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Original poster

Paying for child care during COVID

64 replies

Peter1977 · 07/05/2020 21:05

Hi can anyone give me some advice please, during this time I am still working but my wife has been furloughed as we have 3kids at home and working from home was impossible. We have a just turned 1year old who usually gives to a child minder and sometimes her sister who is 6goes there also after school. We didn't feel comfortable sending them to the child minder as wife was home and it just adds more risk.
The child minder has now got in touch and says she expects 100% pay during this time even though she hasn't had the kids and won't until all this calms down. She is a lovely lady and great at her job and we don't want to fall out so it's very awkward,but everyone I talk to seems to only be paying a retaining fee to keep the place and there child minder is then claiming.
Please help on this very tricky situation.

OP posts:
user2085372673 · 07/05/2020 21:12

Is the setting open and would the cm take her?

Personally, if your wife is being paid, I think you should be paying her. You could pay her the same % of her salary that she is getting.

What do you imagine the childminder will be doing for money if you don’t pay her, and surely if you don’t you will effectively be profiting from this whilst she faces financial ruin?

Could you go back to her with a negotiation?

Feelinghistoric · 07/05/2020 21:14

Can’t the childminder get government support as self-employed?

Xmasbaby11 · 07/05/2020 21:20

We've been paying our childminder in full during this time, however it's wraparound care so only £450 a month. She's been open and happy to take the kids but we chose to keep them home as we are both wfh now. As soon as restrictions lift a bit we will send them as it's soo hard getting work done.

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MimiSunshine · 07/05/2020 21:30

If you’re both essentially earning your salary perhaps with a20% reduction on your wife’s part then I think you should pay her something.
Why would you not? Financially your family must be ok so why would you not pass that on and support your childminder fo maintain an income?

Original poster
Peter1977 · 07/05/2020 21:51

Yes agreed with most of the above.but we certainly are not profiting from it, my wife has the children to look after which is the service we would be paying for. Feels like paying for something you are not getting. Yes I think she is claiming but that hasn't come through yet,and yes we would definitely be open to paying a % to the CM as we would still want to keep our babies place.

OP posts:
Lotsalotsagiggles · 07/05/2020 21:54

Our childminder was advised by ofsted that she can't charge for a service she can't legally deliver right now (apart from key workers)

Many nurseries have charged and the CMA have rules these need to be refunded

I'd question it..

Lotsalotsagiggles · 07/05/2020 21:57

Here's the link www.gov.uk/government/news/covid-19-cma-to-investigate-cancellation-policy-concerns

Message me if you like as used to work for the professional association

Original poster
Peter1977 · 07/05/2020 22:05

Thank you for the link, I will definitely be looking at that.

OP posts:
Stronger76 · 07/05/2020 23:31

Feels like paying for something you are not getting.

Bit like your wife's employer...

KKSlider · 07/05/2020 23:42

If the wife is furloughed the employer isn't paying her, the government is, but you crack on with your dig.

OP, the best course of action is to talk it out with your childminder and agree a retainer rather than full fees especially now you have the information provided in links posted by PP.

YippieKayakOtherBuckets · 07/05/2020 23:53

We are paying our childminder a 50% retainer.

2kool4skool · 08/05/2020 00:09

And when the childminder gets the gov help in July then what? She’s allowed to profiteer? Meanwhile parents to their job and hers but pay her for nothing? I’m amazed she’s had the cheek to demand full pay from someone who’s now having to do her job for her. Indefinitely. Flip it round. If parents weren’t getting paid, would she still work for no pay? No. So why should parents still pay her not to work? This contract thing works both ways. That’s the point.

MimiSunshine · 08/05/2020 05:20

To those saying the CM should get Gov help in July. Would your rent / mortgage / food bills wait that long before you could pay them?

OP your wife isn’t doing the CMs job. She’s looking after her own children. The Gov have stepped in to ensure your wife gets paid without having to work.,
Many self employed won’t actually get the same level of support no matter what the changes to the scheme now say so have a think about how you feel about your attitude

Wannabegreenfingers · 08/05/2020 05:34

I'm paying in full. She would have them if needed, but I can work from home so keeping them with me. I'm still being payed, so seemed only fare to keep paying her.

Dangermouse80 · 08/05/2020 06:27

I would have thought it sensible to pay her 20% as a retainer. This being on the assumption that she will apply for the government grant. That way her money is effectively being topped up from the 80%

Prior to getting the grant in June, the government have offered business interruption loans.

Otherwise surely she will be effectively being paid twice without looking after the kids?

YouCantBeSadHoldingACupcake · 08/05/2020 06:46

You state in your op that you don't feel comfortable sending the dc to the childminders. Does this mean she is still working and willing to take them? If so then yes you should be paying 100% as it is your choice not to use the childcare. If she is not working then a retainer would be more reasonable

ScarfLadysBag · 08/05/2020 06:54

If she's accepting full pay and then presumably claiming government support for SE then she's actually going to be making even more money than usually!

What she should do, if the issue is cash flow, is take the money now but it goes towards future care for your DC, so when she reopens you have a couple of months' worth in the 'bank' as it were, as she will have received her 80% by then.

No one I know is paying full rate for childcare they aren't getting. Some are paying a retainer fee, but no one is paying 100%.

ScarfLadysBag · 08/05/2020 06:55

Oh I didn't notice that she's still open. That might change things, though I'm not sure what the situation is with childminders/childcare settings opening for children who don't technically need to be there.

malovitt · 08/05/2020 07:12

Childminders are only allowed to take the children of key workers and if one parent is at home, the children are expected to stay at home with them.
Are either of you key workers?
Not all childminders are eligible for the grant but she should know by now whether she is and should be able to work out from her previous tax returns roughly how much she will be entitled to.

Original poster
Peter1977 · 08/05/2020 07:21

Thanks all again for the advice,a couple of points tho,
1 my wife isn't getting paid to do nothing,it is from the government,which I will also say is the first time either of us have ever been out of work in over 20years of working so please don't be so bitter.
My mother once said, if you haven't got anything nice to say,don't say anything at all. Maybe some need to take that advice going forward and step away from the keyboard.
2nd point I would like to make, is she is not getting payed to look after our own children we understand they are our kids,she is getting paid again by the government for the first time in our lives so that this family has a roof over its head, please the person that suggested that take point 1 as well.

But for all the others that advised on both sides of the story thanks for your time,some very good points.

OP posts:
malovitt · 08/05/2020 07:23

Quote below fromGov website -

‘Schools, and all childcare providers including childminders, are therefore being asked to continue to provide care for a limited number of children - children who are vulnerable, and children whose parents are critical to the Covid-19 response and cannot be safely cared for at home'

'Cannot be safely looked after at home' is different to 'it's difficult to work from home because my kids are interrupting my conference calls and I can’t concentrate'

malovitt · 08/05/2020 07:25

So it looks like from your situation that she wouldn't be allowed to take your children anyway.

malovitt · 08/05/2020 07:31

Your childminder cannot ask you to pay 100% of your invoice as your contract will not cover this situation.

As a general rule, events like war, riots and global pandemics are considered to be ‘force majeure’ events which means that the normal obligations of your contract may change or not apply at all.
Asking parents to pay childminders in full during ‘force majeure’ events would not likely to be legally enforceable in the courts and may be considered by some to be morally and ethically wrong.
You could offer a percentage as a retainer or ask that any payments given now are offset against future care?

ivfgottostaypositive · 08/05/2020 07:33

I experienced the same with my childminder and unfortunately had to give notice as although I was furloughed and due to the cap my income had halved she was still expecting full fees of £800 a month despite being closed. Really disappointed in her but to be honest but a tad relieved as I've found the childminders in my area to act like a bit of a cartel - refusing to sign up the tax free account or 30 hours as due to supply and demand they can pretty much dictate terms and conditions, having to pay for all holidays etc.

Original poster
Peter1977 · 08/05/2020 07:33

Does it matter that I'm a key worker, even though my wife is at home furloughed to have the children. We really wouldn't want to send our baby into any extra risk so that's why she was kept home from all this.

OP posts:
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