Why don't groups of women like me?

[Letsallscreamatthesistene]

Please be honest and give your opinions - dont hold back! Its been something thats been on my mind for a while now so i'd like some honest advice.

Im a woman, early 30's, a nurse, one son and a husband. Im into fitness, and thats where my social circles come from. Its not that im concerned about though. Im a military wife, so move around quite a lot. We tend to live on military 'patch' housing estates. There are always FB groups, coffee mornings etc that are organised by the wives that live there. Some I can go to, some I cant (shifts etc). I never seem to be 'accepted' into the wider group, im always the one thats on the peripheries. One on one its fine, just something always seems 'off' when theres a group. This happened at a destination wedding I went to last year. It was small, maybe 15 people or so. The same happened, I was on the peripheries of the group of women but one on one it was fine. As its something that happens often and in different groups, I think its me or something im doing.

Have you any experience of this? Been in the same position? I'd love some insight.

Thank you x

You come across as quite aggressive on this thread, OP. Are you similar in person?

And surely at least part of the answer is that you don't enjoy group situations (but still somehow resent being left out of them), so that presumably your lack of ease is obvious?

I dont mean to come across as aggressive, I just dont like it when people take time out to be unecessarily harsh. I will stick up for myself in person, albeit not as directly as in this post.

I think you're right though, im uneasy with large groups but do sort of resent being left out because I tend to not be great in that scenario. I think I need to get better at big groups - I think thats the key.

I mean, it sounds a bit grim, if you're always moving to a different base, and getting thrust into all-female social situations you don't really like. Does this way of life really suit you?

I know less than nothing about military bases, but I tend to imagine that if women are essentially trailing spouses, it must be hard for them to maintain independent careers -- are SAHMs very much the norm? Does that set you apart?

SAHMs are very much the norm! Last week someone declared on one of the FB groups that she wasnt going to do any housework for the entire day...I think at that moment I realised how different our lives are. Despite that though, I do think we must have something in common to at least forge a friendship of convenience at least.

You said be honest and don't hold back
Yet when i am honest you get all...'did you mean to sound so rude'
No i am not rude by simply saying : you should try to change yourself and be honest with yourself instead of complaining about them.

You wanted honest. I gave you honest.and i def did hold back but honest i was.

In a group setting when people dont seem yo want you in their group, always look at yourself and your own actions first. Especially considering this is happening everywhere you go op.

You don't sound aggressive at all op, and I wouldn't change to fit in. I would invite a few over for drinks though and see how that goes.

Could it not just be that they spend more time together so they're closer? It doesn't mean there's a problem that needs to be angsted over.

I can relate I struggle with groups of woman they sense something is off with me and I struggle to connect with them.
Truth is I am a bit different I'm always fascinated what groups of woman general talk about when I listen from the sidelines it's just stuff I don't get involved with at all or interests me. I did also experience bullying in my teen years from groups of females although I always did prefer the company of boys I have always had a few close female friends as individuals rather than a group.
Which I think did some damage the bullying that is was mostly tearing me down because I was a bit different and guys gravitated towards me despite me not being as good looking as those girls, they hated me for it.
I'm not saying I think I am better than them I'm just different. I get most of my social interaction from work where we would discuss world politics with my international team or the latest breakthroughs in science.
I think woman have a sixth sense about me not being on the same wave length and tend to exclude me. I'm not shy or socially awkward I'm well spoken generally and confident.
Ugh that was a long way to say I realte I don't fit in generally with groups of woman I think they know I don't bite on gossip about others and talk about TV or celebs or their kids etc. I imagine they think I'm a little odd, a little snobby and a little nerdy 😁 and they would be right. 🤷

See I want to be left alone but I’m not It’s weird and last year I left a yoga group because they wanted me in their inner circle book club and lunch gatherings after just a couple of lessons.

I have never felt I needed people, am quite an introvert really. My sisters the same but people just gravitate towards us.

It was the same with boyfriends, whilst my friends were wringing their hands about being single I could not have given less of a shit about having a boyfriend. They seemed rather an inconvenience. I do sometimes wonder if my sisters and mines leave us alone vibe makes people see us as a challenge.

I like one to one friendships but detest large all women get togethers. If people like the sort of girls having cocktails, lunch gatherings, hen nights that’s fine. I just don’t. I remember all women enforced social gatherings at work I hated them. On a training and social away day I ‘got lost’ in a maze in a stately home so I could avoid everyone for a while.

You come across as quite aggressive on this thread, OP. Are you similar in person?

no you don't OP. You are just tackling the dismissive sneerers who are so prevalent on MN these days. You're fine

op you do not come off as aggressive at all. You reached out for help and people were a bit cunty about it. Ignore.

I struggle in groups and have also moved around a lot. You start to put a guard up, I think. You know you're just going to move on so subconsciously you don't make as much of an effort. The only time I've fit well into groups is when I've known they were going to be very short lived things (eg month long residencies). Then I seem to be ok.

I think, for me at least, it is just fear of letting myself get hurt.

I struggle with groups. I think I must give off a vibe of some sort (hesitant/ guarded/ tense / too safe in my topics/ too nice to overcompensate which seems fake or drippy) who knows!

I’ve always done better in small groups so I try to focus on the people I seem to hit it off with and make of it what I can. You can’t win em all.

I would look for friendships outside the military wife zone. It sounds quite intimidating to me, and has the potential to go very wrong given the confines of the compound etc, this all sounds quite intense.

You describe the fact that the SAHP decided not to do housework in the heat in a fairly dismissive way, remarking that you had nothing in common with how they are feeling. Are you always like that? I am not sure you intended it that way, but maybe you are being judgemental about them without meaning to be? They may not want careers or to work long hours, or they may desperate to work who knows but they won't thank you for judging their lives. You are not better than them because you work op.

We had a friend like this, she went back to a FT banking job when the rest of us choose to stay at home for a while when the children were young, and she became almost scornful of our different choices. She soon found herself cast adrift, as no one could bear the nasty digs and comments about a busy day at the gym!

Despite that though, I do think we must have something in common to at least forge a friendship of convenience at least

And despite the fact they are so dull as to announce no housework on a hot day, you are 'still prepared' to give these boring women the time of day, just for convenience of course.

I think the answer to your question is perfectly outlined in your last post, and shows what you really think of them.

Is it clicky?
To many woman class themselves as important by being in and excluding new people which shows the mentality.
Not liking big groups so much does not mean you appear anyway but in that space putting yourself out to be widening your social circle.
Not your fault woman are clicky or lack being decent/ respectful.
Mn woman making it out how would or will we know your situation I think at some stage we all have been in that situation.

I'm fine one on one but with groups I'm always on the periphery.

In groups people often seem quite shallow and I've noticed that they "collect" people.

The "funny" one, the "pretty" one, the "rich"one, the one with the interesting job etc... I'm just not interesting enough to be part of the inner circle.

At work I tend to do ok so must have my uses on a professional level.

I didnt say anything about it being a hot day. Also, I dont think im better than them at all. I think I said in my post that I realised how different we are, not that im better than them. Work doesnt even factor in chat aside from the odd 'that was a tough shift', or 'cant tomorrow, I have work' comment. In fact, your post backs that thought up in my mind - that the fact you cast your working friend adrift because she started working FT. Seemingly you just didnt have that much in common anymore.

Thanks all - I didnt think I was being aggressive. I do find that you have to be a bit direct with people on MN who are perhaps being a bit harsh. Its not a reflection on real life.

I DO think I need to work on small talk as it seems to be the key, but maybe also just accept large groups arent for me and look for other ways. I think the military wives patch is a hard one as its VERY tribe-like, so I might just leave it tbh.

No don’t change OP ! Maybe big groups aren’t for you . They aren’t for me !! I do sometimes look at the big women friendships groups on social media when they are all socializing together and think aww maybe that would be fun but no I prefer small groups, or one on one or my mixed male / female ( small group )

I do also have bitch face though 😂😂 this deffo doesn’t always help when first getting to know people

Big groups can be cliquey and weird anyway especially when you are just on the edge of the group. I am socially awkward so no not for me !

I think there can be elements of social climbing going on sometimes with groups. My dc went to school in a village with a lot of quite wealthy families. I realised belatedly that I was excluded or dropped after people knew where I lived.
But also there's a lot of bond forming behind the scenes that goes on by dropping in to each others for a glass of wine and a chat.

that the fact you cast your working friend adrift because she started working FT. Seemingly you just didnt have that much in common anymore

We didn't cast her adrift because she works (we all ended up going to work) we cast her adrift because she always weaponised it as a way to be superior over others, she would make comments like 'hard day at the gym today' or 'can't make the coffee as I am on the 5.30am train tomorrow' and generally separated herself from the group by making others uncomfortable.

If you are the only person working in the group then you will naturally miss many of the things they will be doing together. The bonding that will happen with everyday shared activities. It may be that they are not deliberately excluding you, but just that you are never there perhaps?

By the way you will never be able to keep up with the endless coffees/drinks/dinners etc - it becomes incredibly tiring even when you are not working long hours.
Surely easier and better for you, especially with a busy lifestyle to choose one or two thoroughly decent friends and avoid the group dynamics altogether?

I think probably I just need to accept that this group of women arent 'my people'....