Pregnant and about to be made redundant, when to get a lawyer involved

[Pregnantandredundant]

I’m six months pregnant and think I am about to be made redundant. My view is that decisions appear to have been made because I am pregnant, and there are a couple of other issues I want sorting before I accept redundancy.

Consultation has just started. At what point do I get a lawyer involved?

I’d do it now.

Are you the only person being made redundant? Is it just your role? If not it’s very hard to prove it’s because you’re pregnant.

Thanks. No, not just me, large scale redundancies.

The circumstances lead me to believe the decision to make me redundant is due to my pregnancy.

Can you prove it's pregnancy related?

If it’s large scaled redundancies, why do you think it’s because you’re pregnant?

I’d rather not talk circumstances on an open forum.

Just want to know the appropriate point to bring in a lawyer.

It would be hard to prove if it's because of you're pregnancy due to large scale redundancies due to the current climate. How long have you been employed op?

Okay, well if there are mass redundancies it will probably be almost impossible to prove it’s because your pregnant so a lawyer would be expensive and most likely a waste of time.

Unless there is a very good, solid case with evidence I would just let it go. Discrimination is very hard to prove as it is.

What are you hoping to achieve by involving a lawyer? Are you wanting to go for unfair dismissal? Have you been given details of the redundancy package yet?

Have you actually been made redundant yet? Have you been put at risk/notice of redundancy? You can speak to a lawyer now, but until you are made redundant or put at risk I'm not sure what they can actually do.

Are you past the qualifying 25 weeks in your pregnancy? If so even if you are made redundant, they still have to legally pay your SMP if you are over 25 weeks when made redundant. I was put at risk when I was pregnant, although I was redeployed into another role in the same company.

Do you want to stay in the job?

Do you feel you've been singled out in your department/rank?

Are you in receipt of some 'let's get rid of her now she's knocked up' emails??

Within the current climate, and a mass redundancy it's going to take a lot of proof that it's purely based on pregnancy.

Chat to ACAS first, then decide if yiu need legal advice.

Hi OP,
Why not start by challenging the company yourself pointing out why you think that they are breaking the law.
ACAS can provide guidance (obviously I don't know how accessible their support is in the current climate)
www.acas.org.uk/your-maternity-leave-pay-and-other-rights/while-youre-on-maternity-leave - see the redundancy section.

If you are confident that discrimination is occurring then you can warn them that you will be taking the case to an employment tribunal.
www.gov.uk/courts-tribunals/employment-tribunal

I'm not sure if you would need legal representation at all but at this stage I would just make sure that you tell them your legal rights, that you are well aware of them and that you won't roll over if they are ignored.

Advice now.

I was made redundant at 8 months pregnant. I was one of 19 redundancies. About 5/6 involved pregnant or women on mat leave.

Took informal professional advice. Told not clear cut. Decided not to fight. If you do: Make sure you get your SMP if past 25 weeks and try to angle to sign a compromise agreement for more £ (ie sign away your rights).

Tribunal whilst pregnant could be v stressful.

If they're clever, it won't be easy to link redundancy to your pregnancy.

Good luck.

So sorry this is happening to you! They tried to do this to me, it literally made me so unwell I was vomiting all the time and not sleeping! I was furloughed at the time and In one of my phone calls with the big managers I lost it, crying and everything saying they are making me ill and I think they just don’t want to pay maternity- they said they would speak to HR.
I got a phone call back slightly later after my manager spoke to the head of HR and now my job is still at risk but I’m furloughed until October when I’m due and then I go on maternity. Can’t save as much as I would have but means I don’t have to worry about finding a job until after the baby is born.
Honestly just kick off and say the same thing as I did. It’s horrible that they would even think about making a pregnant woman redundant when in the current situation she has even less chance to find a job whilst so pregnant. Good luck!

If it’s large scale then that seems less obvious that you’re being made redundant because you’re pregnant and more because they are marking lots of people pregnant in the current economic climate.

You can call Citizens Advice for free : (they have an excellent website too).
They can talk you through the process and ask you trigger questions to help you decide what to do. It is all confidential. If they think its a pregnancy related redundancy they may also know lawyers in their region you can call for a quick chat, pro bono.

A poster below asked a good question.....so what? It is not a flippant question. Think about it carefully.....decide what you wnat to get out of anything.

Good luck.

Oh, and keep a note now of all communications, comments etc from company.

This is going to be very hard op, if it was just you it would be different, but mass redundancies and you’d need to prove they would have kept you if you weren’t pregnant. Are you sure that’s the case?

Anyway the time for a lawyer is now.

Definitely ACAS then check to see if your house insurance has Legal Protection. If you have a 51% chance or more of a successful claim, they will take your case on.

Congratulations on your pregnancy.

I was made redundant while pregnant, with the great phrase 'we need a smaller team, and therefore that team needs to be incredibly reliable. You've just been off on maternity leave, and now you tell us in 6 months you're going to be off again' - doesn't get more clear cut than that, but I didn't have it recorded, and as it was gender discrimination which means you need to pay legal fees up front, no win no fee isn't allowed. I was told to budget £12k, with no guarantee of seeing that again and a cap of a year's salary if I won, it wasn't worth the risk or stress for me so while morally it was reprehensible I had to let it go.

I wouldn't pay a lawyer just yet. First thing to do is decide ideally what your goal is. Do you want to stay in the role, do you want to leave with a settlement agreement etc.

Secondly gather your evidence. If there are mass redundancies it will be hard to prove it's about your pregnancy without emails etc or the process deviates from what it should be and you can negotiate that way.

As pp have saud there are options for free help so I'd look into those first for impartial advice.

Good luck.

I find it very irritating when people want advice but then behave like the commenters are being intrusive for asking questions.

Then don’t come to an ‘open forum’ seeking opinions/advice that nobody can accurately provide without understanding a least a tiny bit about your situation. Just do what everyone else does and blur the exact details.

‘An email was accidentally sent to me by my manager saying they hate me because I’m pregnant and wants to fire me because they cba with my mat leave’

Becomes:

‘I have written evidence that my upcoming mat leave is a factor in my being made redundant’

At least give people something to work with. It’s like saying ‘I want to know how to bake a cake’ but refusing to specify what type of cake, you may still get some decent basic, generic advice but no one can really offer you tailored or specific advice.

What a nightmare Op, really feel for you. Are you part of a Union? Does your household insurance have legal advice?

It'll be incredibly hard to prove that you have been directly discriminated against if there are mass redundancies. But if you've got specific evidence then that would help.

Hi you don’t have to prove the discrimination you just gave to show that on the surface it appears there has been discrimination. The employer has the burden of proof in this case to prove discriminatory practices and decisions did not occur. Get a lawyer ASAP. They will guide you through the rest of the process. It’s important you appeal the decision too. Make sure you ask to see the scoring used and any notes paperwork etc. Keep copies of everything. Good luck

you don’t have to prove the discrimination you just gave to show that on the surface it appears there has been discrimination. The employer has the burden of proof in this case to prove discriminatory practices and decisions did not occur

That’s semantics, showing discrimination is likely is really what is being said, however with mass redundancies it’s very easy for an employer to show it was not discrimination. Because they won’t all be pregnant. In addition they will have background on how they treated previous pregnant employees.

It’s very difficult unless she has something concrete here, because the company will have so much evidence otherwise on their side. That’s why people are saying “prove” .

Without more info on why she feels it’s discrimination it’s hard for people to judge, but if she wishes a lawyer now would be the right time.

Without any detail people can't advise. If it's mass redundancies you'll be extremely hard pressed to be able to prove it was discrimination. Personally I would save the money towards my mat leave, unless you have actual evidence, but as you won't say no one can tell you.