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Why is the English language so weird?

50 replies

Soubriquet · 25/04/2021 09:48

I mean.. cough and rough are spelled almost the the same and yet not pronounced the same at all

Same to womb, tomb and then bomb..

We say double-yew for W but don’t say double-enn for M.

Why?

Why is it 1 goose, 3 geese, but 1 moose and 3 mooses?

We say an umbrella..but we say a unicorn not an.

We get in a car but on a bus.

There are obviously a lot more examples but come on! English is just weird right?

OP posts:
Andante57 · 25/04/2021 10:25

Chuffed means:-

Delighted. Pleased. Satisfied
But it also means
Annoyed. Displeased. Disgruntled

I’ve only ever heard it to mean delighted, pleased, satisfied.

Userguaranteed · 25/04/2021 10:31

Goat/Goats
Sheep/Sheep

Table/Tables
Furniture/Furniture

Some who teaches = Teacher
Someone who cooks = Cooker Cook

tinkerbellvspredator · 25/04/2021 10:32

We have some authors who make up words, eg David Walliams, Lewis Carroll, Shakespeare. Does this playing with language happen in writing of other languages?

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MayYouLiveInInterestingTimes · 25/04/2021 11:01

The simple word ‘nice’ is a good one to look up for changes of meaning. There’s a theory I have a hazy awareness of - someone’ll have more details somewhere - about how the core vocabulary, based on practical needs, doesn’t change much through time. Ancient languages have been reconstructed from sounds that have remained the same across related groups. Adjectives and adverbs might change more quickly than ‘mum’ and ‘dad’ and ‘children’: oxen were of course vital to early economies.

Wabe · 25/04/2021 11:09

Can I be the one to add the ‘creative respelling’ of fish as ‘ghoti’? (Attributed to George Bernard Shaw but not his.)

The ‘Gh’ sound from ‘enough’ or ‘cough’
‘O’ from ‘women’
‘Ti’ from ‘station’ or ‘patience’.

Miljea · 25/04/2021 11:12

It's fascinating, isn't it?

I'd hate to have to learn English as a second language!

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 25/04/2021 11:20

At least some of those words would have been pronounced differently many years ago.

E.g ‘Night’ would have had the gh pronounced, like in German ‘nacht’.

Ditto the k in e.g. knight and knave (German Knabe)

Ditto to Bill Bryson’s Mother Tongue - a super-interesting read for anyone.

thevassal · 25/04/2021 11:40

As others have said - double u is actually double v - in French it is produced "u, vay, double-vay" - originally latin only had v and w came much later. However latin included m and n as distinct letters.

Do you speak any other languages OP? Only because all language have weird aspects - welsh has mutations for no reason anyone has ever been able to explain clearly to me!, lots of European languages assign gender to every single noun, which is, objectively, a bit bizarre when you examine it, latin the word order could be all over the place but the meaning will come from the declension, Japanese doesn't distinguish between singular and plural words, German is very very literal....basque has no links to any other language.... basically there are weird and irregular parts to most languages.

This might be exacerbated by the sheer size of English (the largest vocabulary of any lanaguae) so there are going to be more inconsistencies, plus the fact that it was, and is, a lingua franca for so long so is influenced by so many other languages.

Andante57 · 25/04/2021 12:11

My son who worked as an interpreter in S America said one of the problems for those learning English are (I think he said) prepositional verbs - (not sure if that’s right description) but anyway:

Pull over/on/up/in
Take in/over/on/away/to
Hold on/up/in/over

lonel · 25/04/2021 12:58

Does this playing with language happen in writing of other languages?
Yes, of course!

I'd hate to have to learn English as a second language!
It is pretty easy to learn. The grammar is quite straightforward and millions of people have learnt it as a second language and are fluent. Many languages are a lot harder!

BrownOwlknowsbest · 25/04/2021 12:59

I always have chuckle over this poem.

We’ll begin with a box, and the plural is boxes,
But the plural of ox should be oxen, not oxes.
Then one fowl is a goose, but two are called geese,
Yet the plural of mouse should never be meese,
You may find a lone mouse or a whole nest of mice,
But the plural of house is houses, not hice.

If the plural of man is always called men,
Why shouldn’t the plural of pan be called pen?
The cow in the plural may be cows or kine,
But a bow if repeated is never called bine,
And the plural of vow is vows, never vine.

If I speak of a foot and you show me your feet,
And I give you a boot would a pair be called beet?
If one is a tooth, and a whole set are teeth,
Why shouldn’t the plural of booth be called beeth?

If the singular’s this and the plural is these,
Should the plural of kiss ever be nicknamed keese?
Then one may be that and three would be those,
Yet hat in the plural would never be hose,
And the plural of cat is cats, not cose.

We speak of a brother, and also of brethren,
But though we say mother, we never say methren,
Then the masculine pronouns are he, his and him,
But imagine the feminine she, shis and shim,

So the English, I think, you all will agree,
Is the queerest language you ever did see.

Userguaranteed · 25/04/2021 13:01

^ Yes! I was thinking of that but couldn't remember!

Userguaranteed · 25/04/2021 13:03

Don't forget toothbrush, not teethbrush. Guess it's for a tooth only.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 25/04/2021 14:44

How to spell potato, for you @Wabe.

Why is the English language so weird?
Lessthanaballpark · 25/04/2021 14:54

But once you get away from the craziness of the spelling and the vocabulary, the grammar itself is quite easy.

I mean, it has no grammatical gender. It has one word for “the” unless German which has, I think, 16. That’s a headache!

Wabe · 25/04/2021 15:02

@SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius

How to spell potato, for you *@Wabe*.
I am adopting this spelling from this moment on. Grin
Doingtheboxerbeat · 25/04/2021 16:14

This one :
Extract and extract - the stress at the beginning of the word is a verb but the stress at the end is a noun.
Contract and contract .

I find that fascinating .

Doingtheboxerbeat · 25/04/2021 16:16

It would have been easier i I know how to bold Hmm.

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 25/04/2021 16:53

It’s OK - I pronounced them differently in my head when I read them, @Doingtheboxerbeat.

Doingtheboxerbeat · 25/04/2021 16:58

@SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius As soon as I posted ,i realised I could have used capitals 🤦‍♀️.

mizu · 25/04/2021 17:04

GrinI've been teaching English to foreign students for 26 years now and it's still an absolute joy.

We have rules - just a lot of exceptions too Smile

ThinkAboutItTomorrow · 25/04/2021 21:58

20 odd years ago Wicked meant evil and very quickly started to mean brilliant.

I can see how easily things develop confusing meanings.

Pleasing that our forebears were basically annoying teens where language evolution is concerned.

ThinkAboutItTomorrow · 25/04/2021 22:08

To the point of learning English as a second language, I remember in our very multinational team the bosses pushed this whole thing about 'pastoral care'. They obviously meant just being nice and caring for teams but our non English colleagues googled 'pastoral' and thought we were on some weird Christian kick trying to convert them!

BoattoBolivia · 25/04/2021 22:13

This is a really readable book that explains all of the reasons for English spelling.www.<a class="break-all" href="https://amazon.co.uk/Spell-Out-singular-English-spelling/dp/1846685680?tag=mumsnet&ascsubtag=mnforum--chat-4228060-Why-is-the-English-language-so-weird" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">amazon.co.uk/Spell-Out-singular-English-spelling/dp/1846685680

Brahumbug · 25/04/2021 22:30

English has lots if rules and word orders, native speakers dont tend to notice them. All other languages have foreign influences, every bit as much as English. People often think of German, French etc as pure, but they are not and it is obvious if you speak them. A good example of a rule in English is that governing adjectives, they are always ranked in this order: opinion, size, age, shape, colour, origin, material, purpose.

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