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Who knows if a child is on FSM?

102 replies

orchidsonabudget · 16/12/2020 16:50

we have just received UC - I understand I can apply for FSM but I want to know who would know if they are receiveing it?
Kids at small village primary
Also older DC at secondary

OP posts:
Solidaritea · 16/12/2020 23:01

We have stickers on books of children in receipt of pupil premium. Useful when doing book analysis of different groups and especially useful for the headteacher and other senior leaders as they don't know the full list. This is simply because progress of these children is even more important than progress of other children - which is partly because that data is published, but mainly because those children statistically have poorer outcomes so need to be focused on.

The kids have no idea what the stickers mean. Even most TAs don't know. It doesn't affect how I teach these children nor how anybody views them. It just means I get more pressure to ensure that this group is making progress.

cactusisblooming · 16/12/2020 23:09

Until last year in our school FSM pupils had to stand in a different queue and use a dinner ticket in the canteen, so it was common knowledge.

BiscuitsUnited · 16/12/2020 23:23

As well as the advantages of claiming fsm already mentioned on the thread, our local council is giving out grants this winter to applicants whose children receive free school meals- £45 per child for food plus £35 per household for fuel. So you would be eligible for any schemes like this in your area.

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Cherrysoup · 16/12/2020 23:23

We have stickers on books of children in receipt of pupil premium

Bloody hell, I’d be fuming as a teacher or parent. You should know your students well enough not to single them out in this way, it’s shocking. We have seating plans which indicate SEN/PP. This will only ever be seen by observers ie other teachers and the class teacher. Much more discreet.

2020out · 16/12/2020 23:30

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Juliehooligan · 16/12/2020 23:57

I’m a dinner lady in a primary school, and the only people that know are the office manager and the head teacher. No one else needs to or wants to know. All that matters is that the kids are getting fed.

spongedog · 17/12/2020 00:10

@ExitThisWay

I totally understand why your asking this. My children became eligible for FSM 2 years ago. In so glad they did and I claimed it, although I often have imposter syndrome about it. Although my circumstances have slightly changed my children will get pupil premium funding & FSM until they finish the school they are at now. It is a godsend knowing they have had a hot dinner at lunchtime. Not having to make packed lunches is amazing. Knowing is not the end of the world if they have beans on toast for tea if we are busy as they have had a hot lunch is great. I also received the vouchers over the summer holidays and have just received vouchers for x mas (this a Via a council scheme not a national scheme this time) my children also accessed free summer holiday family days which included craft / sport / cookery family sessions at a local secondary school. In lockdown when so much was closed this was a lovely activity/ day to do on some days. I know from working in schools that extra funding is given and pupil premium children are monitored as a group due to the inequality’s children face from lower income backgrounds. I’m glad that however hard it is to acknowledge that it’s my children that this effects - that I’m doing all I can to help them by claiming FSM and letting school claim the extra funding for them.
Thank you for your post. I work in a secondary school as a data manager. We have approx 10-12% FSM at any time. The most important part of my job (imo) is in the morning to get new FSM approvals onto our MIS, so that all runs smoothly at the tills at lunchtime. I notify Finance and chaplaincy. We don't want any of our students embarrassed at the tills. However, part of the conversation that Finance have with parents is to advise them of what FSM covers. I, naively until I took this job, thought FSM was a cash allowance so that the children could take what meal choice they chose. That isnt the case - FSM only covers certain options - and if students and families are not aware, that can cause issues.

A (surprisingly large) part of my job is to reconcile the FSM account with the LA so I remove students from our account where a parent has named the wrong school; transfer leavers, so the students FSM are attached to the correct school; remove randoms (under age or over age); remove duplicate eligible applications. Although eligibility of the student doesnt change, the way school finance works is that the student will only get the FSM from the date it is allocated to the school account (in my county), so I need to be totally reconciled each day.

We are a religious academy so have a chaplaincy team. They have been fiendish since lock-down in contacting our FSM families to offer support, including access to the food bank we are running. Our families appreciate the support offered, even if they choose not to accept.

We have worked really hard with families to ensure that any family that might be eligible for summer/half-term/Xmas vouchers received them.

So many within a school environment might know and are actively working to get it right.

I could post a lot more about PP but that really is another thread!!

PomBearWithoutHerOFRS · 17/12/2020 04:26

If your older DC are at secondary, if it's like the one mine go to, (an academy) the credit they get for the meal each day isn't enough to actually buy one. They need to work out what to buy very carefully or end up with crap Sad
(I'm not complaining about the amount, but the school cafeteria out the prices up in September "in line with the rest of the academies in the trust" and a bit meal is now impossible for my DC to buy. They also stopped allowing drinks from home "cos covid" and turned off the drinking fountains , while charging £1.20 for a bottle of water that has to be drunk all at once during lunch or dumped)

mutantelfoftraal · 17/12/2020 04:32

@reefedsail

We have numerous PP TAs who only do intervention with PP pupils. However, it is 40% of the children, so many of them receive it.

The kids don't know any of this though. The kids couldn't tell you who was PP.

It's not unusual for non PP children to be included in the groups as needed. Also the PP groups can be at any level to extend the learning of more able children.
Amanduh · 17/12/2020 04:33

Head/deputy and any SLT (just because they work with pupil premium and funding) class teacher and ta (use the register and pupil data) that’s it.

Rockbird · 17/12/2020 04:53

Office here, I process the pupil premium applications and the only people who know are the class teacher and one of my colleagues who is involved in data management. Even SLT couldn't tell you who was PP unless the child was on the radar for another reason.

mutantelfoftraal · 17/12/2020 04:56

@Rockbird

Office here, I process the pupil premium applications and the only people who know are the class teacher and one of my colleagues who is involved in data management. Even SLT couldn't tell you who was PP unless the child was on the radar for another reason.
The SLT should know who is on PP so their progress can be tracked. They don't need to know who is in FSM, the two are not the same. I'd be annoyed if they don't know who is PP as it'd mean children missing out on extra opportunities which they are entitled to.
footprintsintheslow · 17/12/2020 06:10

It's a big bonus for the school if that makes you feel better.

As a teacher I was made aware of which children were FSM as I had to make sure they didn't fall behind at all. Silly really as that's our job for all the children.

reefedsail · 17/12/2020 06:14

PP is only FSM/ LAC/ Forces, so realistically it will be mostly FSM. SLT should absolutely know who they are, and which category.

In my school no individual will remember all 200(ish) across the school off the top of their head, but in a small school it's likely that all staff will know- as they are supposed to! Staff have to know everyone in the year group(s) they work in for intervention purposes.

The government's intention is that they are treated differently- but better. It doesn't matter if they are on target, they are still supposed to have their personal provision and therefore outcomes enhanced with their additional funding.

Boomclaps · 17/12/2020 06:25

@reefedsail

As staff we do not talk about it or discuss it. There's never a reason to.

You mean except in your pupil progress meetings when SLT are asking you how your PP children are doing?

In our school our PP also include a massive military community who are hugely middle class. Our PP aren’t just FSM kids.
MacDuffsMuff · 17/12/2020 06:27

Admin, teachers, kitchen manager. They're certainly not treated any differently.

IggyAce · 17/12/2020 06:27

I’m a lunch time supervisor and I haven’t a clue who gets FSM, I don’t need to know. Our school has gone as far as providing every child with a packed lunch on school trips so those on FSM aren’t singled out.

reefedsail · 17/12/2020 06:32

Well, yes, I was going to say 'except in areas with a very high contingent of military children' but I didn't think I needed to.

reefedsail · 17/12/2020 06:33

In a moment somebody may also come along who works in an educational provision attached to a residential home to say that actually the majority of their PP and LAC.

HelenaJustina · 17/12/2020 06:33

Senior admin school staff here, I know, I expect the teachers to know but only those in their class.

Please do let the schools know, it is handled so much more sensitively than in the past and is only of benefit to you, the DC and school as a whole. Only this week I have been able to ask the Headteacher to authorise a spend so that a PP child will pay only £50 (in 5 instalments) for a week long residential. The cost to other families is £310.

RizzleDrizzle · 17/12/2020 06:55

The kids have no idea what the stickers mean. Even most TAs don't know. It doesn't affect how I teach these children nor how anybody views them. It just means I get more pressure to ensure that this group is making progress

The kids can still see there’s something different about that child to get a sticker! Parents would probably work it out! And tell their child not to have anything to do with the children with stickers on their books!

Use your own confidential seating plans and data to analyse books

Stop identifying children on PP (or SEN) to all and sundry

UngodlyScreech · 17/12/2020 06:57

at my secondary school you got given a FSM ticket you had to give to the person working at the till so they knew you didn't have to pay. I got bullied because other kids knew I was on it, so my mum eventually took me off and paid herself

DipSwimSwoosh · 17/12/2020 06:57

All teachers. We are judged on the performance of FSM kids as a group, as traditionally they underperform.

Bessica1970 · 17/12/2020 06:59

PP is also anyone who has has FSM in the last 6 years (but no longer has it) so There will be loads of PP students not FSM! About 50% of my year group PP no longer receive FSM

rc22 · 17/12/2020 07:02

Just the head, admin staff and teacher although some kids are very open about it and share the fact they have free meals with their friends.

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