Sensory Issues Symptoms?

[CuriousKittyKat]

Name changed for this, have not used this name before at all.

Good evening everyone, hope you are all coping with the current situation. I'm home-schooling my children and my middle DS's behaviour has been more emphasised to me perhaps as a part of this. I've often wondered whether he is not completely NT. School have not picked up on anything although one TA with a SEN child has had an informal chat (prompted by me) in which they agreed that there might be 'something', and my DM who works with adults with learning disabilities has also mentioned a few things. I'm interested to know if it is a possibility.
Here are some of the things that he does. He is 8 and is still really reluctant to use cutlery, he prefers (despite constant nagging, encourgament etc) to feel and touch his food and use his fingers. I've watched him pick icecream up between his fingers and 'smear' it between them before eating. He'll dismantle any food that can be and eat it separately, so icing off of cake, chocolate off of biscuits, cheese off pizza bases, picks peas out of rice etc. He has always been very touchy with himself and always has his hands down his pants ( he has two brothers so I know it is more prevalent with him). He LOVES going in the sea and will want to be in the water no matter what the weather and temperature. His record is early February for a full dip. BUT he does not know when he has had enough and has to be forcibly removed whilst going blue!
He continually makes random noises, which I have especially noticed when he is working on school work. One is a funny 'stuttering' noise, the sort you make to imitate a machine gun. The others is a strange mouth clicking noise, a bit like beat boxing. He seems unaware he is doing it and will continue even if asked not to. He is very particular about what he will and won't wear. He has some items of clothing that he absolutely loves and will wear when ever they are clean. Of the three children he is the one that is a total PIA to get ready (although to be fait this is much improved than last year). Literally being asked multiple times to brush teeth, find shoes etc and STILL not doing it and getting extremely upset when an adult is cross by this. If he is reading a book he is completely unable (seemingly) to be aware of what is going on around him, to an extreme extent. He can not disengage from reading, even if tempted by a treat for example chocolate. He is also extremely sociable, to the extent that it is beyond what is reasonable for his age, for example, whilst shoe shopping a few months ago for his brother's shoes he climbed on top of the back of the assistants back to give her a hug whilst she was measuring his brothers feet. I had to drag him off, he just did not seem to understand that was not acceptable. I Could understand it in a toddler but not at his age?
So, am I making something out of nothing, are these just quirks in a normal range of behaviour, or is there something else going on?

Don't know where the bloody paragraphs have gone, sorry.

I don’t think it’s unreasonable to query these quirks

Thank you @Paddingtonthebear he gets on at school just fine (bright little wotsit) so I would pursue getting any sort of official diagnosis as I don't feel it's necessary. I'm just curious if anyone lese has experienced these behaviours and if they 'mean' anything other than he's a little bit odd!

not pursue.

I think it is worth investigating.

DS1 cannot stand trousers to the extent that I gave up buying them years ago.
Muddles hot and cold.
Very particular about fabrics of clothes.
Chews at things for comfort
Was a bitey toddler and occasionally bit at his DB until 6
Sensitve to noise of certain pitches.
Unaware of how his behaviour is contradictory to what he expects of others. He's allowed to sing, but no one else can.
Sensitive to food textures and combinations.
Missed most of his DB's tramopline park birthday party in a stand off over tooth brushing (aged 8)

He has diagnoses of ASD and dyspraxia.
There is history of communication issues, but generally he functions and masks through normality.

Your DS shares some similar characteristics to my DD (nearly 6). She has ASD and has quite a few sensory sensitivities alongside this.
She also picks up ice cream, breakfast cereals etc and very rarely eats with a knife and fork. Foods can't touch eachother and she loves to squish textures such as jelly. It looks as though she has bad terrible manners as she will often squish, lick and explore the properties of food but not actually eat it.
She's recently started to smell me and sometimes lick me in affection but she is v sensitive to smells and will tell me affectionately she likes the way I smell.
She will spend hours and hours playing with water, soapy foam and the like. She has a very limited diet (common with ASD children) but she often eats playdough, yesterday she put print stick all over her hand and licked it off. No matter what we say it seems a compulsion. She also picks her skin at the moment which we are trying to discourage
.
She also likes to bite her sleeves and her hair so has a chew necklace.
When younger she didn't like strip lights and some clothing although seems to have got over this.
She is also overly friendly but often misses social cues.
We told her paediatrician and they said that it is often something that exists alongside ASD. We often see it as one of her quirks.
I recently posted in the SEN chat about DD and a poster linked a fantastic booklet. Even if your DS doesn't have sensory processing disorder or ASD you may find some of the tips useful. I will try and link and hope you find it useful.

go.mumsnet.com/?xs=1&id=470X1554755&url=www.nhsggc.org.uk/kids/resources/information-packs/making-sense-of-sensory-behaviour-falkirk-council-booklet/

Yes, I would agree that those quirks all presenting together would be worth investigating. Ds3, who is 10, has or has had several of them and has ASD and dyslexia.

I recognise many of those sensory issues from my own DCs' behaviour - they have ASD/ADHD.

If I had to guess, I'd say ADHD seems worth looking into first. There's heaps of crossover between ASD and ADHD anyway, but the reading thing sounds a lot like ADHD hyperfocus (although it might also be something to do with executive functioning and difficulty transitioning between activities, which could be either).

You say it's not an issue at school, and that's great. But it's still worth looking into, especially with the involuntary noises, because my DS had loads of issues once he got to secondary school and they were expected to work in complete silence as he just couldn't!

Thanks for all your responses, and the link. You've reminded me of a few more especially the biting/chewing clothes thing. He used to suck and bite the collars and cuff of school shirts and jumpers and gnaw them ragged, though much less now.
He also went through a prolonged phase of licking us all, despite strong negative reactions!
I also recognise the 'stand-offs' in one particular incident over an icecream he was denied there was a spectacular refusal to get in the car and a prolonged tantrum of epic proportions, only stopped by me driving off in the car with the other children and leaving him with DH who told him they would have to walk home (I was waiting round the corner).
And fiddling with things, can not resist picking anything up within reach and bloody fiddling with it or making noise with it.
As I said, at the moment there is no issue at school and he is exceeding targets etc. He's generally a happy little chap, but should this change I suppose we would try and see if there were better way to support him.

I have one ds diagnosed with ASC and one who I suspect is but have not yet sought a diagnosis as he doesn't have the anxiety difficulties that his older brother has. Both dc exhibit the same sensory seeking behaviours on your list to varying degrees.

It really is worth investigating before your ds has to deal with the transition to high school. That's when everything went tits up for DS1, he didn't cope with it well at all. I'll be seeking an assessment for DS2 before he goes to secondary so that he, the school and us parents have the information and tools to support him through the transition.

@MattBerrysHair I'd be interested to know, if you feel like sharing, what particular elements of the transition proved difficult.

Definitely worth investigating further.
In our area a Paediatrician would need to refer to an OT, but I know these things work differently in different areas of the country.

Ds1 struggles with change and knowing what is expected of him in new situations. The unfamiliar is very frightening for him until he has adjusted and acclimatised to it. The sensory overload of a busy big new school full of people he didn't know (he finds the dinner hall particularly loud and panic inducing), changing classrooms up to 8 times a day, higher academic expectations and homework etc. His anxiety went through the roof and he started talking about about wishing he didn't exist/wanting to die during meltdowns. He was on the waiting list for an ASC assessment for 2 years and finally got his diagnosis in the November after he started 1st year. The school didn't put much structured support in place until after the diagnosis, it was very wishy washy and vague, so the first half term for him was dreadful.

DS1 got his diagnosis in December (y4), but we can't get anywhere with applying for an EHCP at present... so that will be y5 which is now getting late for having things established for secondary application and transition.

All the secondaries within 10 miles are startchy about their collar, tie and blazer uniform... DS can not even wear trousers and only wears shirts and polo t-shirt all year, not even a soft sweatshirt (has to be fluffy not fleecy)
He masks through school (I get the fall out at home) but my concern is how much more full-on secondaries are with different class combinations, higher expectations and weaker relationships from less time together. Returning to school after months and months of quietly pleasing himself at home is also interesting...

The diagnosis process was commenced in Setember y3 after a hideous summer in the build up and aftermath of SATs.

we can't get anywhere with applying for an EHCP at present

@BogRollBOGOF do you mean because of lockdown?

I would apply for assessment as a parent ASAP if the school aren't able to help at the moment so it's at least in the system - although the EHCP timetable isn't quite as strict during lockdown, LAs still have to process EHCP requests as soon as they're able, so even if they can't assess/finalise it now, it's definitely worth getting in there with the request. Other people will still be applying so the longer you leave it, the further behind in the queue DS will be.

I’m sat here nodding along as my youngest DD exhibits most of these traits - I’ve been raising stuff with school since yr1, she’s now in yr4. Each time I get brushed off as they just don’t “see” any of it at school as she’s bright so ticks the academic boxes and uses up all her emotional energy masking so I get the full fall out at home. I’m so torn whether to push for an assessment as although the Senco is supportive the teachers just don’t think it’s needed and she is easily managed by them with usual teaching methods plus I’m doing a lot of work at home teaching her coping strategies.

However I’m really scared of the secondary school transition as my eldest DD is NT in yr8, and I saw how hard she found it. My nephew was diagnosed age 4, and every year my sister had to fight so hard to keep his TA support, but it did give them the option to apply to any secondary school and he’s made a brilliant transition to year 7 this year(before lock down), to a school out of catchment. Having seen how hard she has had to fight every step of the way for a child that was fully statemented at a young age, obviously displays behaviours daily that are not NT, had full 1:2 TA support yet because he’s bright the support was never offered always fought for. I just can’t see my DD getting any help despite years of the application process so I’m working more on supporting her to develop strategies to cope in a NT world.

he gets on at school just fine (bright little wotsit) so I would pursue getting any sort of official diagnosis as I don't feel it's necessary

OP, I was just thinking about my own situation and this thread came to mind, so I just wanted to add my personal experience in case it's at all useful...

I was diagnosed with ADHD quite recently (late 30s). I've always been bright and very academic, straight As at school, 1st class degree, good career, etc. Lots of people were really surprised when I explained I'd struggled all my life because on paper I look quite successful. But my CV obviously only shows the good bits. It doesn't show all the times I've come a hair's breadth from failing, all the hard work I've had to put in to learn social skills that everyone else seemed to just 'get', all the struggles I have doing really basic domestic things despite being quite bright in other areas, and most importantly, all the ways I've always known I was different but couldn't put my finger on exactly how or why. It's just something I've always known. It's been a bit shit having that hanging over me for the past 30-odd years so the diagnosis came as a massive relief, personally.

I've always addressed each of my issues (social, domestic, work, academic, etc) as a discrete problem which I've attempted to resolve, but I never realised they were all connected. The doctor said my intelligence seemed to have masked a lot of my issues as I learned a whole heap of coping strategies to cover up my difficulties. But it was still exhausting and it obviously affected my self-esteem as everything felt like such a struggle, especially when I looked at other people (who weren't as bright) inexplicably breezing through life.

In terms of sensory issues, one example from my adult life is that I would often avoid social situations that I knew I would find difficult, like busy pubs, as there's just too much going on to concentrate on one person talking. I had my hearing tested as I was 100% convinced I couldn't hear people in this environment, but my hearing was time. Which left me even more perplexed as to why I couldn't follow a basic conversation in busy settings and added to my lifelong theme of "WTF is wrong with me?"

The great thing about knowing my issues are caused by ADHD is partly that I have a better idea of how to solve each problem, and also that I can articulate them to others so they actually understand. So with busy pubs and noisy restaurants, before the diagnosis I would just make excuses not to go and would try to avoid socialising in those places, but I couldn't explain why so it just made me seem standoffish or unsociable (or just plain weird!). Whereas now when I get invited to those places, I can explain my sensory issues and suggest an alternative venue, or at the very least, people would understand why I either decline to go or why I'm not contributing much to the conversation.

Basically, having the diagnosis makes me seem less of an oddball to others which helps me socially, it's made me far less harsh on myself for all my shortcomings and I've become more realistic about my difficulties and more aware of how to overcome them. I'm also expending far less energy on (1) musing about what's wrong with me and (2) trying to be like everyone else.

Obviously everyone's different and I'm sure loads of people get through life fine without a diagnosis (several of my older adult family members who quite clearly have ADHD seem quite happy - they're just viewed by others as completely crackers eccentric), but I just wanted to offer my perspective.

OP, this really does sound like sensory processing issues. Either as stand alone or as part of other challenges. And like others, I would highly recommend seeking support now rather than waiting until it is ctively an issue.

Ds' school has been supportive but we have been unable to get him any support via nhs or other state programmes. However, taking him to a private ot, while expensive, was incredibly helpful. He completed 16 weeks of 1-2-1 sessions and it has made a noticeable difference. We still have challenges, but progress has been astonishing.

Your reference to the mornings really resonated me. That was also our experience. The school also struggled with his inability to organise himself and manage regular routines. Just getting that process nailed has been honestly life changing in terms of experience at both home and school. Not least because we and teachers are no longer constantly frustrated. We also got him seamless socks which helped and I honestly believe that part of his resistance to getting dressed was the dread he felt abou4t putting socks and shoes on.

Things aren't perfect. His shoes don't fit and I can't buy any online as he is so sensitive to how they fi4t we have to try every pair in a shop before we find any. School is still a challenge. And there are other things. But it has been amazing and we will p3robably take him back for another course at least annually to address specific challenges as they come up. It also helped him to understand. So, for example, he finds having a tutor less stressful now because he doesn't see it as being stupid but understands it's about having a brain that works differently.

For those whose children seem to ‘cope’ at primary, I would urge you to seek support as soon as possible. The overwhelming sensory and social demands of secondary: public transport, corridor chaos, changing rooms and teachers every hour and the complexities of the social ‘dance’ are exhausting in a way that the demands of a well-run and child- friendly primary are not. My DC loved school until age 11 and masking and lack of co-morbid learning difficulties meant that they were considered an exemplary pupil. This has spectacularly unravelled at secondary, particularly with regard to peers and friendships. I wish I had not allowed my concerns about friendships and communication to be brushed off because DC was a high achiever academically. In hindsight, there were sensory clues but puberty and the increased social demands of secondary have caused huge distress and the opportunities for early intervention and transition have been lost.