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Original poster

Kitchen refurbishment and VAT

32 replies

VATquestion · 22/09/2019 12:55

Hello

I have started getting quotes for my kitchen refurbishment - it’s over 20 years old and in dire need of replacing. It’s not a huge job but will take about 5 to 7 days.

The first person who came to quote today seemed to really know his stuff and was recommended on Next Door. He seemed very efficient, and understood everything I was asking for and what it would entail.

However I asked about VAT and he said it would be charged if I didn’t pay cash basically. He asked if I could pay cash and I said yes, not really thinking. I wasn’t necessarily agreeing to his VAT set up, but I hadn’t had any time to think about what he was saying.

In any case, I haven’t received his quote yet, but I am thinking I have to say I can pay by bank transfer, so to add the VAT, and I would like a proper invoice.

Because it doesn’t seem that he wants cash other than to avoid paying VAT, because otherwise he would have said he wasn’t registered?

Or should I just not go with him at all? What if all the others who quote say the same?

Minefield it seems Sad.

OP posts:
Original poster
VATquestion · 22/09/2019 12:56

Made worse by the fact that I don’t have a lot of money, but I want to do what’s right.

OP posts:
Greatnorthwoods · 22/09/2019 13:01

It’s your choice basically. If he is a good guy he will be proud and honor his work regardless.

Personally I would pay cash, I try to pay cash as much as possible as it helps out both sides.

Panicmode1 · 22/09/2019 13:05

Your choice as the previous poster said. You would both be breaking the law - him for not declaring, and you if you know that's what he is doing.... so, up to you to make the choice which makes you comfortable....

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Home improvement
carrie74 · 22/09/2019 13:10

If you choose to pay cash you are agreeing to everything off the books - no receipt, no comeback, he declares no VAT or income tax. He can only charge VAT if he is VAT registered, he can't (legally) pick and choose which jobs are VATable or not.

If you're happy supporting tax evasion (which is illegal), go ahead and pay cash.

Original poster
VATquestion · 22/09/2019 13:10

Objectively it’s wrong though isn’t it. I will wait for his quote and then if I think I can afford 20% on top of it, i will ask to pay VAT and be invoiced. Otherwise I will have to just say no to him doing the job. Shame because I thought he was great.

Not sure if he even accepts anything other than cash, but I guess I will have to ask.

OP posts:
Original poster
VATquestion · 22/09/2019 13:13

Or should I tell him now before he has put his quote together?

OP posts:
Csleeptime · 22/09/2019 13:14

He asks for a price in cash, pay that price in cash. Don't ask other questions, save yourself some money and enjoy your new kitchen.

jewel1968 · 22/09/2019 13:15

If he is willing to not charge you VAT to do a job that he is legally obliged to do (assuming he is VAT registered) what else do you think he is prepared to do? Ask yourself how reliable he would be if there was an aspect of his work you weren't happy with? Would he honour the contract with you?

MonsteraCheeseplant · 22/09/2019 13:16

Asking for trouble OP!

Csleeptime · 22/09/2019 13:20

Sorry I misread it says you know he is VAT registered. Well yes then that would be wrong.

666onmyhead · 22/09/2019 13:20

Totally flouting the law! So who's to say this will be a safe layout and installation? Sounds too dodgy for me.

Stay safe, spend wisely and avoid cowboys when they offer deals like this.
I'd be very tempted to report him to trading standards!

Her0utdoors · 22/09/2019 13:22

Is he actually VAT registered though, or is he hoping that those who don't want to be tax evaders will happily pay him an extra 20%? My kitchen fitter was excellent, very busy work wise, but didn't cross the threshold for being VAT registered earnings wise.

Original poster
VATquestion · 22/09/2019 13:25

Sorry I misread it says you know he is VAT registered. Well yes then that would be wrong.

I am assuming he is because he said that a bank transfer would involve paying VAT. And yes I hadn’t even thought that he might not be VAT registered but just want the extra 20% Shock.

So the question is, shall I just not go with him at all, or tell him that I want his quote to include VAT and that I will pay by bank transfer?

OP posts:
Myimaginarycathasfleas · 22/09/2019 13:27

Cash payment means no tax and no paper trail. It's risky with such a big outlay, what if you aren't satisfied with his work for any reason?

Original poster
VATquestion · 22/09/2019 13:27

Though I don’t actually know if he is VAT registered or not. Seems late to ask now and he could lie?

Anyway, not use at all or ask to pay VAT?

Then if his quote is too high I will just use someone else.

Hoping that all the people who quote don’t all pull the same stunt!

OP posts:
666onmyhead · 22/09/2019 13:28

Don't go with him! He's well dodgy.

Elieza · 22/09/2019 13:28

He seems great. Yeah, how many boyfriends have we had that seemed great and then we saw them for what they really were.

In this case however when you see him for what he really is, its not a crap bf, it’s you being left with an improperly fitted kitchen, no invoice and no comeback.

You complain that the sink is leaking and the door fell off. He says he’ll come back and fix it. Meanwhile the leak gets worse and you have to call a plumber at your expense. The guy never comes back. A year later the kitchen is falling to bits and you’re six grand in debt for it with no comeback.

Or you pay the full whack and if anything bad happens you contact trading standards or take hm to the small claims court. You need an invoice with an address on it for the company to do this btw.

Homers are fine if you don’t mind breaking the law a little bit and if it’s a small thing but thousands of pounds worth of kitchen is a different ball game.

Up to you how confident you feel about his ability to do what he promises. If you have ten friends who he did kitchens for and they are all delighted fine. If you only know say one or no previous customers how do you know he can live up to all he claims....

MrsMaiselsMuff · 22/09/2019 13:30

Are you comfortable with tax evasion? That's what it comes down to.

Original poster
VATquestion · 22/09/2019 13:34

Okay well I have texted him to say that I would like his quote to include VAT, and that I want to be invoiced and pay by bank transfer. Whether he now disappears I don’t know, but it doesn’t matter, I will find someone else.

It’s the first time I have done something like this on my own, or as big as this, and it’s a learning curve.

OP posts:
FunkySnidge · 22/09/2019 13:38

If he is willing to cut corners and take illegal routes, this attitude will come through in his work too. So he isn't as great as you think.
Find someone who isn't vat registered to do the job if you want to save 20%

Original poster
VATquestion · 22/09/2019 13:51

Find someone who isn't vat registered to do the job if you want to save 20%

Should I ask this in future when contacting people, also just be up front and say I want all paperwork. It would save a lot of time.

OP posts:
LizzieMacQueen · 22/09/2019 13:56

you can't avoid the VAT the kitchen retailer will add so what you'd save by paying cash is the VAT on his labour and materials which, depending on your spend, could be quite a small amount.

Personally I wouldn't use him now even if he does come with a VAT included quote.

Original poster
VATquestion · 22/09/2019 14:01

No I know I can’t avoid it now - I will see what his quote is like and go from there.

I am just wondering if I should be upfront now with the other people who are coming to quote, and should I ask them if they also offer a guarantee on their work?

OP posts:
Her0utdoors · 22/09/2019 14:06

If he provides you with a VAT number, the HMRC have a help line you can ring to check it's valid, Google is your friend here.

user1497207191 · 22/09/2019 14:07

Personally, I'd never give work to a dishonest tradesperson happy to not charge VAT for cash. It's illegal tax evasion - basically the black economy. It's the black economy that's the largest component of the overall "tax gap", i..e the billions lost in unpaid tax - far more than the loss derived from Amazon, Starbucks, etc. I pay full tax on all my income, so I'm not going to be a party to someone else not paying tax on their income.