It’s time the world knew that Britain is not a land of milk and honey

[Dowser]

Then these migrant tragedies might be averted.
The uk is a fabulous place to live and I feel very privileged to have been born here and to still live here but it is not a cheap place to live and it can be very difficult to scratch a living.
My relative is now single and fallen on hard times. After a 6 month stint in a hostel which was hell on Earth, he’s now got a flat and on UC
I rang to see how he was doing the other day and was shocked to find he can’t pay his bills.i know last winter he didn’t put the heating on and ended up very sick
His rent is paid but even without heating on yet he’s already going under. Water rates are £45 a month..we pay half that for our house.
It’s an 8 month wait for a meter.

I mentioned food. He said he’s starving and has lost weight.
He’s 64 . His pension kicks In When he will be 67 . He’s unable to find a job and is constantly sick...when a short while ago before this happened he was as fit as butchers dog.
You can’t live on what you’re given he said. We live in a high unemployment area and there’s not a lot of jobs around for ageing 64 year olds with dodgy knees.

I agree with you OP. Going on holiday, you can see that in some places Britain is idolised, the culture, the opportunities, the language. It's a hangover from a past that doesn't exist any more.

Then I walk down my local high street and see so many homeless people, more than ever before, lots of them clearly immigrants who were no doubt promised so much more than sleeping in a doorway in the freezing cold and the rain. Yes, for many people, it may well be better than war or famine, but I'm sure it wasn't what they were expecting and it shouldn't be happening.

The fact that anyone is struggling in a supposedly rich country is a disgrace. Nowadays you're ok as long as you're fit and healthy right up to nearly 70. It's a huge worry.

Being very poor here is no easier than being very poor anywhere else

It really is worse elsewhere!

If your relative goes to A&E unwell he will get free treatment. If he gets an illness he will get free treatment, or perhaps only have to pay prescription charges. If he calls the ambulance, police or fire brigade they will come (perhaps later than ideal, but there is a free emergency service). He had free school education. The roads are maintained, the rubbish is collected. If he is a victim of crime he won't have to bribe the police to investigate and he may qualify for legal aid. He is less likely to be a victim of crime than in many other countries. The electricity supply is reliable, the water supply is safe to drink. He gets some benefits from the government - he finds this inadequate for his expenses, but in many countries he would get zero. He isn't worried about a war, civil war, famine or hideous infectious disease outbreak. He has been offered free vaccinations against several diseases. If there is a natural disaster or major incident, there are highly trained emergency services to respond.

I agree that several of these services have declined in recent years, but they are head and shoulders above what is available in many poor countries.

I have sympathy for poor in this country but it is in no way comparable to living in Somalia or post war Syria or similar countries.

Also migrants are usually younger and seeking work, often from countries where they have very limited opportunities to earn. Hence why they take such significant risks trying to get here, because the alternative is worse.

I found this book very interesting, it follows migrants from their home country to Europe. Yes I am concerned by the scale of immigration to UK but if I was in migrant's shoes I would very much want to travel to UK rather than live in somalia whole life due to accident of birth.
www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01BKQXNAQ/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1&tag=mumsnetforu03-21

The UK is chosen often because they have links here or speak the language to some extent. There are plenty of Asylum Seekers in other EU countries as they take in far more than we do. Remember that we in the UK are rich BECAUSE others are poor. Shitty trade agreements, wars that we started, the legacy of colonialism. You need to stop reading the daily mail and research world economics . I am so glad that I was born as a woman in the UK. It really is the land of milk and honey for women compared to the developing and some parts of the developed world.

Thanks for that book recommendation @TheMouldNeverBotheredMeAnyway.

But your relative OP has presumably been brought up here and would have had opportunities throughout their life to make the best of what is available. And at least they will get a pension and thank god for UC otherwise how else would they have access to any money at all?

In my home country (I'm talking Central Europe) there are families (including children) who have lost their homes and live in makeshift accommodation in forests in all sorts of weather. Families with no proper doors, horrible circumstances, (think no working flushable seat, no proper bathroom etc), children missing out on school as they don't have shoes.... Would that situation not make people risk to try and get a better life elsewhere?

It amazes me that so many migrants want to come to a country that we are led to believe is so full of 'isms' and 'ists'.

why don't you help your relative? isn't that what families are for?

Ponoka7

The title of the post and the first line
"Then these migrant tragedies might be averted." - most definitely open the issue of immigration and as several other posters have also referred to immigration I'm not sure why you have singled me out.

I could have qualified my comment to make it clearer - I think the reason many immigrants wish to come to the UK, is that they have heard of Britain. We had an empire which ruled many countries from which immigrants come. English is widely spoken. The UK has a high international profile. I would suggest many possible immigrants from Vietnam, Afghanistan and Africa etc have not heard of Luxembourg or Lichtenstein so would not think of heading there.

I am aware of the poor living conditions experienced by disadvantaged people both here in the UK and other parts of the world. I do not for one moment begrudge anyone wanting to improve their lives or those of their family.

I agree with the OP - the UK is not perfect, it is not a land of milk and honey - unless you happen to come from somewhere worse. But expectations of illegal immigrants can be very high and the reality of the situation when they arrive here must be crushing for them.

In our experience it's not the land of milk and honey, but compared to many places in the world, it really is!

Benefits aren't always enough to live on, but at least they exist. They're a hell of a lot better than what you'd get living in a refugee camp on foreign aid. They're better than the war, famine, or genuine lack of opportunity that some people have to face. There is work available for fit, healthy adults that want it.

Immigration is the price we are paying for the past Empire years.

Also this. We show the world our wealth and our royalty, have half the world knowing our language, and then wonder why they choose to come here rather than stop elsewhere.

Yes it can be hard to live here, people are struggling and some people have to survive on very little. But it's still a democracy, where everyone is entitled to their basic human rights. The majority of migrants don't come here to get rich, they come here to be safe.

• But why is it the UK? Do these traffickers offer the same to different countries?

France,Germany,Poland,Norway,Denmark

Why here? Surely these other countries are easier to get to as well*
It is not though, is it?

Spain has a huge illegal immigration rate due to its proximity to North Africa. Less than 20 km of ocean. So many people die trying to cross and so many arrive and the police and ambulances are waiting there.
You don’t hear about other countries in the UK though.
So you think everyone is coming here but they are not.

@LoveNote it's not just the UK that has people coming here seeking asylum - it's all across Europe. The UK isn't the end goal for every person looking for a better life, despite what it may seem like to some.

Look at Amsterdam, there has been a huge issue there with sex trafficking for years. Germany receives the most claims for asylum out of any European country, around 40%.

Excellent post TheMouldNeverBotheredMeAnyway

I’m sorry your relative is experiencing tough times OP but you can point him to a variety of agencies who can assist him. They exist in the U.K. and he has options. Many millions if not billions of people across the world would choose his lot over their own.

I thought we needed immingration to help fill all the jobs in hospitals, farms and so on? I think if we go round the world saying come here, work in our hospitals we have to expect that people are going to believe the hype and come for other reasons too and be exploited. My grandfathers nursing home was staffed almost entirely by phillipino care workers. All legitimate on proper visas, mainly sending money home to their children living with grandparents. It was state run.

@AnneLovesGilbert Can you point out these agencies to us please, and so the OP can pass them on? I can only think of charities, who are desperately under resourced trying to fill the gap the government has left. The food bank can give very short term support (3 x 3 day parcels in a year in my area), CAB can advise on benefit entitlement (which he is already claiming), what other agencies are there that might help?

I think it is unlikely anyone working in a nail bar here would get anywhere near 1800 P/M TBH. I cannot imagine the hardships people from Vietnam /China would undergo in their own country ! They are truly desperate for a fresh start here ,only to end up in this terrible plight . I realise many people in the UK are struggling ,but it is a relative struggle and there are still some benefits /housing support and so on Food banks for the very needy .These things would be very limited or poss non existant in their Country with jobs being very scarce there too.

I’m from a fairly poor country,

I was shocked at the price those poor parents paid to get their daughter to the UK. How many years would she have to work just to pay the sum back, much less earn a profit? Those smugglers steal lives by selling these lies.

Vietnam is a fast growing economy. It’s such a tragedy she died the way she did 😥

If this country wants to stop or decrease illegal migration they need to make it harder to work “cash in hand”. As it stands it is comically easy - see all the cheap nail bars, £5 car washes etc on every high street in London.

And I agree with PP. I grew up in South Africa. Want to know what your relative would be given there? Fuck all. And I hope he had the good fortune to be born white, otherwise his statistical chances of decent education, healthcare, employment etc during his lifetime would be minimal.

"Apparently" better employment prospects for the 50+ and disabled demographics will be one of the silver linings of Brexit. Maybe. We'll see.

However, I don't think that trafficked migrants without legal status are competing for those same jobs. They mostly work in the nail bars, car washes etc and aren't really free. Trafficking is a separate policy problem. There's probably not one single solution.

Poo I pressed post!

I’m from a fairly poor country, I was diagnosed with type one diabetes when I was five, as a result my newborn sister died as my parents couldn’t afford insulin and rehydration treatment when she became ill. I had an older brother who died of tetanus.

My Dad was a nurse and my mum had a market stall, there were others who were far far poorer than us, my siblings and I were some of the only children in the village who didn’t have jobs at the age of five.

We moved to the UK when I was eight, my Dad worked here for two years as a taxi driver and a factory worker before we came over. When we moved here it was the first time we didn’t share our home with another family, it was the first time everyone had enough to eat everyday, it was the first time my diabetes was properly managed and my parents knew their children wouldn’t die of dehydration or illnesses that are easily vaccinated against.

If you don’t have a job in Pakistan and you’re poor you die. In the UK you can get help with rent, JSA and NHS care as a minimum.

The illegal immigrants would receive no benefits at all, I know at least one woman in the truck was coming to be with her mother. I agree her life would have been harsh here.

Asylum seekers are not allowed to work and receive a tiny allowance, not a fun life but still their kids can go to school and not be blown up.

Has your relative explored disability benefits since he is not well enough to work? It is a scandal people who have worked all their lives are left in real poverty.

Being very poor here is no easier than being very poor anywhere else. Cold and hungry is cold and hungry
You’re kidding right?