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Do I need to phone social work

38 replies

Csmxx · 10/09/2019 10:34

So I have a friend, who has a daughter. Her daughter is very quiet (shes nearly 2), doesn't like being away from mum, timid and the opposite of my daughter really. But I put this down to every child being different.

I recently went to their house. The house was an absolute mess. I'm talking not seeing the floors, dirty nappies everywhere, about 6 bags of dirty washing, dirty plates stacked in the kitchen. It's really bad.

She has been given in trouble for the state of her house, so asked if we would help her tidy it. So we started in the kitchen. Mouldy plates and what not. We absolutely gutted the kitchen and utility room until it was sparkling. Got some washing done and it was great. Her partner was playing with a live BB gun rifle. He was showing the kids it. Obviously I was thinking it was a toy. Well one of the kids got hold of a smaller pistol and the partner started shouting and chasing the little one. Apparently they had grabbed one that could fire or something (I have no idea about guns). But common sense would dictate you dont play with guns (bb or not) with young children in the house.

This might sound irrelevant but please remember this. The little one started crying and rubbing her eyes. Time for a nap... well dad went to put her for a nap, mum was adamant this wasnt happening. Apparently her 20 month old doesn't get to nap because she must go to bed at 6.30pm. Very suspicious but we will get to that bit.

The next room we wanted to do was her daughters room. Obviously this being priority because no girl should have a room they cant use.

Well my friend was pretty insistent on doing the living room but we did our own thing. The girls room was a disaster. Bags and bags of clothes that dont fit, there was cat mess under some bags, lots of mums stuff in the room. None of the wee ones toys it was just like another cupboard. We tidied it all up and had it looking amazing. I'm so glad we did it, the little girl was mesmerised and kept walking in circles with a smile. Shes still in a cot, because they dont have a stair gate to keep her in her room (flight of stairs are right outside her bedroom).

We went on to the bathroom. Used sanitary towels in the sink (reusable ones) blood everywhere and it was quite dirty the toilet etc. So again we cleaned this and went on to the bedroom.

I'll not bore you with a description of the bedroom as this poses no hazard to the toddler but it was pretty bad.

Now it hits 6.30pm. Little one was absolutely not for sleeping. Quite awake and upset. Mum starts making noises about us leaving because little one is upset. We said we would just finish the room we were in and leave.

So we left with only the living room to tidy. We were going to go back tomorrow. My own daughter seemed very hungry which was odd because she had tea with my friends daughter. Turns out they were given a couple of Turkey dinosaurs for tea.

This got me thinking. I haven't seen her daughter get a home cooked meal. Lots of chip shop take aways, oven food and microchips. We made her homemade spaghetti and she didnt even look at it.

We didnt have room in the car for our pram so asked if we could pop back in 5 minutes to pick it up. She said she would leave it outside so we didnt come back in??

Anyway, we get a message that night. It's the boyfriend. He had gone through my friends phone and she had been messaging men online asking for them to come to the house whilst her daughter slept and her partner was at work to have sex. She wanted her daughter in bed at 6.30 so she could have men over. She had us tidy her house for her...not for her little girl but because she didnt want these men to know she lived like an animal.

Now I dont want to do anything until I'm sure I'm not just a bit annoyed. But her daughter doesn't seem to be her priority. The house is both dirty and chaotic. Guns in kids reach, just an absolute disaster. Do I tell someone like a social worker? I'm really stressed because this friend was a very close friend. I know she must love her child but its really worrying that she seems to be more concerned for herself and the little one doesn't come first.

I dont think the little girl is on immediate danger but it's like the house is an accident waiting ro happen and I feel my friend is not willing to keep up with housework and looking after her daughter. I think because I have a daughter a similar age I'm horrified at the way shes living with hers and I dont want her daughter to be unhappy.

OP posts:
RHTawneyonabus · 10/09/2019 12:15

Obviously report. It makes me so mad that expectations of fathers are so low. Why would you believe anything he said. Why is he allowing guns in reach of kids, not keeping the house clean or cooking proper meals? Why is shit-stirring instead of removing a little girl from a dangerous situation?

Nottrueatall · 10/09/2019 12:21

I really do think you need to refer her to SS for the sake of her DC. They will want to help her make changes to improve their life.
My reasons for having this opinion are based on my own experiences with a similar situation.

Years ago, I worked for a charity that helped families with children who we going through difficult times. One family I helped also had this issue.

I was shocked at my first visit as there wasn't a single surface clear of mess/rubbish. There was nowhere to even sit down and the potty was left on the floor (almost overflowing), with the dirty toilet paper strewn around the room, along with dirty nappies from the younger DC, food, wrappers, plates, cutlery, dirty clothes, etc, etc.

The DCs' room was a mattress on the floor, and a cot; the room was filthy and the dirty nappies were just thrown everywhere (must have been several months worth of nappies). Her excuse was that they didn't have a bin upstairs.

My role was to be a listening ear, and to motivate her and support her to make changes to improve their quality of life.

After discussing how to help her, etc, I helped her to make charts, etc, to encourage her to organize her time, and to focus on one or 2 tasks per day, so she didn't feel overwhelmed, and would have more chance of it becoming a long term change.

We would also talk through any problems she was having, and how she was feeling, and if needed/where appropriate I'd signpost her or offer solutions, or just listen.

I suggested putting a carrier bag on the DCs' bedroom door, as she didn't have the money to buy a bin.
This way she could just chuck the nappies in there during the night, and then bring it down every morning to go straight into the kitchen bin, etc.

Originally, I helped her to tidy the whole house in the hope that she wouldn't then be so overwhelmed, as this is what she said she was most struggling with, and would be able to keep on top of it by implementing this new routine.

Suffice to say, it didn't work longterm. She had no interest in keeping it up, even though her DC were obviously happier and safer in the cleaner/tidier house.

It boiled down to the fact that it was easier to let the mess pile up, and in her own words she didn't want to "waste her time cleaning when it wasn't just her making the mess" (both children were under 5 and she was the only adult living there!).

Even though she knew social services were involved, and this had been set up by them in the hope further steps wouldn't need to be taken, she just couldn't sustain the changes.

It was an unsafe environment for me to be in, according to my supervisor, I think just due to the mess and it being very unhygienic with bodily fluids just 'lying' around.
I had disposable gloves, etc, to wear whilst I was there, and helping to clean, etc.
I wasn't really worried about that though, I just felt sorry for them and wanted to help.

After the first visit, in which I stood up the whole time, I took something with me that I could put on a chair if I needed to sit down. I kept it in a washable bag, which I'd leave in the car and I'd wash it all as soon as I got home and then keep it for next time in the clean bag.

I spent over 9 months trying to support her to make changes and improve their life, but I eventually had to admit defeat, and she was referred back to SS, with our 'reports'/paperwork.

[She was aware that this would happen if we felt we weren't making any progress].

Ultimately, by involving SS you'll be ensuring the DC are safe, and you'll be giving her a chance to make changes and improve their lives with professional support.

I realise it's not an easy decision to make though, but it is the right one. Flowers

Csmxx · 10/09/2019 12:23

@RHTawneyonabus the father is actually not her biological father so cant remove the child. I personally dont like the man so I definitely dont condone anything he does, everytime we tidied a room he would come in and trash it, he works so thinks he I'd above housework and cooking etc

OP posts:

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Nottrueatall · 10/09/2019 12:30

*when I say 'worked for a charity', I meant as a volunteer.

Raphael34 · 10/09/2019 12:37

The issue with withholding information to stop yourself getting identified is that you may not be giving ss enough reason to act. Plus they can’t investigate things they’re not aware of. If you take out details of specific things you’ve witnessed like the guns, the strange men, the sleep deprivation and the depths of the squalor then all you’re left with is ‘my friends house is messy’. For them to investigate the guns/sex sessions then someone needs to tell them about it. This little girl is at risk from literally serious injury, sexual assault, even death if she gets shot by one of those guns or one of mums internet men turns out to be a psychopath. You need to decide what’s more important to you, your friendship or this little girls life

OwnerofanAngryCat · 10/09/2019 13:15

I quite like "slay teen' it's like, young persons slang for hot.
'Hey Ellie your bf is slay'.
Regarding the sex working, just because someone tells you something, doesn't mean it is true.

ElizaDee · 10/09/2019 13:25

You got a lot done in one day if it was all as bad as you say.

Csmxx · 10/09/2019 13:48

@ElizaDee there was 5 of us doing it, and we had a sitter for kids :) I wish I was exaggerating but my daughters feet were black from just walking around the house. What's worse is a few months previous we did a little tidy up of one room, came back and it was worse than before 🤦‍♀️

OP posts:
BarbedBloom · 10/09/2019 13:56

The little girl is at risk of death or sexual abuse. You need to report all of this, not just the messy house. If you lose her as a friend, so be it. Some things are more important.

squeakybike · 10/09/2019 13:59

If you speak to social you can ask to remain anonymous. Someone did this to me a couple of months back, it was a vicious referral but I got a phone call from social the next day. They said the caller was anonymous and had no idea who they were.

That being said... I have a friend who was in a similar position. Her house is absolutely disgusting. Her partner is a complete prick. She had social involved previously and somehow they thought it was a good idea to close the case. There are a lot more issues involved. I tried to help her as much as I could, but I've recently cut off contact and had to back away from it. I've lost a friend, but I just couldn't be involved in that. Her family knew what was going on, so I didn't make any referrals. That, and I have no faith in social services.

user1573624 · 10/09/2019 14:38

From your writing style you seem educated and level headed, and I can't fathom how you have a friendship with someone so chaotic and living in squalor. You must be a very kind friend to help out like this, keeping your thoughts to yourself at the time and keep powering through that day. What was her reaction? Was she mortified? Apologetic? Thankful? At first I assumed her reaction to try and get you to leave was for that reason.

Have you considered the men calling could be paid sex work? She may feel it is the only way to pay the bills, in which chase, she needs financial support too.

I am quite a messy person and at one point in my life a long time ago I will admit I lived in squalor, thankfullt I have for my shit together now more or less. For that reason I feel like I can be quite unjudgemental about mess. I have an even messier friend I have helped out with a few times before now whenever she is due a house inspection from her Landlord. But the stark difference is the animal faeces. Myself or friend have never been that bad. I believe the animal mess is a big red flag for SS involvement for messy houses so I really do think that needs reported. The other overwhelming difference is the food neglect and the unsafe environment that is more than just laundry/dirty dishes. Nappies and BB guns and shit food is unacceptable. This is more than a messy house. Way more. Why would you want to maintain this friendship?

You could always call round and if you find the house back to square 1, confront her. Tell her it is unsafe and you need to report it. Then you aren't going behind her back. It sounds like she has had plenty of chances.

giggleshizz · 10/09/2019 14:41

Is the biological father aware of the situation? Does he have contact? What about parents family?

Honestly the best thing you can do for this child is refer to SS.

Flowers for courage

IrisAtwood · 10/09/2019 15:06

I can't fathom how you have a friendship with someone so chaotic and living in squalor

What a horrible attitude.

People can end up in this state for many different reasons and the last they need is prejudice and being judged as not worthy of friendships.

OP, you must report the issues to Social Services.

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