EHCP not being followed

[sunflowershine]

Hello all,

I have posted this over the weekend in the SEN boards but it's so quiet over there I thought I'd try here for responses.

My DD was diagnosed with ASD at 3, first privately for speed then later on the NHS.

She is very bright and ahead with her learning but struggles socially. She was at preschool then part time. Whilst she was there she had full time 1-1 support because she couldn't cope with the other children, the noise, and she had frequently meltdowns there and at home. She couldn't even cope if her 1-1 gave any attention to another child.

Lockdown happened and she spent 6 months at home with us in her safe space. She did seem much more settled (as I guess the social pressures were off).

We got her EHCP finalised in the summer and she was given funding for full time 1-1 support, even at lunchtime. She started reception in September and has done amazingly well. She's had just one meltdown there although they are becoming much more frequent at home especially after school. She is always happy to go. She is utterly exhausted by school and in bed early every night (like most children I expect!). It seems the classic girl trait of masking at school then exploding at home is happening already even at age 4.5.

They hired a 1-1 for her, but an unqualified trainee (shes barely out of school herself though she is lovely) They have three TAs - the other two are well experienced and qualified- and one class teacher to 16 children (one other child with much more profound needs than DD also has 1-1 full time). What they do there is each week one of the TAs is allocated to DD to keep an eye on her but they basically keep well back as she's doing so well. So really they're more of a general TA than 'hers'.

I feel mixed about this. DH thinks she's doing well at school so I should just leave it. I feel like she is doing so well there and I'm happy that she's mixing, joining in etc without meltdowns but I worry that she's not getting the 1-1 support that she's supposed to and that this will be having an effect on how challenging she is at home as well as her general well-being.

The teacher (who is the senco) says she doesn't recognise DD from the EHCP and that in their setting they're seeing almost none of the behaviours described. She went so far as to say that if she didn't know DD had ASD then as a SENCO she'd maybe think she was a bit quirky but that serious alarm bells wouldn't be ringing.

There are two other children in the class who are as yet undiagnosed but are extremely challenging (I know because with it being a small class the parents all talk and these parents have expressed their worries) and it seems like DDs TA allocation is being used to manage the class as a whole rather than for her.

Should I rock the boat and raise it with the school at our next meeting, or just leave it? She's my first child so I've no school experience really. Going on what the school says it's almost like they think she's grown out of it, which as we all know just isn't possible.

Thoughts?

She’s doing well. I’d be happy she’s doing well and trust that the TA will intervene should it become necessary. Perhaps she’s enjoying school so much that she’s more able to manage the social aspect at school.

What do you want the 1-1 to do? It sounds as though, at school, her general well being is good and she is coping without having to rely on support. As a bright child, she’s engaged with learning and that’s positive. As long as the support intervenes if necessary, I’d leave well alone.

I’ve seen plenty of children so reliant on 1-1 support that they can’t actually do anything independently. It’s good practice to prompt and stand back and as long as it’s working, she’s progressing and is happy and school is tiring her, leave it. Children do behave differently at home and at school. One of mine was an angel at school and very different at home.

If she's doing well without active 1-1 support, that's fantastic. It sounds as though there's someone keeping an eye on her if she gets stuck. As you know, they don't grow out of it, but can have more or less success depending on the appropriateness of the setting. It sounds like you've picked a good one!

Having previously become too reliant on a 1-1, it sounds like this might be a way of promoting more independence for her, which is great.

If you start to have concerns about how she is getting on at school, you can ask to call an emergency Annual Review. Until that time, it's probably best to step back a bit and enjoy her success.

Wow that sounds a really challenging environment for everyone. Sometimes I find too many adults more of a hinderance. Have I got this right?
16 children
1 teacher
3 TAs
A 1:1 for another tricky child a two more challenging children?

@RosieLemonade no sorry perhaps I didn't explain it clearly.

16 children overall
1 teacher
1 general TA
2 TAs for full time 1-1 support for children who have ASD, one of whom is DD and one of whom is on the other end of the spectrum to DD and has profound needs

2 children in addition to the children with ASD are very challenging behaviour wise, but as yet undiagnosed with anything.

Very small school.

If she’s doing ok in school, and the support I’d there for her when she needs it, I’d focus more on before and after school routines. The more predictable you can make things the easier she’ll be able to cope. My DD would melt down coming out of school so I made the after school process very easy - always straight home, snack and some tv to decompress a bit and then outside for half an hour. It doesn’t stop it entirely but she gets much less distressed because she knows what the transition from school to home looks like so it’s less stressful for her.

If she’s struggling in school maybe talk about what the 1:1 could do with her but if she doesn’t need active help during the day if trust the school to use their resources well. One thing that might help in school is the 1:1 taking her for time outside of class, my daughter has half an hour in the morning and afternoon with the teaching support, sometimes working on literacy or numeracy, sometimes playing a board game but it gives her set time away from the noise and bustle of the class which helps her cope with it all much better.

What is the exact wording in the EHCP with regards to support?

As long as the TA is available to her when she needs it then I would be happy she is doing so well. Having a TA hovering when not needed may well be more damaging than good

After school restraint collapse is usually a sign that they're not actually coping productively at all, but rather that they are overloaded and struggling to process the days experiences, or alternately are masking altogether. And that is not a route you want a girl with ASD taking as it usually leads to complete collapse at some point down the line, whether that's months or years later.

I'd ask for a short meeting with the school to try and pin down exactly what the ta is doing all day in relation to your daughter. If she's dedicated to your daughter you should be getting considerable amounts of observational info each day/week, regular forward plans of how to support her development and feedback on the progress and achievements under those plans.

If the EHCP is written properly and very specifically this should already be in place.

@CovidPostingName

After school restraint collapse is usually a sign that they're not actually coping productively at all, but rather that they are overloaded and struggling to process the days experiences, or alternately are masking altogether. And that is not a route you want a girl with ASD taking as it usually leads to complete collapse at some point down the line, whether that's months or years later.

I'd ask for a short meeting with the school to try and pin down exactly what the ta is doing all day in relation to your daughter. If she's dedicated to your daughter you should be getting considerable amounts of observational info each day/week, regular forward plans of how to support her development and feedback on the progress and achievements under those plans.

If the EHCP is written properly and very specifically this should already be in place.

This first paragraph sums up exactly what I'm worried about, you put it better than me, thanks.

I don't think the school are doing a bad job. It's a lovely place, tiny place, perfect for DD. I'm just worried that actually she's not coping as well as it appears and that once she comes home it all comes spilling out.

After school, we keep it very simple and routined. We get home, she has a snack and puts comfy clothes on and then quiet time of her choice. Sometimes she half an hour on her tablet, sometimes plays in her room, sometimes she bounces on her trampoline alone for a bit etc, the bouncing helps her regulate which we discovered when we got a private OT in as often of the EHCP process.

Then she joins us again for dinner, which takes an hour (I have a toddler also!). Straight into pjs after dinner, quiet time again like reading, doing colouring etc then up to bed for six. Stories in bed, a chat about her day (it's the only time she'll talk to anyone about her day and seems to help her offload before she goes to sleep) and lights out by 6:30. Sleeps 12.5 hours without a peep.

The meltdowns happen any time after coming in the door and going to bed but more often shortly before bedtime when she's really tired. We're convinced she has a PDA profile (except for now, she doesn't do this at school!) It's in her ECHP and I'm really careful as to how I word things. I don't say 'right you must put your pyjamas on' I say 'ok, sibling is going to put pyjamas on now, can you do it too, maybe you could do it quicker and win the race!?'. She responds better to that.

My youngest had no health issues, he was a model child at school, when he came home he was a monster. Its not unusual for the pressures of school to make children more challenging when they are at home, its normal. Its like they come home and pop, so dont confuse what is normal behaviour for other kids with her diagnosis.

I agree with covidpostingname - there is nothing to be lost in trying to make sure the support that is there via the TA is effective support, otherwise its a waste of money. The measure needs to be improvement at home really if she is masking is school. It might be even though she is appearing fine to them she still needs a few extra movement breaks, or quiet times or a visual timetable to help her know what's happening next. Can you create a little log of the meltdowns (like time, length of time to be ok, duration, the trigger) to help track.

I do agree that many a NT child comes home irritable and hungry and needs a rest and a snack. in fact as term goes on the whole cohort get more irritable. then they all reset over the holiday bit. But my personal experience of one NT and one autistic child is a meltdown from masking all day is just an entirely different thing and scale and needs different support.

I agree. I was speaking with my sister the other day, my niece is only a few weeks older than DD. She is neurotypical. She's also just started reception and after school she can also be a challenge because she is just so tired. But she's a pain like four year olds can be, she's a bit grumpy and stroppy, she can stomp her feet a bit when asked to do something and usually she's the most beautifully behaved child.

DD isn't like that. When I say she has a meltdown, she flips. Last week one day when she started I got DH to take toddler out of the room, closed the door and just sat quietly with her (as this usually helps, I dim lights and make sure there is nothing noisy or stimulating going on). She kept walking up to me roaring in my face repeatedly and when I made eye contact with her (not usually a problem her eye contact is normally good) she full on whacked me hard in the face. She never usually hits. Then she flopped, cried her little heart out saying 'sorry, sorry I just can't stop mummy' and I held her until she calmed at which point I scooped her up and carried her to bed.

That's not a normal al four year old being tired after school.

@FabbyChix the type of meltdown for children with neurodiversity is quantifiably different to the pressure release seen in neurotypical children after school. It’s interlinked with the diagnosis because the pressures and sensory overloads are very different.

I should add to my last post - we don't hit in our house. My children have never been smacked. I don't yell at them either, firm and stern voices/tones for telling off but no screaming and shouting. With DD being the way she is shouting at her would only make things worse anyway.

@MillieEpple I have provided school with a small good quality visual timetable to use as it helps at home (I bought them the same one just the school version). They've not used it because they've said she doesn't need them to, she's fine without it.

The EHC is a legally binding document so if it says she needs one to one support then she should be getting one to one support. Buikding independence can be structured in as part of the overall plan but her TA should be available to her whenever she needs.

I would go to the school and speak to them about it, they need to implement what is written. If you get no joy then speak to the LA who issued it as they have ultimate responsibility.

So your DD should be getting 1 to 1 support but isn't? I would seek a meeting with the head and wouldn't let this continue tbh. Not least because it sounds like the resource is being used to deal with other (undiagnosed) children with challenging behaviour.

It is up to school to raise concerns about those other challenging children and for those children to get the support they need - problem sometimes is that parents don't acknowledge there is an issue / don't want an assessment.

@IwishIwasyoda She kind of is and kind of isn't.

Each week, they alternate the TA who is tasked with being 'hers' for that week, teacher included. I am happy for them to do that as I agree that having her attached to just one member of staff may not be helpful for her especially if they go off sick or leave etc.

That person then is responsible for making sure DD is ok. However it's not 1-1. They say because DD is coping so well, she's doing exactly the same as the other children all of the time with the TA just being there for her 'if she needs it'.

So 'her' TA is being used, in my opinion, as more of a general TA who is just there if needed rather than provided the targeted, specific 1-1 support that she's supposed to be having.

Because she's seemingly fine at school, not melting down, this is ok and good progress?

I am delighted that she's happy in school, and I really couldn't be happier that she is mixing and making friends etc. But I worry that her behaviour is worsening at home because she's silently not coping as well as it seems at school and she's masking.

I also don't understand (though it's not my business) how this works with the other child who has 1-1 because 'their' TA is included in DDs rotation. That child has many more difficulties than DD, they are non verbal, cannot use a toilet, and their developmental 'age' is more like a 2/3 year old (I'm not assuming, DD went through preschool with this child and I know their Mum quite well as a result). That child is supposed to have a designated 1-1 and I don't see how that happens when 'their' TA is included in DDs rotation.

It just all seems a bit weird.

i wouldn't worry too much about the rotation as it can be better to have a couple of staff that are trained in how to look after a specific child.

I really think the focus is they don't understand what masking is properly. like deep down. So they don't view a meltdown at 6pm as having anything to do with the fact that they didn't use the timetable you provided much earlier in the day. and they don't see that the longer term impact could be burnout at a later stage.

its very hard to see a happy child doing what is asked of them and think 8 hours ahead, or even 5 years ahead! It is quite hard to get your head round I guess. Even now, I occasionally think my own child is fine at a gathering and then almost as soon as we have left he has a meltdown and I realise that actually it was too noisy, bright and too fast paced for him. But he really did look fine and if I never saw the meltdown I'd not believe it.

Hmm that does seem a bit of a strange setup to me... I would 100% ask to meet with the school & just approach it as a 'clarifying the provision laid out in her EHCP' or something! (Mat leave SENCO here!)... like others have said, ehcps and the provision in them are legally binding so the school must provide the support stated in them. I know they vary massively with each county, but I would tend to go more down the route of the actual provision in the echp rather than the 1:1 hours... e.g if it states that your DD needs daily or weekly support for SALT or social skills or vocabulary or whatever, then I would ask specifically what is being done for that, with who and when. Just because a reception environment lends its self to lots of play, social skills etc. doesn't mean that the 1:1 is actually working on this with your DD... especially if they rotate the adults & are using them as a general TA.
(I hope some of that makes sense- I still have baby brain!)

And then you can get some specifics in like as the PP said, e.g using the visual timetable- it doesn't matter whether they think she needs it or not, if it's been recommended in the ehcp.

What is the wording in section f does it say “1-1 for x hours” or does it say adult support or other wooly wording

Hi OP, I do think you need to go and speak to the head about your concerns about your DD behaviour at home and the fact she might not be coping as well as they think she is and get a sense of how they are supporting her, how the provisions set out in her plan are being met etc.

@Sirzy It says

In order to access the curriculum and address her special educational needs X will be supported by the equivalent of 30 hours per week (25 hours learning support and 5 hours break and lunch time support). This level of support should be regularly reviewed.

And also

X will have a small number of support assistants that work as designated key adults for her, so that they can act as a ‘secure base’ for her in school. Key adults will need to be physically and emotionally present, attentive, attuned and responsive to X's needs.

That doesn’t specify that it has to be 1-1 support though so although not ideal school aren’t doing anything wrong if the support is available for her.

I would talk to the senco about how she is struggling after school so maybe they can add in some more sensory breaks or similar during the day