DC struggling at school - dyslexia??

[LostAcre]

We’ve had concerns about DS1’s English work for a while. He’s in Year 5 now.

He’s always found writing difficult. It’s never been in the normal range for his age.
His teacher has said that she struggles to read it, and DS1 can’t always read it either if he’s asked to read it out loud. He made me and DH a Christmas card at school, and he’d written the first letter in his name backwards.
I’ve attached a picture of his letter to Santa this year as an example of his handwriting.

His spelling is bad. He has difficulty retaining correct spellings, even for words typically found in the Year 1 / 2 spelling lists on Spelling Frame (spelling website his school subscribes to). Most of the time when he misspells words, he’s spelling them in a phonetically plausible way.

He’s generally happy enough to read, if it’s a subject he finds engaging, but I’ve noticed that if he’s reading out loud and he comes to an unfamiliar word, he tends to slur over the word, or make a guess based on the first syllable rather than trying to sound the word out. But generally, his reading has been at a normal level for his age, so I’ve not worried too much about his reading. Until recently.

The new problem that his teacher has raised is about joined up writing. (Not about DS1 doing this himself, she’s said that he’s not ready for that)
The school policy is for the teachers to use joined up writing on the board in Y5, and DS1 can’t read it.
She’s sent home sheets with examples of joined up writing, I’ve used handwriting fonts on Word to write short things for him to try reading, but whenever he looks at anything that’s joined up writing, rather than printed writing, he just stares blankly and says he can’t read it. Not even when it’s his name in the joined up writing. I’m concerned that this will be a problem going forward.

I’ve asked the teacher a few times this year if they think there might be something like dyslexia going on with DS1, but every time she’s just said that she’ll talk to the school SEN lead, and I’ve never heard anything back about that.

His eyesight was fine at his last eye test (but he’s overdue for one thanks to COVID). And he has ASD, but I’m not sure if that’s relevant to his reading / writing / spelling problems.

So, I’m worried, but I’m not sure how worried I should be. Does it sound like it might be dyslexia? And if so, what’s the best way forward?

I think it's highly possible he has dyslexia and maybe dyspraxia.
I would contact the Sendco and also your gp.

I'm in Scotland so not sure was year 5 is for comparison but my son is 7 next month. He is dyspraxic and dyslexic. We got a referral to OT in P1. He has really long muscles in his joints too which don't help his co-ordination. I'd definitely ask for a referral. It was quite a long process. He has some writing aids, like a tilted board etc but it's finding what works. There are lots of visual impairments. My son cannot copy anything of the board. His brain just flips and he needs words spelt out for example. He has been offered a laptop but I'm keen to keep him trying while he can. Not sure if I can attach a picture but this came home today. He still can't write his name forwards

Be prepared to have to pay for a private assessment

If school identifies a need they have a legal duty to meet it. In my experience they'll be very unlikely to want to assess.

My son has dysgraphia, which is a type of writing difficulty. I think it is often considered under the dyslexia banner. When I first suspected there was a problem, I researched dyslexia, but this didn't quite describe by DS, but when I came across dysgraphia, it fit him to a t.

He does have dyslexia and suspected dyspraxia. His dyslexia assessor said that that SENs can overlap so it's not uncommon to have more than one type of difficulty.

We were lucky in that once I discussed my concerns with the school, they arranged for him to see the Educational Psychologist quickly. We only got a brief report, but paid for a more in-depth assessment with a dyslexia assessor for £500 and they provided a more detailed overview of his difficulties. The outcome is that he really struggles with writing and should use a laptop.

Arrange a meeting with the schools SENCO directly. If that doesn't work, consider a private assessment for him. I know it's expensive, I have found ours to be really helpful.

@TowandaForever

Can you expand on that please!

Op don't wait any longer I can't believe he has got this far with no further investigation needed... The SENCO should be coming to to, triggered by a teacher concerns..

DS has dyslexia, dyspraxia and ASD.
His writing is barely legible, and slow. He is begining to form his name accurately.

TBH diagnosis is not befòre y3 anyway (plus losing half of y4). DS was screaming dyslexia right from learning (or not) to read. School did at least recognise that there were dyslexua tendencies and didn't wait for diagnosis.to arrange interventions.

In a way we were lucky to get the dyspraxia diagnosis before ASD. They often accompany each other, but ASD being first tends to quel the appetite to make further investigations.
It's a tough combination as DS is naturally perfectionist, and the practical difficulties of dyslexia and dyspraxia are not easy without a rigid vision of perfection...

We had to pay £300 for the assessment. DS now does extended writing on a laptop where he has a quicker processing speed compared to writing and can edit and produce something legible with far less effort. It did take pushing though. If I hadn't pushed, DS would still be a floundering, frustrated child without any diagnoses (school certainly wouldn't see ASD through the nasking)

Try a behavioural ophthalmologist if you can find one. You may want to have visual processing issues investigated. These are not looked into in normal sight tests, as the sight is fine it’s the processing of the images that is an issue.
In the US I believe that both this and auditory processing disorder are linked to ASD, where we tend to align them to dyslexia.
DS has both. We have found support to be invaluable (although have had to pay for most of it).

Ds was diagosed with dyslexia when he was 17, and part of the reason it was quite late is that his reading age was always 3+ years ahead of his chronological age. He was also borderline dyspraxic- just on the low end of "normal" .
Spellings were always a problem, and his handwriting was poor and it took ages for him to learn to tie his shoelaces. He was about 8 or 9 when he was supposed to be doing a programme (possibly called Speed up) with a OT to improve his handwriting, but she went on Mat Leave and didn't return so it didn't happen. He was finally diagosed with dyslexia when one of the teachers commented that he seemed to find writing difficult and he was slow at taking notes.
OP it might be worth getting an ED Pysch assessment, but you might have to pay for one privately.
As someone above suggested it might be worth also getting an assessment by a specialist ophthalmolgist- this was recommended by the Ed Pysch and again she identified the way his eyes moved when reading caused him to skip words, re-read etc. She gave him excercises as well. she tried coloured films with him which made no difference, but when he was assessed for support for University he found the yellow computer background made a huge difference. His employer has now purchased the programme for work.

This is all helpful, thanks. (And for the Scottish poster, Year 5 is 9 - 10 yr olds. DS1 is 9)

I’ll try pushing this again with the school after the Christmas holidays finish. Hopefully the lack of response from the school so far is about busy teachers rather than the school not wanting to assess this sort of thing.

For the people who have had their DC’s dyslexia diagnosed via a private ed psych assessments, have the schools accepted the diagnosis if it’s made after an assessment you’ve paid for yourselves? Just I know some people who’ve had schools etc being sceptical about ASD diagnosis’s that were done privately rather than via the NHS.

I have dyslexia and it wasn't assessed until I was 17 at college formally as I cooed and was top set.
Please get a private assessment.
Are the books etc printed on bright white paper? It's a nightmare if your dyslexic and very hard to read from. Colour filters really helped me but everyone's different. An assessment should point to which type of aids help your child

As a point of reasuranse, I have an excellent degree and an professional job. So with correct help it really isn't a barrier to life. Good luck x

The dyslexia institute website is good and helpful with tips and links to assessment advice

My Ds also has dyslexia and dysgraphia, he now has an Ed physch report and has extra time in exams as well as use of a lap top for all written work. I got him privately diagnosed and it was recognised by the school (at the time he was in a state primary).
How is his maths and general understanding of subjects? I ask as dyslexics aften get overlooked as they are bright and understand the work but have difficulty processing it. In a class of 30 they can get easily overlooked as they might not 'struggle' the way some other children do. This doesn't mean they don't need the support for them to reach their full potential though! Unfortunately most state schools are massively underfunded and paying for a child's Ed physch report is not something that is offered freely unless that child is very far behind. If you live in South east I can dm the details of the Ed physch we used who is excellent. Good luck with it!

Maths isn’t great either. He’s struggling to retain his times tables, and still counts on his fingers.
Maths topics other than times tables, he tends to panic when faced with a sheet of questions, there tends to be lots of shouting and crying about how he “doesn’t know what to do”.
Ironically, once he’s calmed down enough for me to explain the task, he usually manages most of the maths questions quite well.

His teacher said at parents evening that he’s doing quite well in Science and Art.

What you are describing are issues with working memory, sequencing, processing, spatial awareness perhaps which are common traits of several Specific Learning Difficulties. Handwriting suggests fine motor skills may also be problematic, is that evident in other activities like dressing, puzzles/Lego? What intervention has he had until now. Does he have a writing slope, visual prompts to keep him focussed, sit at front or similar? By year 5 he may have already got into a mindset that others are better and he feels effort is not worthwhile so an assessment to identify strengths and weaknesses could be reassuring as well as helpful in suggesting strategies and support.

I too would agree with the idea of getting a private assessment. The school are very remiss to have noted a problem but not got formal assessments done by specialist.

Just to give you heart, I have a DD who is dyslexic and she has an MA!! Lots of hard work involved and guidance, but she got there and now has a very good job in events organisation.

DD's secondary (private if that matters) accepted her private diagnosis and put lots of measures in place to help her.

There are multiple conditions like dyslexia, dysgraphia, ADHD, ADD, ASD, which can have a link. That doesn’t mean that a child will have all of them. A specific learning difficulty can be part of a global learning difficulty or can present in a child who is very able in other areas. Some children and young people mask their difficulties well and find strategies on their own to manage. Some need additional support and aids.

Schools are expected to put support in place, record and evaluate it, before making referrals to other professionals. Resources and personnel are limited.

Having said that, it does seem that your son needs more support and strategies than he currently has and a private assessment, if you can manage it, might give you and the school help in how best to support him. Coloured paper, or coloured overlays can be helpful, different pens, a writing slope, not being expected to copy from the board, although I expect that doesn’t happen much these days.

I agree with everything that LIZS said.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/398815/SEND_Code_of_Practice_January_2015.pdf

RubyRed & Towanda - it’s this doc ^^. The Gov SEND Code of Practice.

Pg 95 - there is a difference between SEN & a formal diagnosis (disability). However, this does not mean there should not be help offered before a formal diagnosis (if there is ever one).

What this bit is saying is, if a teacher suspects a problem they are under a STATUTORY duty to put measures in place to support the child.

I am “surprised” a child can get to 9/10 yrs and this not have raised flags with staff.

SEN can be when a child is behind the peer curve.

Although this doc is long, it’s split into sections - most probably won’t be applicable to you.

The Code is...

• ANTICIPATORY - if it looks like the child is having problems, the school must put measures in place.
• MUST - this code is a statutory document. The school must apply what is in the document. If they do not, they have to justify why not.

OP
Email the school - all correspondence now in writing & any meetings are followed up by minutes / notes.

• Ask if the teacher has any concerns with any aspects of learning.
• Ask if your enquiries have been passed on to learning support.

If they offer an assessment - check what it is.

• on-line. This is not diagnostic and can not replicate all the aspects of other types of assessment. Or take into account any other types of difficulties. British Dyslexia Assoc do not recommend these.

• specialist teacher assessment. This teacher cannot do the full battery of testing. Again, they cannot diagnose. Useful when checking scores of tests for JCQ application of exam accommodations. They can’t take into account any other difficulties which may affect test scores eg ASD.

• educational psychologist & clinical psychologist (specialism in SpLDs & ASD related). These would be the two preferable routes for testing.

Get yourself over to the SEN board - lots of lovely, knowledgeable folks over there.

We had no problem with private Ed Psych report being accepted at schoolor for extra times in Exams, although by the time he was diagnosed this was only for A2, as he did AS and GCSE without it.
Interestingly about 15 years ago, I approached the LA Ed Psych and they told me that they would not look at a child unless their reading age was 3 years below chronological age, even though his problem was handwriting, (his verbal contributions to class were good) so we were looking at dyspraxia as co-ordination with ball games, tying shoes laces were problems . He was also ruled out because he was top set in most subjects.
Like a PP my son has an MA in a subject involving a lot of reading, analysis and writing and has a good job.
LIZS and Foxyloxy have made some very good points. I really regret not picking up on the clues when he was younger. He would not have found school so tiring and not been so frustrated at times if his dyslexia had been picked up.

I think that many children with dyslexia or a specific difficulty are frustrated, particularly those who are bright and don’t understand why they can’t do some of the things their peers seem to find so easy.

The trouble is, the criteria are stringent for referrals and so some children haven’t ‘failed’ enough to be referred. It was one of the things that frustrated me, as a SENDCo, that I often couldn’t get more specialist support, because a child wasn’t doing badly enough to meet the criteria. But that’s why the school have an obligation to put support in place. If it works, great- if it doesn’t, the evidence is there to support a referral.

Like many things, there are ideas that come and go. Neurolinguistic programming, Hickey, Irlen Institute, various phonetic schemes,. It really is a question of identifying the precise areas the child is finding difficult and working to support the development of weaker areas. That’s where a specialist assessment is helpful.

It might be that OP’s son will need technological support in the future, but time is of the essence as he doesn’t have too much time before secondary school and formal exams.

Sounds like my DS. He was diagnosed at the end of Yr4. Not spotted by me as his reading was very good but maths and spellings were terrible. His maths tutor recommended we tested him so we had an Ed Pysch report done. He then had extra time in tests but the school were pretty rubbish.

He has issues with auditory processing and working memory. His verbal comprehension skills were about 6 years ahead. Dyslexia is very complicated! It’s an umbrella term for lots of conditions.

Secondary school is better as he has found that he is very good at geography, history, English (now he can type with spell check). We just need to keep an eye on the maths and I think he’ll always struggle.

Don't think for a minute that the teacher or the school have any real interest in your child, if they did they would be far more proactive in helping him.

Get a private assessment and take action from there.

Agree, schools are so bad at this. They just write them off as low ability which is not true. They have to be very bad for the school to intervene.

I know it is ££ but for us it was worth every penny: I feel so sad for children in previous generations who had late diagnoses.

He sounds like DD, we had a private assessment. The school accepted it willingly, they knew there was an issue, they just couldn’t secure the funding to pay for an assessment.

She also struggled with learning times tables and gets in a flap with faced with a sheet of maths problems, often doing the wrong sum, by misreading either a digit or the operation, or doing it right, but writing down the answer the wrong way round. It’s taken time and work, but it’s coming together now, through a mixture of support at school, using a private tutor and a short course with a behavioural optemetrist (i can recommend an amazing one if you’re anywhere near Baldock)

The trouble is, the criteria are stringent for referrals and so some children haven’t ‘failed’ enough to be referred.

I’m wondering if his reading ability would be a barrier to a referral here?
He’s got major problems reading handwriting, but when it comes to printed text, school reading books etc, his reading ability has been assessed as within the normal range for his age.

He has a SEN support plan, his teacher gave me a copy the other week, but aside from a bit about visual prompts, they’re focusing on his communication and interaction with other pupils / teachers.

It’s a bit frustrating because I had a lengthy conversation with his teacher on parents evening about the issues I mention in my OP, and none of that’s made it to the support plan the school has written. His teacher just repeated the bit about how she’d talk to the SEN lead when I asked about that.