Boundary query - with diagram

[frustrationcentral]

Hi!

Is it possible to find out a clearer way to determine a boundary of a house? We've found a map that we received when buying but it's not overly clear, and in the deeds it states that when looking at the house, we own/are responsible for the left boundary.

We are the middle house. Neighbour B believes they own the hedge that is next to our garden. The hedge runs, as shown, the whole way around our garden on two sides. Neighbour B wants to remove the hedge to extend their driveway.

Please notice where the hedge is - how if you draw a straight line down from where our lawn starts beside our house the hedge is on the neighbours land. However if the boundary is definitely a straight line both sides, then also please notice the path running from our gate (left of house). If the path is our boundary then potentially we own part of neighbour A's garden and the hedge that side?! We don't believe we do.

Any ideas? Our position is we're concerned about Neighbour B claiming part of our land - and the implications when we move in the future. Also if the hedge belongs to us and is then replaced with a vehicle then that'll be an eye sore ( and loss of privacy)

Is there some way to find out for definite?

@Hothammock

The title plan shows the boundary is the middle of the edge of your building and your neighbours building. The lawn and hedges do not seem to correspond to this from your sketch. The hedges seem to be confusing the issue. From the red line it looks like the hedge in question is on your neighbours land as is part of the lawn.

I don't think there's any lawn in question, the our grass runs straight down from their path, it's just the hedge that looks to have been planted their side

Neighbour B's house is slightly further away from us than A's is , so when they come out of their gate they walk straight onto their driveway ( the hedge is immediately in front of them, whereas when we come out of our gate we look at Neighbour A's garden and then have to go round a corner onto the drive.

I think the more I look at the plans I actually think B do own the hedge and we own neighbour A's hedge. How weird that when they were built they didn't plant the hedges further over?! Mystery ..

Does the path to their house take up half the space between the 2 properties or less? Is it up to the fence boundary? Where are the trunks of the hedge in relation to the path?

I wonder if the hedges were planted so they had room to grow within the boundary of the property they belong to? So you have lost some of your garden to neighbour A because it has been pruned over the years in a way that it has grown only on your side and not theirs and the space left for it to expand into has become incorporated into their garden. Where are the hedges in relation to the paths for the other houses? It seems strange to have responsibility for the fence on one side but the hedge on the other side though.

You might be lucky and find that by measuring the halfway point between the two properties and following the line of the fence that there is a clear answer as to whose land it is growing on because it is a foot or so off the mid line but if it comes down to smaller measurements, you'll need professional advice.

@orangenasturtium

Does the path to their house take up half the space between the 2 properties or less? Is it up to the fence boundary? Where are the trunks of the hedge in relation to the path?

I wonder if the hedges were planted so they had room to grow within the boundary of the property they belong to? So you have lost some of your garden to neighbour A because it has been pruned over the years in a way that it has grown only on your side and not theirs and the space left for it to expand into has become incorporated into their garden. Where are the hedges in relation to the paths for the other houses? It seems strange to have responsibility for the fence on one side but the hedge on the other side though.

You might be lucky and find that by measuring the halfway point between the two properties and following the line of the fence that there is a clear answer as to whose land it is growing on because it is a foot or so off the mid line but if it comes down to smaller measurements, you'll need professional advice.

The path/grass between both houses are pretty much equal

Given your update, I think my theory is probably correct. The original hedge will have been planted in the middle of a flower bed on the property they belong to so they have room to grow without overhanging the neighbouring garden. It looks like your hedge has been pruned back to where it was planted so it has only grown onto your land and neighbour A has stolen a bit of your garden (not necessarily intentionally).

@orangenasturtium

Does the path to their house take up half the space between the 2 properties or less? Is it up to the fence boundary? Where are the trunks of the hedge in relation to the path?

I wonder if the hedges were planted so they had room to grow within the boundary of the property they belong to? So you have lost some of your garden to neighbour A because it has been pruned over the years in a way that it has grown only on your side and not theirs and the space left for it to expand into has become incorporated into their garden. Where are the hedges in relation to the paths for the other houses? It seems strange to have responsibility for the fence on one side but the hedge on the other side though.

You might be lucky and find that by measuring the halfway point between the two properties and following the line of the fence that there is a clear answer as to whose land it is growing on because it is a foot or so off the mid line but if it comes down to smaller measurements, you'll need professional advice.

I think it's odd to have responsibility for a fence one side and hedge the other too. It's also odd as most of the houses in the road have the same set up- double drive, small garden with hedge going round it- they just look they the garden/hedge belongs to that house! They're big hedges - 6ft tall and well established. If the B takes down the hedge then we'll probably have to do something with the other part of it as it's look a bit odd

@orangenasturtium

Given your update, I think my theory is probably correct. The original hedge will have been planted in the middle of a flower bed on the property they belong to so they have room to grow without overhanging the neighbouring garden. It looks like your hedge has been pruned back to where it was planted so it has only grown onto your land and neighbour A has stolen a bit of your garden (not necessarily intentionally).

Do you mean A? They don't have our garden attached to them - the hedge next to their garden is attached to our driveway

Unless the trunks of the hedge fall clearly on your side of the boundary, of course.

Yes, I'm suggesting possibly there were originally flowerbeds that ran alongside the drive on each property up to the boundary. So you owned the drive and the flowerbed next to it. The shrubs were planted in the middle of the flowerbed so they had room to grow. Intead of trimming the hedge back to the boundary, someone who lived in neighbour A's property has trimmed it back to the trunk in the middle of the flowerbed instead of the boundary so as years have gone by it has grown unevenly and the back half of the flowerbed has been added into their garden. The boundary should probably be in a straight line from the edge of your path, if the path is original.

Ah right yes get what you mean! That is a possibility!

Oh... i see why I've confused you. When I say they have stolen part of your front garden, I'm using front garden to mean all the land at the front of your house, including your drive.

I believe the path is original yes, it flows how you'd expect from our gate onto our driveway - following the line of the back fence

@orangenasturtium

Oh... i see why I've confused you. When I say they have stolen part of your front garden, I'm using front garden to mean all the land at the front of your house, including your drive.

Don't worry I'm easily confused! I'm stressing a bit about it, we really don't want to lose the hedge, it looks nice around our garden and we value the privacy it give us, but we're also good friends with our neighbours and don't want to fall out over it either

OP If you've been merrily looking after the hedge since you've lived there the neighbours shouldn't be surprised if you say you thought the boundary and therefore the hedge was yours and generally query where they think the boundary should be and how will you all establish that legally if the existing hedge is taken down. I guess they could still take offence at you questioning whether the hedge truly belongs to them but they'd have a nerve after sitting back and letting you do all the work of looking after it all this time!

Yep @Prestel , we've always looked after it, used treatment on it etc. It just looks like it's part of our garden, as I say the whole road is made up the same way. It's only if you stand at their gate and follow their path down that it appears the hedge is on their side of the boundary.

Neighbour B have asked for a chat this evening about it!

I suggest you take the title plan outside with you and discuss it with them. Tell them your concerns about privacy and using your part of your garden to access vehicles parked on their drive.

@wowfudge

I suggest you take the title plan outside with you and discuss it with them. Tell them your concerns about privacy and using your part of your garden to access vehicles parked on their drive.

Thanks @wowfudge , that's our plan. We don't want to fall out with them so hoping we can resolve this nicely!

Good luck for later.

How did it go this evening @frustrationcentral?

It went well thanks @WB205020, Our neighbours listened to our concerns and we've agreed to look into it further another time. I can't remember if I updated the thread earlier but DH spoke to Neighbour A on wednesday who said they've always owned the hedge that surrounds their garden, as do their neighbours have that opinion too. So currently no one believes we own a hedge! Odd so we've asked for more time to investigate.

I was so anxious yesterday so so relieved to get the conversation over with!

Sorry should say neighbour A has always believed they owned the hedge

I think neighbour A is in for a bit of shock. I think the deeds are clear that you own part of what they think is their front garden. But unfortunately for you, it does look like B own the hedge they want to remove.

I agree @FatCatThinCat. It's a weird one, look at the houses from the road or above from an upstairs window and you'd never think it was anything other than the hedge belongs to the garden it surrounds. It's only when you look at the fence boundaries that it becomes clear they don't! Neighbour A doesn't have to worry - we have no intention of touching the hedge, but who knows if a future owner will want to!

I'm glad it went well OP. At the end of the day, the boundary is at best unclear. It's completely reasonable for you to not want anything changed until you're satisfied where it should legally be.