions of what you're going to end up with.

@CuriousaboutSamphire

How dare they not deliver what you asked for? That won't get you very far! They delivered, OP didn't like it. Logos are wholly subjective, like any other visual offering.

This!

Also, somewhere else in the world wide web right now a designer is bitching about the fact that the client wasn't clear in their brief and won't listen to the expertise of a designer

@BillyTodd that's all really helpful.

I completely agree that if someone doesn't get it after a couple of attempts, as in, nowhere near your vision, it's best to walk away. It's just so dated and basically everything I don't want in a logo I am not really looking for compensation it's more as some of you have summed up - the worry about ability to produce a website in line with what I want if they can't get the logo right.
Regarding the money, they sent me a quote for the website and then had included optional extras, one of which was a logo. To be honest I was sceptical as like you say, you get what you pay for, but thought as it was "free" I'd see what they came up with. They only asked me a few basic questions about colours etc before coming up with the terrible logo, whereas I'd expect a proper designer to ask a lot of questions! I will check with the fiver designer (who does seem legit) about rights, thank you.

@CuriousaboutSamphire

Produce what you want and get them to code it. That! Works out far better as you know your business best. My web designer was more than happy to discuss layout, functionality, etc and then to take what I supplied and make it work. She hosts it and makes minor modifications as part of the hosting package. So a colour tweak, a correction if I modify something that goes awry, or I forget how, anything that takes more than 5 minutes she bills for, which seems fair to me.

It's a working relationship and we now both have a better idea of what we both expect.

Sorry, how would I produce what I want? Do you mean content?

Yes. And functionality. What do you want it to do? What have you seen that you like on other sites? Which bits are needed, which are wanted? What is absolutely essential right now? What will you grow into?

If you don't know you can't properly evaluate what you are being offered. And once you know what you want, have taken in board their advice for the bits that are just too techy, you can not only provide the content you can tell them how it should look and work. Then leave them to do what they do best, make it work.

Unfortunately you get what you pay for. How much did you pay for the website and how long have they been working on it? They should definitely be showing you mock-ups and layouts to be approved before they write a single line of code. As pp said, visual design and programming are very different skills, most people aren’t adept at both which is why agencies employ design people and tech people who have different roles. And there’s a world of difference between an adequate designer and a good designer, as you have discovered! A basic professional website should cost in the region of £5k.

Nobody ever believes that though @Ariannah

They don't see the value, the hours, the experience, the equipment neeed, and, as OP is finding out, the mismatch between expectations and delivery can be high. But that's no one 'sides' fault.