London, 2 kids - do we need a car?

[Tier500]

We live in east London (zone 3) and recently had our second child. We don’t have a car and haven’t needed one so far as we just used public transport and taxis. With covid and baby 2 we’ve been wondering if we should buy a car or just hire one, for holidays and day trips mainly but possibly also more regular journeys now public transport is less attractive thanks to covid. I haven’t been on a bus or train since March and feeling a bit claustrophobic now! Then again also worried about the expense and environmental impact of car ownership.

For people in similar positions - do you find it useful day to day? Does it become more or less useful as the kids get older?

No, you can do without, unless
a) one of them takes up a hobby that requires moving oodles of stuff or going to one of the rare places that you can't t easily reach in public transport
b) you want to be the person who gives lifts to the whole team (we did this for a while, I'm not knocking it)

Hire or use some sort of car share scheme when you really need to drive. Don't bother buying until it's several days a week

Just moved from London with 2 and more or less walked everywhere, sometimes realised I hadn't used the car for a couple of weeks. However, that was pre-covid, I think if I was in London now I would be using it a lot more sadly. We definitely used ours more as the children got older. However, the bigger question is can you afford to run one? Would it improve your life getting out of London in it once lockdowns lift to visit friends/family?

Is there a Zipcar near you? May be worth seeing if will work out cheaper? I didn't need a car in London until I had to have one for my job. Once I did there was no going back. So in a bizarre way it is best putting it off until no way around it as it makes you lazy to manage without iyswim.

@sosotired1 yes we would primarily use it for trips to see family up north and for holidays. We used to go abroad but with little ones I think our holidays will be UK based for the foreseeable (covid or not!). We could always hire one though for that. I’m not a confident driver (as haven’t needed to drive for the last 10 years) so was wondering if having our own would help but just not sure it’s necessary.

I live zone 2 and haven’t had car for years until after first lockdown. Basically widowed parents and in laws that didn’t live in London who needed some support and we could never book a zip car easily. We did some train journeys to them but it felt so dangerous with covid as trains packed, and the chin and nose waggling maskers etc. Always needed several days notice for a zip car and a trek to pick them up, which is new. We had some on our road and they were never there. Also I felt we had to keep wiping them down as clearly heavily used. What use to be easy became a mission. We don’t use our car so much and walk most places but it has given us an option. If it weren’t for the widowed mums I probably wouldn’t have got one. Why don’t you see how it goes.

We are in London and only use our cars when we are travelling out of London. It's a big waste of money but my OH loves cars. Before I met him I used to just use a local Zip car if I needed to drive. Much easier. We spend 100s per month just to park 2 cars we don't need.

I’m also zone 3 east london. Only hire cars for holidays. I do still get taxis if need to get large amount of shopping home (like when it was impossible to get online groceries). My kids are now a bit older, and we all have bikes which has massively improved our lockdown experience. If I had toddlers again I’d get a bike seat. I like not having to worry about car being damaged or broken in to (Just worry about the bikes!) But I don’t have family nearby to visit.

No. I live in zone 2 and didn’t have a car - 3 DC.

You could get an electric cargo bike which would increase the distance you could travel with the DCs. I think I would get bored of going to same places within walking distance, and I understand your reluctance to use public transport. I'd use the cargo bike day-to-day and then just hire a car as and when needed for trips.

If you owned one, would you have anywhere to park it?

I worked out I could get 5 taxis per week in my city for the same money as the average cost of car ownership.

I'm zone 2 and bought a car to work on my driving competence. Driving in London is becoming increasingly restricted as local authorities and TFL try to extract as much money as they can out of motorists. Pre-Covid I would drive mostly up north or on trips and use buses/walk to get around London. I'm definitely using the car more now as buses don't feel safe.
I recognise it's a privileged position to be in and I am contributing to pollution/congestion. I did try to buy a low emissions car and this has benefited me now the ULEZ is in place.

I rarely use car but LOVE having
Uses are
Some long road trips
Supermarkets , especially now I’m trying one large shop
Football when it’s running (critical)
The odd school run
The odd office trip (to sign contracts )

I do have a driveway
And most in west London is resident permit central

Could you afford an electronic car to assuage your conscience

We have a car (and two stations and multiple bus routes), and the car gets used twice a week so not really worth it. But there isn’t any way to do those two trips by public transport in less than an hour, and you need to leave 1.5 hours to be sure, while they take 30 mins in the car. And they’re for activities the kids love and have done for years.

We’ve considered hiring but the need to lug heavy car seats to the hire car was an issue when they were younger - you need to have two adults so you can’t ever take them out by yourself. And now the issue is that on-road, by the hour hire cars tend to be busy at the times we want them - Saturday afternoons and Sunday mornings.

So I’d say it’s an expensive luxury, but for us it’s worth it for now. Probably not once the kids leave home, though.

We have one - we bought when I used to have to commute out of London in it. It is convenient, but we could manage without. It's getting used very little at the moment and in general we take public transport or walk for knocking around the area and it's saved for skip runs, big shops and going to inaccessible places, of which there are a number in zone 4. It's a hybrid.

A surprising and growing number of people transport their kids around the area in a cargo bike, perhaps with electric assist, which is great although vulnerable to theft.

Zone 2, dog and baby
We’ve been through periods of owning a car and being carless. My divorced parents live in different parts of the UK and trains easy but expensive to one of them but awful to the other. I would say when we’ve owned a car it’s easier to be spontaneous and trips out of town can happen when needed.
We’ve also found it easy enough to rent cars, use car clubs etc in normal times. We currently share a car with a friend, bought after first lockdown as rental prices were through the roof and uncertainties about regulations etc meant advanced planning harder. We never use it in day-to-day life but it has been good for (non-lockdown) driving time different areas for walks.

Should add one of the reasons for buying car is both friend and I have parents over 70 with underlying health conditions so didn’t want to travel on public transport to visit.

Sorry it scattered
Cost of insurance, parking, maintenance etc was (pre-covid) about the same per year as hiring a car for 2 longer trips (1 wk) and 3-4 weekend trips. That obviously doesn’t include cost of car itself.

We have a car that sits in the driveway most days but I wouldn’t want to go without it.

Shopping - I hate online shopping so the boot is full with a full weeks shop.

DD’s hobbies are not in walking distance and for one we would have to change busses twice and still walk a decent stretch. The other one would be impossible to get to at all.

I like being spontaneous (well pre-lockdown) and we would go out and drive somewhere Sunday morning or Saturday afternoon without worrying about a hire car/car share.

I am not a good driver and would be terrified about damaging a car which is not mine.

I hate being the one who always get a lift without being able to give back the favour.

I hate public transport as I used it for commuting and found it too expensive and too restrictive.

Do a cost up of owning vs hire.

But don’t forgot the cost of fixing the thing as well as running it

Live on zone 3/4 border. I really need a car...I lived without one and it was a real pain.

My ds plays football and I often need to drive out to a random field in Kent for matches! Plus training twice a week. Ten minute drive to training ground or 45 minutes by bus.

Oh and for shopping, can't get any delivery slots at the moment for food shopping

My eco brother and SIL in London just bought one now they have two kids. COVID concerns with baby, and the car club wasn’t working with two big car seats. I think there’s a really tough time when you need the toddler car seats and can’t carry them to the car club car.

They plan to go back to the car club once both kids are in boosters.

Z3 and have always had a car as grew up here. Hardly ever drive into London anymore because it's a pain in the arse but frequently (non covid) would drive to friends in outer zones & for day trips. I also sometimes drive to work as it's much faster due to work not being near much public transport.

Used to love driving into town on a Sunday though as it was quick & easy to get parking.

Thanks for the replies! Yes the car seats are the real issue at the moment and stops us getting taxis except for short journeys. The baby’s seat can clip on to the pram but the toddler one obviously can’t and is massive so not practical to take it.

We have on street parking for one car and there is a space outside our house so that would be fine. Cargo bike is interesting idea. We have a bike seat for our toddler and used it loads before the baby was born, but she’s too small for a seat at the moment.

There are no car clubs in our borough but zip car is possible. I will weigh up the costs and keep thinking.

You can set up a cargo bike so you can securely fit an infant car seat in there, or you can get a baby/toddler seat for it.

You could get one via a cycle to work scheme too (to save money) as the scheme is not just for commuter bikes.

We lived in z2 children grown up now. I found a car essential as dc ended up at different schools in opposite directions and not on good bus routes. Rugby/cricket practice 2/÷ miles away, away games up to 30 miles away. Music lessons, etc. Picking up one after an after school activity at 6 and the other at 6.20. Notwithstanding supermarket shopping and then uni drops and pick-ups. Boot needed to get ever bigger. In London I had an MPV bought at 1w to 18 months old and run for 10 years to minimise costs.